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Topic:
What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Tion_Meddon
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 5:39pm
Subject:
What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
- Date Edited:
5/25/05 5:40pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Tion_Meddon
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What was the point?
Lucas repeatedly said the saga was about the fall of a good man to evil, but redeemed by his children. Sure, with Luke. But he says children, or sometimes offsrping. Leia never helped.
It wasn't revealed until ROTJ, so there were no brother-sister moments, since they were separted and didn't know it, and they didn't grow up together. It makes us all cringe whenever we see them kiss in ANH(brdge), or TESB. Or Luke going on about how beautiful she is, and wanting her as his girlfriend, in ANH.
It only accompished a few things but in a confusing or unnecessary way:
1.) "There is another."
-So we now know who Yoda meant.
-BUT wasn't she being tortured at the hands of her father? Couldn't he have discovered her? What if she died? And shouldn't Obi-wan have remembered that Luke has a twin? And how could Leia be trained, since Luke would be dead/evil, there is no chance that she crash lands on Dagobah, and she can't see Force Ghosts?
2.) End of love triangle.
-Now Han can have Leia, and Luke no longer "wants" her, for obvious reasons
-It could have been done without this, it was obvious Leia never loved Luke, and Luke and Leia (thank God) never had much of a romance anyways.
3.) Luke's temptation.
-It was the thing that nearly pushed Luke to the darkside, to protect his sister from from his father.
-But Luke doesn't go to the darkside, and only comes close for a dramatic scene and a way to defeat Vader. And Vader could have just reminded Luke that his friends would die, unless he joined them. Or Vader could tell them that his friends were captured, includng General Solo and Commander Organa (which they were at one point) and are awaiting their word to be executed, or something. It could have been done another way, without having to create another family twist for us.
So, should Leia be a Skywalker? What does it achieve?
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Agent_SkywalKer
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 5:49pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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I was thinking about this topic too....
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GrandAdmiralJeff
Registered:
Jan '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 6:24pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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wow good question, i think that it is a good thing that she is the sister of luke but i dont know why. :/
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tephjo
Registered:
Mar '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 7:23pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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I wonderd that BEFORE the PT, but now i see that it has nothing to do with being an uber bad-ass jedi, and every thing to do with being the spit fire political fighter that Padme was. 
-----signature-----
Original Rotten Tomatoe Critic Ratings of Original Trilogy
ANH: about 85 % positive, I forgot the exact number
TESB: 62 % positive, same as TPM
ROTJ: 34 % positive
Empire is tied with TPM?
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All_Powerful_Jedi
Registered:
Sep '03
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 7:24pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
- Date Edited:
5/25/05 7:27pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
All_Powerful_Jedi
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Simply put, it's an easy way to make you think Luke is expendable. If you throw out the idea that Luke CAN die and maintain hope that things can move forward, it sets up Luke's confrontation with a realistic possibility for death.
If you're watching straight through, when Anakin fails in ROTS, you are given both Luke and Leia. In the narrative, it is demonstrated that even Anakin is expendable and that his children can move forward with bringing balance. Lucas sets you up, in the OT, with now 3 people who can do things, so if the Emperor killed both Anakin and Luke, then you're still left with Leia. There's realistic tension that way.
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SlideAway
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 7:53pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Easy. Because Leia was never meant to be Luke's sister until near the last minute.
Luke WAS supposed to have a sister, which is who Yoda alluded to in ESB. But it wasn't supposed to be Leia, even that late in the game.
Gary Kurtz (ANH and ESB producer) has talked extensively about this. This was one of the major reasons Kurtz and Lucas had a falling-out.
Essentially, the evolution of the Star Wars universe was such that Lucas had a bunch of possible storylines and concepts that surrounded his universe. He fleshed out enough for ONE film as a start and constructed it such that it could be a stand-alone film.
When it turned out to be successful, he went ahead and, with Kurtz and Lawrence Kasdan, fleshed out the story. There is evidence to suggest that Vader=Anakin was only conceived of in this phase, AFTER "A New Hope".
Together, Lucas, Kasdan, and Kurtz fleshed out the rest of Lucas' "9-part saga," focusing on Episodes V and VI. It was supposed to be such that...
Episode I would focus on Obi-Wan Kenobi's life, exposition on the history of the Jedi and the Republic.
Episode II would introduce Anakin Skywalker. Anakin's story would be told from Obi-Wan's point-of-view. Also, at this point, most of the drafts had Obi-Wan referred to as "Ben," indicating that at this stage, "Ben Kenobi" was his real name, and Obi-Wan his "Jedi" name.
Episode III would tell of Anakin's fall.
It was Empire and Jedi (Parts V and VI) that were most fleshed out. Empire was committed to the screen with virtually no changes.
Jedi, however, was radically different. Leia was NOT Luke's sister. The Emperor was not confronted. There was a Wookie-planet but no Ewoks. No second death star. Luke would confront and redeem Vader, but the Empire still lived. Han Solo was to die in a blaze of glory. Leia was to tearfully separate from Luke at the end b/c she was named Queen of the remants of her people. Luke was to fly off having proved himself and become a Jedi.
Then, in Episodes VII through IX, Luke was to grow old, find his sister, and train a new cadre of Jedis. These 3 were quite vague, but the resolution would be the final confrontation with the emperor at the of Episode IX. What was unclear was whether this confrontation would have been an old Luke v. Palpatine or someone else - perhaps Luke's sister or Luke's sister's children.
Anyway, the implication of Yoda's "there is another"-line was that Luke's sister was going to play a pivotal role with the force.
Lucas threw out that original storyline, something that enraged Kurtz b/c Kurtz felt that it squandered much of Empire, which had been written to set up a story that was never filmed.
The abandonment of this plotline also played a big role in making Episodes VII-IX unnecessary. Perhaps Lucas felt there wasn't enough material to sustain 3 films post-Jedi or perhaps he felt that without the figure of Vader, the films lacked a compelling villain figure. All of which I can sympathize wish.
Luke's sister became a problem with this, however. Ths sister was supposed to be someone who would play a pivotal role and someone we would become greatly familiar with. With the decision to cap the main thrust of the story with Episode VI, he would have had to introduce a new character if he were to make Luke's sister someone we hadn't met. So Lucas came up with the idea - VERY late in the game - to make Leia into Luke's sister.
I think it might have been possible to make Luke's sister someone else if the character were a mysterious shadowy figure who emerged in "Jedi" and played a significant role in Vader's salvation - almost as a Deus ex Machina. You know - make it so that Luke could not redeem Vader alone. It would have been difficult to pull off.
Perhaps she could have been some Queen allied with the rebels who is kidnapped by Palpatine and who plays a role in Vader's redemption by showing compassion and understanding towards him? Maybe have the revelation that she is in fact Luke's twin sister emerge only near the very end - perhaps in a mythical way. Perhaps Yoda, on his deathbed, could give Luke something his mother left him - a ring or something, that only his sister has, and he discovers the ring towards the end?(Again, I'm just brainstorming - nothing really deep here.)
Essentially, the idea of Luke's sister was one that was major early on but Leia's status as Luke's sister was sort of a vestigial thing - done b/c Lucas had to resolve his allusions to a sister.
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Dukhat
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 8:34pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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I dunno about the above. ROTJ worked out ok, it felt rushed but it tied up all the loose ends.
I don't think Han Solo going out in a blaze of glory would've been good and I dunno how a sister would've been done.
Considering Luke contacted Leia at the end of ESB, it made perfect sense for her to be Luke's sister.
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Just say no to the prequels.
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SlideAway
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 8:56pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Well, we're used to the idea now and I woudn't change it at this point.
And I think introducing such a major character so late in the game would be difficult to make work.
I'm fine withe Leia as Luke's sister. (It's a good thing they cut the passionate kiss that Luke and Leia shared towards the end of the movie).
I'm simply saying that her potential as a player in Vader's redemption is underutilized and that is b/c she wasn't intended to be Luke's sister. Everyone who worked on the movies says this to be true. It's not like the Vader/Anakin debate, where some who worked with Lucas say the idea was with him all along and others insist he only came upon the idea after ANH.
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MikeSolo
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 10:16pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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After watching Musical Journey DVD and the A Bond Unbroken Chapter. The whole being twins and helping bring down the Empire just made so much more sense to after watching RTOS. It all came together finally IMO
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A Defender Emerges: Princess Leia Organa
"Guns don't kill people. The goverment does" Dale Gribble KOTH
Some call it the OT, some call it the PT........ I call it the Star Wars Saga.
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Kakkaraun
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 10:24pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Actually, Leia being the sister didn't make eps 7-9 irrelevent, it was that when they realized they probably wouldn't be able to DO 7-9, they needed to resolve the story in 6.
And, really, George Lucas' creative process isn't that much more convoluted than a lot of other writers. People love to discuss all the weird background behind the final story, but it's basically irrelevent.
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(Kant sucks.)
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wonder_alice
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/25/05 10:38pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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I'm not confronting the original poster's opinion here. He obviously knows a lot about the original plots of OT than I do, and I believe him.
I just wanted to point out that though these two characters were never meant to be bro and sis in the first place, both have their four-letter first names start with "L". And that even after Leia confesses her love to Han in ESB, she still has a deep connection with Luke, similar to that of twins who can "feel" what the other is feeling.
Plus, with the PT and Padme's character, you understand Leia ressembles her mom more, as she is strong, firm and well involved in political affairs.
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forever an unconventional shipper...
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Chewie kicks butt.
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glasse
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/26/05 1:24am
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Has it been confirmed that the "..there is another" line is refering to Leia? That is what I always thought but a friend of mine insists that it refers to Anakin/Vader, since He is the one who kills actually kills Palpatine and in doing so and repenting of his evil destroys the sith and fulfills the prophecy.
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Buschman
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/26/05 8:08am
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Hmmm that's an interesting thought. I still think "there is another skywalker" refers to a sibling. I think they would have stated it in a different way if they were referring to a skywalker we already know. But I don't have a clue whether at the time they were referring to Leia or some other bad ass sister to be revealed in Jedi or later.
But the thing about vadar and the profacy is an interesting thought. When I was watching RotS Yoda eludded to the profacy and that either it was misread or that maybe this is what the profacy meant. I always thought they didn't really understand the profacy well. It said Vader would bring balence to the force. Well he did sort of. Before Vader the universe was full of Jedi and there were just two Sith(one for a period where Anakin killed Dooku, but hadn't yet fully gone over to the darkside). But after Vader slaughtered the Jedi, there were two on each side. Two masters and their masters.
But it could also mean that in the end Vader really did kill the emporer. That's a tough call.
Maybe this is a part of the story that Lucas never really worked out the details.
Interesting thread,
Mike
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Evil_Otto
Registered:
Sep '04
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Date Posted:
5/26/05 8:31am
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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 Take note of my posts in THIS thread!!!
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As evil as you can get!  I'm "Berzerk" about films! The once and future king Otto has lived many lives on TheForce.net
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Tion_Meddon
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
5/26/05 4:17pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
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Looks like my thread was moved from saga, to OT, no wonder why I couldn't find it at first! In response:
Well, I did know Leia originally wasn't going to be his sister. But that is all "What If" now, fact is Luke and Leia are twin siblings.
Everyone seeoms to agree with me that Leia being a Skwalker was useless, expcet for one person...
Someone said that Leia being his siter meant there was another, so Leia would be their hope even if Luke and Vader died. But look at my first post. She wouldn't crashland on Dagobah, she can't see Force-Ghosts, and Luke would be dead. So how could she be a hope? You can't train yourself in the Force, and she had no wish to or any idea that she even had the power. And in both ESB and ROTJ, when they are talking about Leia being anothe rhope, she is in major jeoprady, either captured by Vader (and he was planning on taking her away) or fighting stormtroopers on Endor (in which she did get hurt, and captured before).
Does anyone else think they know what the point of Leia being a Skywalker was?
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Wrongway
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
5/26/05 8:45pm
Subject:
RE: What was the point of Leia being a Skywalker?
- Date Edited:
5/26/05 8:47pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Wrongway
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Easy. Because Leia was never meant to be Luke's sister until near the last minute.
I agree with Dukhat
It's a good theory except for one thing. At the end of ESB when Luke is hanging underneath Cloud City he calls out to Leia, she hears him and finds him there. How else would you explain that?
She had the force with her and thats why she was able to hear him. Unless Lucas was planning on making her a Jedi in one of those later episodes that you were talking about. But not likely.
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First I think of the stupidest thing....then I go with it.
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