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Author	Topic: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
Havac Title: Lit Mod of War Registered: Sep '05	Date Posted: 2/25/08 10:10pm Subject: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers) - Date Edited: 2/25/08 10:11pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Havac
	LOTF continues -- we're only one book from the finale! Meanwhile, things are . . . brought out into public. You might even say . . . revealed. Some rules: rate Revelation on a scale of 1 to 10, supplementing your rating with a review, if you want to (It's not necessary but is highly encouraged). However, please do not rate or review the book until after you've read the whole thing. Thanks. Go for it. Some previous review threads: Republic Commando: Hard Contact, by Karen Traviss Shatterpoint, by Matthew Stover The Cestus Deception, by Steven Barnes Medstar I: Battle Surgeons, by Michael Reaves and Steve Perry Medstar II: Jedi Healer, by Michael Reaves and Steve Perry Jedi Trial, by David Sherman and Dan Cragg Yoda: Dark Rendezvous, by Sean Stewart Labyrinth of Evil, by James Luceno Revenge of the Sith, by Matthew Stover Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader by James Luceno Galaxies: The Ruins of Dantooine, by Veronica Whitney-Robinson Tatooine Ghost, by Troy Denning Survivor's Quest, by Timothy Zahn Enemy Lines I: Rebel Dream, by Aaron Allston Enemy Lines II: Rebel Stand, by Aaron Allston Traitor, by Matthew Stover Destiny's Way, by Walter Jon Williams Force Heretic I: Remnant, by Sean Williams and Shane Dix Force Heretic II: Refugee, by Sean Williams and Shane Dix Force Heretic III: Reunion, by Sean Williams and Shane Dix The Final Prophecy, by Greg Keyes The Unifying Force, by James Luceno Dark Nest I: The Joiner King, by Troy Denning Dark Nest II: The Unseen Queen, by Troy Denning Dark Nest III: The Swarm War, by Troy Denning Outbound Flight, by Timothy Zahn Republic Commando: Triple Zero, by Karen Traviss Legacy of the Force: Betrayal, by Aaron Allston Legacy of the Force: Bloodlines, by Karen Traviss Darth Bane: Path of Destruction, by Drew Karpyshyn Legacy of the Force: Tempest, by Troy Denning Allegiance, by Timothy Zahn Legacy of the Force: Exile, by Aaron Allston Legacy of the Force: Sacrifice, by Karen Traviss Legacy of the Force: Inferno, by Troy Denning Death Star, by Michael Reaves and Steven Perry Republic Commando: True Colors, by Karen Traviss Legacy of the Force: Fury, by Aaron Allston Darth Bane: Rule of Two, by Drew Karpyshyn -----signature----- "Is there a captain's hat involved in this?" "I . . . don't know what department I want. I need . . . pants."
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Robimus Registered: Jul '07	Date Posted: 2/25/08 11:09pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers) - Date Edited: 2/25/08 11:14pm (2 edits total) Edited By: Robimus
	Legacy of the Force:Revalation The title definitely has a ring to it, I wonder what the Revalation was to be? I have enjoyed all of Karen Traviss's books thus far and this one was no different, though I did not find it quite as brilliant as her past work. The first thing that really lept off the page at me was the way the term Sith is used by a number of different characters in relation to Jacen Solo. Now I really don't know who is to blame for this but the reveal of Jacen's Sithdom to the galaxy should have been a bigger deal, a Revalation if you will. Luke and the gang of course know what a bad guy Jacen has become but I think the Revalation that he was following the exact path of his grandfather should have been a much bigger deal, not a skipped moment of plot. Gilad Pellaeon's story arc in this book was great, from his time on Bastion with Reige to his endless quotes and solid loyalty to what he believes is right. "Jacen Solo is the chaos, not the cure", "I will not lend the Empire to a petty despot", and "Go rot somewhere else villip" were just a few of his lines that I really enjoyed. . Revalation also really expands on the Remnant, with new Moff's, confirmation of new(or old) Imperial worlds like Phaeda. The story also fleshes out that Gilad did have a son and possibly has another, which I quite enjoyed. I found he possibly spent a bit too much time admiring women but otherwise very much enjoyed his portions of the novel. Now as for Jaina traveling to learn from the great master Boba Fett, I found this a bit less solid. The whole give in to your anger cause its not really anger idea smelled a bit too much like pretending the darkside doesn't exist, circa New Jedi Order. Didn't like it. Cold blooded killers shouldn't be flying into a blind rage to increase their combat skills, really I'd imagine it would hamper them. Beskar Plate Armor is the single worst idea maybe since the Jedi roaches in Planet of Twilight. I know things like Cortiss alloy have existed in the EU for a long time, but the idea of Mando's wearing invincible armor was just poor. Basicly a handful of Mando's destroyed a mass of Imperial Troopers without a single casualty cause everything bounces off their fancy armor. Not exciting at all. The Mando's came across as far too Invincible for my liking. Even Caedus seemed no match for them, when really he just needed to take a second to snap Carid's neck with the force, instead of creating illusions. Was one Mando death too much to ask for? I think not. Now I did love the Gotab/Jusik sections of the book, particularly the end meeting with Jaina. Confirming, in book, that he survived the purge was a lot of fun, even if I don't agree with the steps he took. Getting his and Venku's back story might make Order 66 a bit less dramatic, but I still have the fates of plenty of characters to worry about from that series. It's nice to know that Jusik survived and Venku carried on the Legacy his mother wanted for him, even if he isn't the only one...... The Battle of Fondor was excellently played out, building over 100 pages to its conclusion. Niathal really stepped up as a character and of course I feel like Traviss is the only one who writes Darth Caedus correctly. Its great getting into Caedus's head, he's much more believable in her novels. Pellaeon's death was beautifully written, if sad for me. The last holdover from Heir to the Empire has been taken from us. I was shocked but not disappointed by his death. The only part I found really upset me was the fact that he was to be layed to rest on Corellia instead of Bastion, cause Victor Reige said he'd like it that way. The Pellaeon I know was Imperial to the core, and would have remained so after death. Having his ashes spread over the Pellaeon Gardens would have been a much more symbolic end for him, and tie into the Legacy comic series beautifully. Alas, it ain't happen'in. Luke and Ben's scenes were heart wrenching and really showed off Traviss's greatest strength as a writer, her ability to handle complex, emotional scenes. I found the Fett, Sintas, Mirta dynamic touching as well. Not so much as the Luke/Ben scenes though as we see most of the emotion through Fett's cold eyes......And what was with the odd Fett/Daala relationship angle? Too many weird possibilities there to even think about now Lastly, I hope Mr. Denning brings this series to a fitting conclusion. I want the loose ends all tied up even if it takes 800 pages to do it 6.8/10 -----signature----- I am forever seeking the damutek of Hooley Krekk Oh, woe! Oh, misery! Oh, unhappiness. Hooley Krekk where are you? . http://www.cccomiccon.com http://www.actionfigurenews.ca
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Havac Title: Lit Mod of War Registered: Sep '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 2:25pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	Great descending-into-madness-yet-you-actually-understand-his-thought-process Jacen? Check. Great pragmatic, investigating Ben? Check. Luke striking a balance between grief and asskicking? Check. Jaina figuring some stuff out and getting set to become the IWOD? Check. Boba Fett coming into the main plot and remaining a nasty bastard? Check. Gilad Pellaeon, despite some minor issues, being a badass and going out in reasonable style? Check. Niathal splitting with Jacen and setting up a new position for the final book? Check. Jag actually appearing and Jaina/Jag being treated as a given? Check. Imperials ready for Soontir Fel to come in and kick some Moff ass? Check. Overall, I found it a good read which put everything in place for the conclusion. It's generally good. A few points nagged at me and some decisions I questioned (did Carid really have to have a shot on Jacen? Come on, you're just handing ammo to your critics), but overall I enjoyed it. Also, this easily felt like the most integrated of the Traviss books, which is always good. 8.25/10 -----signature----- "Is there a captain's hat involved in this?" "I . . . don't know what department I want. I need . . . pants."
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Havac Title: Lit Mod of War Registered: Sep '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 2:26pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	Average score: 15.05/2 = 7.53 -----signature----- "Is there a captain's hat involved in this?" "I . . . don't know what department I want. I need . . . pants."
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AnnLouise Registered: Jul '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 2:41pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	Maybe a 6. Instead of a buildup to the finale, it's just more of The Glorious Heroics of Boba Fett I can't help but feel that Fett is traininng Jaina not to have her as prepared as possible, but to shoehorn even more Fett/Mando into the LOTF storyline. If this was a story of the Skywalker family, why not have Jaina with Luke and Ben, or her parents? As a casual reader of SW fiction, I was disappointed that they've been scattered about for so many books. -----signature----- http://outerrimsieges.com We're a fun group http://thehungersite.com http://www.endabuse.org http://www.librarything.com Catalog Your Books Online Violence Against Women Is Always Wrong
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patchworkz7 Registered: Mar '04	Date Posted: 2/26/08 4:47pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	AnnLouise posted: Maybe a 6. Instead of a buildup to the finale, it's just more of The Glorious Heroics of Boba Fett I can't help but feel that Fett is traininng Jaina not to have her as prepared as possible, but to shoehorn even more Fett/Mando into the LOTF storyline. If this was a story of the Skywalker family, why not have Jaina with Luke and Ben, or her parents? As a casual reader of SW fiction, I was disappointed that they've been scattered about for so many books. Wait...didn't you just say that you hadn't read it and had no intention of buying it in the Spoiler thread? If you did read it, fair play, but if people are just chucking in numbers having not read it the book, it sort of makes a review thread pointless. If you did read it, I apologize, but that doesn't jibe with what was said in the Spoiler thread. "I've usually picked up the MM in this series the first day of release. After looking through this one, I changed my mind. As much as it pains me to say this, I'll wait for Revelation to show up at Half Price. Why would I choose to not help my store's business?" So, basically, you flipped through the book? -----signature----- Original Fiction & essays "Does God Limp?" in HOUSE UNAUTHORIZED http://www.smartpopbooks.com/allbooks/2007.html#house Now in German and Polish Editions! James A Gilmer
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AdmiralNick22 Registered: May '03	Date Posted: 2/26/08 5:30pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	The book was a good read, with a fast plot and effectively set up Invincible. The main things I liked were: 1. Admiral Cha Niathal's becoming a very complex and in depth character. She continues to grow on me, which says alot since I disliked her immensly in the early LOTF books. 2. Alliance government-in-exile. I would not be at all suprised to see Darklighter, Celchu, Wedge, Bwua'tu, and some GA worlds/senators rushing to Fondor to side with Niathal. We finally have the "break" between the traditional Alliance and Jacen's twisted perversion of it. 3. Gilad Pellaeon. He simply rocked. RIP, old soldier. Ackbar is waiting for you in heaven. 4. Battle of Fondor- one of the best battles in LOTF. Daala's suprise arrival was perfect, though I was a bit disappointed by her special weapons. I would of rather she came in with a larger force of old ships. The continuity errors were minor. Calling Borleias a banking world, the statement about "first Imperial Moff", etc. Nothing huge, which is a good thing. Overall, I give the book a 7. --Adm. Nick -----signature----- Fleet Junkie Founding Father Official Greatest Admiral Ackbar Fan "A peaceful Galactic Alliance is the strongest pillar of a peaceful galaxy." - Luke Skywalker "I will surrender, Admiral, when I can no longer fight!" - Admiral Gar Stazi A New Hope
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Havac Title: Lit Mod of War Registered: Sep '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 5:32pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	AdmiralNick22 posted: Gilad Pellaeon. He simply rocked. RIP, old soldier. Ackbar is waiting for you in heaven. It's a trap! -----signature----- "Is there a captain's hat involved in this?" "I . . . don't know what department I want. I need . . . pants."
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JaySkywalker01 Registered: Oct '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 5:35pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	6.5 I honestly felt this book was really draggy in certain places. I enjoyed the Mando scenes and the C.S.I.: Coruscant scenes (aka Ben). I found the Jacen, Palleon and even a lot of the battle scenes to be a bit...well, boring. I also don't like the idea of the invincible Mandalorians. I enjoyed the scenes with them, but I feel like a lot of the ideas behind their culture and personalities have been beaten like a dead horse. So, it was good, but not anywhere near on the same level as Inferno or Fury. -----signature----- Jay: "Ben Franklin said, speak softly and carry a big stick!" Carnage: Uhm, Ben Franklin was more like "Speak Loud, Get Wasted, and use his "Stick" on French Women." Oh yeah....
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Havac Title: Lit Mod of War Registered: Sep '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 5:40pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	Average score: 28.55/4 = 7.14 -----signature----- "Is there a captain's hat involved in this?" "I . . . don't know what department I want. I need . . . pants."
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BaneOfTheSith Registered: May '07	Date Posted: 2/26/08 6:42pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	Havac posted: AdmiralNick22 posted: Gilad Pellaeon. He simply rocked. RIP, old soldier. Ackbar is waiting for you in heaven. It's a trap! i can see them playing chess against each other (although i don't really know what serves for chess in SW). i got something in my eye.... -----signature----- "What you feel is the Force. This is the shameful secret of the Jedi: There is no dark side." - Vergere "The shroud of the Dark Side has fallen." - Yoda "Do you require a reminder of what it means to defy the Empire?" - Thrawn
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AnnLouise Registered: Jul '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 7:44pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers) - Date Edited: 2/26/08 8:06pm (3 edits total) Edited By: AnnLouise
	patchworkz7 posted: AnnLouise posted: Maybe a 6. Instead of a buildup to the finale, it's just more of The Glorious Heroics of Boba Fett I can't help but feel that Fett is traininng Jaina not to have her as prepared as possible, but to shoehorn even more Fett/Mando into the LOTF storyline. If this was a story of the Skywalker family, why not have Jaina with Luke and Ben, or her parents? As a casual reader of SW fiction, I was disappointed that they've been scattered about for so many books. Wait...didn't you just say that you hadn't read it and had no intention of buying it in the Spoiler thread? If you did read it, fair play, but if people are just chucking in numbers having not read it the book, it sort of makes a review thread pointless. If you did read it, I apologize, but that doesn't jibe with what was said in the Spoiler thread. "I've usually picked up the MM in this series the first day of release. After looking through this one, I changed my mind. As much as it pains me to say this, I'll wait for Revelation to show up at Half Price. Why would I choose to not help my store's business?" So, basically, you flipped through the book? I started reading each chapter, and - it's not really speed reading, but skimming down each page, and also reading through whole chapters, then going back and rereading some of the skimmed stuff. I didn't comment on it before today, because I was reading it before the actual release date. So no, I wasn't just picking it up today and deciding not to buy it because of what I just read today on my lunch break. I'd been tossing around the buy/not buy decision since we got it in last week. . When Sacrifice comes out in MM (checked it out, read it, liked it), I'll be getting that on the first day of sales. Someone who was asking about it last week was surprised that it was ending with one more book. He remarked that was nowhere near like the NJO; since I haven't read much of that, I'm not sure if he was referring to quality or quantity. -----signature----- http://outerrimsieges.com We're a fun group http://thehungersite.com http://www.endabuse.org http://www.librarything.com Catalog Your Books Online Violence Against Women Is Always Wrong
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KisuraTheGreat Registered: Feb '08	Date Posted: 2/26/08 9:09pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers) - Date Edited: 2/26/08 10:02pm (1 edits total) Edited By: KisuraTheGreat
	Read it last night (found it early--yay!), and spent the day trying to decide what I thought of it. The things that struck me-- 1. Cha Niathal. I haven't particularly liked the admiral until now, but I had largely dismissed her. This story gave her something to do, and really allowed us to get to know her. I've become a fan. 2. Jacen's insanity. While Allston had me chilled by the increasingly EVIL Jason in Fury, the moments of bittersweet humanity and even gentle humor juxtaposed with actual atrocity managed to give me goosebumps. This was excellent work on Karen Traviss' part. 3. The humanity of the book as a whole. Since the NJO, it's frequently felt like a SW book was a roller coaster ride--hang on and get through the story, occasionally getting a fleeting glance at the world and the people around you before careening off again. This book was a little more people-focused, a little quieter. I would not like it to become a trend. . . but it was refreshing as an incidence. 4. Jedi Mind Tricks. Ships? Attacking fleets? A Jedi sees not these things. But one whiny little overgrown Sith sure can! One of only three times when I have been impressed by Luke Skywalker. 5. NABOO, NABOO, NABOO, NABOO BLOODY NABOO. Theed horseshoes, ancient naval warfare, Naboo timeshares, ad nauseum. Please, please please--let us permanently veto any quirky little plot points that invoke arcane beliefs, recreational activities, or "galactic" myths from the planets of Naboo, Tatooine, or Corellia UNLESS IT IS REMOTELY BELIEVABLE THAT THE GALAXY AT LARGE WOULD HAVE ACCESS TO THESE LITTLE LOCAL NICETIES! 6. I have to agree with other commenters here--in many ways the Karen Traviss books have been the Legacy of the Mandalores, with a galactic news feed or two thrown in to arc from Allston to Denning. If I was a fan of the armored ones, I would love it, but they honestly don't appeal to me and I find myself truly not caring. Legacy of the Pilots, now. . . that would be a story. . . 7. A very small, but noticeable thing--this book seemed to have a more obviously British cant to the language than I remembered in Bloodlines or Sacrifice. I approve in many instances--Coruscant, Bastion, and even the Mandalorean environments have excellent reasons for a different rhythm and diction (lads), and it only makes sense that it would be spread throughout the galaxy, but it seemed jarring at times, and misplaced to my (admittedly American) ear. 8. I felt a disconnection to the events that ended Fury--we heard nothing from Tenel Ka, Wedge, or Tycho, all of whom had dangling storylines. I have great faith, and am looking forward to Troy Denning bringing them to a conclusion, but I'll admit that I was hoping for a mention, a cameo. . . even an aside, to tide me over until then, though. 9. Daala. Meh. I wish I had a stronger reaction. I should have had a stronger reaction to one of the Shocking Plot Twists of the book, but it just felt. . . tired. Except for her bit about killing the Moffs. That made me laugh. An (of all things) amiable read with some excellent bits of humor, but in whole, it felt more like a filler book, a fourth or a sixth, rather than the nail-biting, tighten-the-tension-just-one-more-notch next to last I was hoping to devour. A 5 overall (with a few parts that just really require a 7). -----signature----- Well, that was certainly a tactical error on their part.
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patchworkz7 Registered: Mar '04	Date Posted: 2/26/08 9:30pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	AnnLouise posted: I started reading each chapter, and - it's not really speed reading, but skimming down each page, and also reading through whole chapters, then going back and rereading some of the skimmed stuff. I didn't comment on it before today, because I was reading it before the actual release date. So no, I wasn't just picking it up today and deciding not to buy it because of what I just read today on my lunch break. I'd been tossing around the buy/not buy decision since we got it in last week. . Ahhh, sorry, makes more sense now. I hadn't caught the reading vs buying part. I used to think my dream job would be working in a book store until I helped a used bookstore owner out and worked part-time for a bit, and then heard the horror stories from people who worked in the chain stores -----signature----- Original Fiction & essays "Does God Limp?" in HOUSE UNAUTHORIZED http://www.smartpopbooks.com/allbooks/2007.html#house Now in German and Polish Editions! James A Gilmer
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Havac Title: Lit Mod of War Registered: Sep '05	Date Posted: 2/26/08 9:55pm Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	Average score: 33.55/5 = 6.71 -----signature----- "Is there a captain's hat involved in this?" "I . . . don't know what department I want. I need . . . pants."
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JadedSkycrawler Registered: Jul '02	Date Posted: 2/27/08 12:25am Subject: RE: The JC Lit Reviews Special: LEGACY OF THE FORCE: REVELATION (Spoilers)
	I give it a 9 out of 10, I absolutely loved it! Very intense, emotional, touching- very well written all around. The Luke/Ben scenes were sweet and wonderful! Also, I'm very excited to report that I really enjoyed Jaina's characterization in this book, which hasn't really happened awhile. And while Jacen comes off as being more arrogant than ever! ("Technically it's my lord, but sir is fine on duty". lol, I still found him fascinating. However, I would have loved to have seen more Han and Leia- hence the docked point. -----signature----- "All the darkness in the world cannot extinguish the light of a single candle." -Francis of Assisi
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