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Author	Topic: Official Love Story discussion thread.
anakin-player Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 10:55am Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Oh my lord I stay away from this thread for 24 hours and Anakin-Player has become a believer???? (Chair falls over, picks self off of floor, scratching head in confusion.) LOL Yes, I always liked the love story from the beginning but I thought it could have been much better. Overall, I can see how Padme is attracted to Anakin but I still believe he was still lusting over her in the beginning of the movie. I buy the whole love story angle, but I'm still going to argue over certain aspects of it. -----signature----- “If you would not be forgotten, as soon as you are dead & rotten, either write things worth reading, or do things worth the writing.” -Benjamin Franklin
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IamZam Registered: May '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 11:52am Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	I just don't think she has many people to choose from. ( I know I am gonna be killed for saying this) I won't kill you. There are probably lot of guys who might be intersted in her, but all they see is the stiff outer Amidala part. The tough politician, and they would be scared to approach her. They only see what the eyes tell them, and more often than not are proably more insterested in what she can do for them. Enter our favorite padawan who looks with his heart, not his eyes and see's something much more. And the fact that he would die for her, doesn't exactly hurt the cause either. Secondly, I remember in that 'your presence is soothing' scence, I saw Padme, and I went 'gosh she is blooming'. I think PLJ made quite a good point somewhere in this thread (i think it is this thread) that having her love coming out of her is like a rebirth to Padme. Something at this level needs not to have anything to do with the padme you talk about --- the padme who is ex-queen and senator. Don't relate the love story to THAT padme, relate it to the padme you see in ATOC. I hope I can help you there. I think of it as one of the first scenes where Padme starts taking over and Amidala starts disappearing underneath somewhere. She is dying in a sense. She is totally breatheless because she is allowing herself to enjoy a rather breath-taking and spectacular view. Instead of controlling her emotions, she (being totally out of his view) is allowing her emotions to come forward. From this point on forward, (actually Amidala started dying as soon as Anakin came back, but the real death throws begin in the fireplace scene, as that is where the real Padme started showing no matter how much Amidala wanted to deny it). We see more and more Padme at the lead as the Amidala part of her "dies a little bit each day". To put it in simple terms I see her as two personalitis, Amidala the steely unemotional politician and public persona, and Padme the real feeling woman who is totally happy and at home when she is on Naboo and when she is with Anakin and using her heart (Padme) instead of her head (Amidala). The fact that the two is gonna suffer does not take away my liking of them. Love is like death, IMHO, it does not go easy on you because of how you are doing or what you have done. And you get killed by it sometimes. Its part of the attraction I think, at least in many cases. Just like in real life not every couple who falls in love gets to have that happily ever after ride into the sunset. Sometimes for one reason or another it can end very unhappily, even tragic. -----signature----- "But my dreams They aren't as empty As my conscience seems to be.... No one knows what it's like to be the bad man, to be the sad man behind blue eyes....." The Who Anakin didn't just fall - he was pushed
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anakin-player Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:06pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Ok, I'm going to start a new topic to add some fuel to the fire. We already discussed that Padme pledges her love for Anakin because she thinks that they will die in the arena scene, so there is no need to hide their love from their respective professions. However, why do they go on to get married after they survive? What the h**ll were they thinking? Were they really that foolish to think that they can hide the marriage from the Jedi Council? I don't expect Anakin to resist marriage, but Padme should be intelligent enough to realize that they will get caught sooner or later. The smart thing to do is to just keep it as an affair instead of marriage because that would be a lesser offense than marriage in the eyes of the JC. Anakin is definitely going to get seriously reprimanded by Obi in EP III. I hope I don't get flamed too much for this post. -----signature----- “If you would not be forgotten, as soon as you are dead & rotten, either write things worth reading, or do things worth the writing.” -Benjamin Franklin
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IamZam Registered: May '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:19pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Question for the romance lovers. After the Battle with Dokuu- Anakin and Padme embrace. How come Yoda and Obi, didn't notice this? ANd howcome Obiwan wasn't concerened with Anakin escorting Padme to Naboo? I'm pretty sure he saw it. He'd have to be blind and stupid not to notice it. But the JC, being what they are: A) are too scared of needing to put up bust of the chosen on in the library with #21 under him b) are more concerned with other events right now, and c) having a little too much confidence that he will do the right thing. Luke-Cash I appologize. That isnt' quite what I meant. I meant it seems to be about 3 or 4 against 1 or 2 in here. Thus the majority of posts are in agreement, since there are more of us than of you. Getting someone else on your side kinda of helps even the score. . unfortunately.. A second wasted opportunity was after Anakin killed the assasin bugs. We know she was probabbly greatful- but we aren't shown that in that scene or in the next day. Perhaps look of sheer amazment on her face. Or if she loosened the "stoic" mask for a bit and gets herself a little flustered...that would have been good. That could have been interesting, but I think it all happened so fast that Anakin was out the door before she fully comprehended what had happened. Remember she was fast asleep. How long after you wake up suddenly with a start (and a good looking guy standing over you with a lightsaber) does it take for your brain to comprehend what is happening. She had a look of WTF? when Dorme came in. The whole "Don't look at me like that" scene, while works on one level...also comes across as creepy/sexual harasment wierd. That I just don't see. He didn't look like he was undressing her, more like "heheh, got to you didn't I..!!". He knows that she is feeling it too. It more as someone else said, smouldering, not leering. Its "Wow!!" , not "oh baby!!". And I keep hearing from the ladies on this board that it is romantic for a guy to bear his heart to a gal. Speaking for myself yes. It isn't always easy to listen too, but yes it is very impressive when a guy can talk about his feelings. But..... Nope. Not in real life. In fact that flowery speech will get you shown the door almost as quickly as Anakin got shut down. It depends on the woman you are talking too. And in Anakins case, he is talking like a knight of the 16th century not a 20 year old man of the 21rst century. Try the same sentiments in modern style words. And Anakin didn't so much as get shot down. (If she had told him, I don't feel the same way, sorry kid forget it, that would have been a shot down), but rather she stated that she couldn't allow this to go on and happen. She acknowldeged, in a Freudian manner (no matter how WE feel) and with her facial expressions just how much she really loves him, and wants him. But She is still trying to be the rational one. There is a difference. Some women may not appreciate the sentiments, but if the feelings are truly mutual and you are both on the same wavelength I would think she would be very appreciative. One has to take in to account who they are talking to. Women are not one sized fits all, any more than men. What works great with one of us, may be a total mistake with another woman. We are individuals too, just like men. Some of us love ice cream, others hate it. -----signature----- "But my dreams They aren't as empty As my conscience seems to be.... No one knows what it's like to be the bad man, to be the sad man behind blue eyes....." The Who Anakin didn't just fall - he was pushed
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ami-padme Registered: Sep '99	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:20pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread. - Date Edited: 6/30/02 12:22pm (1 edits total) Edited By: ami-padme
	However, why do they go on to get married after they survive? I guess they were thinking that they love each other, and they needed to be together. They aren't ignorant of the possible reactions of the Jedi -- they talked about that on the freighter and during the fireplace scene. During the fireplace scene, Padme decided that their duty (and Anakin's future) was more important than their feelings. Anakin was already prepared to be with her in secret. By the time of the love pledge, Padme has decided that their feelings are more important. And that decision goes beyond thinking they're going to die in the next five minutes...once they've defeated the beasts, Padme is with Anakin throughout the fight in front of the other Jedi without caring, and she kisses and hugs him as well with Yoda and Obi-Wan standing right there. She's made her choice. Anakin's was already made. I suppose she could have gone back after everything and tried to think it through rationally again, and decide again that it's too risky for them to be together, but I really think they're past that point, whether it's a smart decision or not. The smart thing to do is to just keep it as an affair instead of marriage because that would be a lesser offense than marriage in the eyes of the JC. Personally, I think Anakin's in hot water regardless (he got threatened with being kicked out of the Order for wanting to go back for her when he thought she was hurt...I don't think they look at any attachment as better or worse than any other). I think Anakin respects her too much to just have her as some secret lover..if he's going to be with her, he not going to do it according to what will make the Jedi Council slightly less angry with him if/when he gets caughts. He's going to act according to his heart, and he's going to go the whole way on it. He's decided that he loves her, and will be with her. He's not going to half-step on that for the Council's sake. At least, that's what I think. -----signature----- The Anakin Skywalker Home Page: http://anakinskywalker1.homestead.com/home.html Forums Spotlight Thread: Anakin/Vader Comics http://www.aimoo.com/forum/postview.cfm?id=314579&CategoryID=278904&startcat=1&ThreadID=666233
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PadmeLeiaJaina Registered: May '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:31pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	<<However, why do they go on to get married after they survive? What the h**ll were they thinking? Were they really that foolish to think that they can hide the marriage from the Jedi Council? I don't expect Anakin to resist marriage, but Padme should be intelligent enough to realize that they will get caught sooner or later. The smart thing to do is to just keep it as an affair instead of marriage because that would be a lesser offense than marriage in the eyes of the JC. Anakin is definitely going to get seriously reprimanded by Obi in EP III. I hope I don't get flamed too much for this post.>> A-P, the novel has that Padme states flat out in the Fireplace Scene "Jedi Are not allowed to Marry." Why was that cut from the film? I don't know. To me, her saying that, mentioning the M word, shows that it is something she's already contemplating and thinking about. Why do they get married? In a more "civilized age" and in a PG rated film, people do not just shack up. They get married. Anakin and Padme get married, the same reason Romeo and Juliet get married, to solidify and properly consumate their love for each other. Anakin has already dipped his foot into the Dark Side, he will be able to cloud the JC from knowing about the marriage. That look on his face before he swallows down "No it will destroy us" shows that he is fully committed to keeping the secret and will do whatever means it would take to do so. He will do ANYTHING to be with Padme. This is why he is irrational. Why does Padme agree to marriage? Because she wants it. She wants something personal that she can cling to as the political world that she has lived in and lived for so long is crumbling around them. -----signature----- My STAR WARS Fan Site! http://www.freewebs.com/padmeleiajaina/ Visit me on Livejournal! http://rkc-erika.livejournal.com/
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Jedi_Lyn Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:33pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	I_Z, what I meant is, even if some has persuited her, she would not possiblity even consider to feel for them. Coz, like you said, they don't see her as her-with-a-heart. I have such horrible training in writing, it is so tough for me to put any thought in words and mean what I think. So I am also practicing here. Anakin in the chasing of Zam does not give me the impression of doing it just for Padme. It didn't impress me as if he is doing it to show Obi-wan 'I've grown up'. The way he laughs when Obi-wan is cursing (not so seriously cursing) is just like a kid. I think he likes risks and do stuff like jumping off the car or hanging off Zam's car just for the heck of it, to show off, maybe, that everybody else is pretty lame. Anakin has been obi-wan's padawan for 10 years. I imaging the two risk danger very offen, and sometimes face really gory grim stuff. that's their life. chasing of zam is just to give u an idea how their life is. Also I suspect Anakin plans to chanllenge obi-wan at the time they go to see Padme. To me Padme's respond to him scr**d him up big time. He might be doing it to show like ' i am not a kid any more. And nobody should treat me like one.' He is crazy about her, that is for sure. -----signature----- What was silent is now in retreat Nothing was to be marked from the beginning Except the acknowledge
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anakin-player Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:48pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Personally, I think Anakin's in hot water regardless (he got threatened with being kicked out of the Order for wanting to go back for her when he thought she was hurt...I don't think they look at any attachment as better or worse than any other). Yeah the JC would punish him for his attachment to Padme, but marriage is strictly forbidden. That is one of the most severe offenses possible for a Jedi. It would be like manslaughter compared to murder in the 1st degree. He probably wouldn't be expelled from the order for just having a secret relationship with Padme, but marriage is definitely grounds for expulsion. PLJ, you are right that lovers in the 16th century just don't "shack up." I guess marriage is the only solution for the two lovers if they want to be together. It will be interesting to see the JC's reaction in EP III. -----signature----- “If you would not be forgotten, as soon as you are dead & rotten, either write things worth reading, or do things worth the writing.” -Benjamin Franklin
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ami-padme Registered: Sep '99	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:53pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Where are you getting the info that marriage specifically is the worst attachment a Jedi can have, as opposed to having a love affair (or any other kind of attachment outside the Order)? I'm just wondering if I missed something, like an explanation of the degrees of Jedi transgressions. As far as I can tell, they wouldn't look any more kindly on one relationship versus the other, so it wouldn't make much sense for Anakin to "just" date her, or whatever, to avoid their wrath when he's caught. I'm genuinely curious. -----signature----- The Anakin Skywalker Home Page: http://anakinskywalker1.homestead.com/home.html Forums Spotlight Thread: Anakin/Vader Comics http://www.aimoo.com/forum/postview.cfm?id=314579&CategoryID=278904&startcat=1&ThreadID=666233
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Jedi_Lyn Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 12:58pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	I think Anakin respects her too much to just have her as some secret lover..if he's going to be with her, he not going to do it according to what will make the Jedi Council slightly less angry with him if/when he gets caughts. He's going to act according to his heart, and he's going to go the whole way on it. He's decided that he loves her, and will be with her. He's not going to half-step on that for the Council's sake. At least, that's what I think. I find it hard to believe a 19 years old will think about marriage. it is padme that poped the word. I think it is padme that wants the marriage, after she made the decision before the execution. Anakin would do it as long as padme wants it, me think. It is questionable an affair is a lesser offence. like PLJ said, at their time, an affair might be considered worse. Anyway they breaks the rules. they plain and simply breaks it. -----signature----- What was silent is now in retreat Nothing was to be marked from the beginning Except the acknowledge
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jedi-ES Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 1:04pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Anakin-player, in response to your question, IMHO I think that there are several levels to my answer. First, we all agree that this romance is 15th-16th century, not 21st. So in agreement with PLJ, back then when people wanted to be together they got married. Second, is a symbolic of Anakin's commitments. Yes, he is a Jedi and yes he very much wants to do his duty, but with the marriage ceremony is shows the audience that his life is now committed to Padme. Third, I think that GL and the entire Star Wars saga is based on older values than what our societies currently value, that is why so many either don't like SW or don't understand it. And in older cultures (western) when two people love eachother, they must make a formal commitment - marriage. Fourth, in regards to Padme, and as we have said for weeks now, the love pledge was the final nail of the coffin of Sen. Amidala. She is let go of all barriers to her true emotions and once that is done, she cannot even fathom only allowing a secret love affair. Fifth, the political conditions only acerbate the situation. The galaxy is being thrust into the Clone War, Chan. Palpatine has now emergency powers, the Dark side is growing, in these terrible times, where life is so precious, how could they imagine not going another day without dedicating themselves to eachother. This is no different than a soldier during WWII getting married before he left, only Padme and Anakin are very special and their decisions will effect the entire future of the galaxy. Lastly, from my point of view, though it surprised me when they showed the wedding, I couldn't imagine them not getting married. Maybe I am old-fashioned, but when two people love each other to such a depth that they do, it only seems natural to formally commit to each other forever. "Let love reign supreme though the Heavens fall." The path of the Star-crossed Lovers. -----signature----- "I write for the youth of my generation, the critics of the next, and the schoolmasters of ever afterward." "God gives each his due at the time allotted." THE Trojan Horse. Petition! http://www.ipetitions.com/campaigns/jedistyletraining
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HappyPlace Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 1:10pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	However, why do they go on to get married after they survive? My answer would be that GL is an old-fashioned guy and if you love someone, you marry them. Besides, he's already given Luke Anakin's surname! Actually, I think the fact that Anakin went so far as to MARRY her, is GL's way to show us how serious this relationship was. It is NOT just some secret fling that can be shrugged off when things start going bad. It is a serious commitment from both sides. About the reaction of the JC, it is my opinion that they (at least Obi-Wan) is already glaringly aware of which way Anakin's heart and loyalty lies. Having him go off with Padme back to Naboo after the Geonosis debacle just shows you that they have no clue how to handle this situation. He is their "Chosen One", but he is choosing something other than the Jedi Order as his first priority. I agree that it will be very interesting to see how they handle it in Ep III, but from what I've seen so far, my theory is, they'll turn a blind eye as far as possible.
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HappyPlace Registered: Jun '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 1:15pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread. - Date Edited: 6/30/02 1:18pm (1 edits total) Edited By: HappyPlace
	Ack, double post! I'll just add my Jedi-ES, ITA! Well put!!
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Undomiel Registered: May '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 1:21pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread. - Date Edited: 6/30/02 1:23pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Undomiel
	Jedi_Es, Thank you for revealing my bias. I wasn't thinking of it so much as a bias, as a misconception of what you want yourself, from a relationship with a female. Think of all the relationships that start off that way. The guy is thinking, let's get to it. The lady is thinking, not till the atmosphere's right -- which translated could mean any number of things, including (but not limited to) does he really like/love me or is he just here for the hamburger and cheese-its. Of course, as the relationship proceeds there's also details like -- does she have halitosis, does he have foot odor, does he have the tendency to obsess over premature balding, does she paint her toenails a gawdful shade of purple. You know the normal picky cr@pola. She doesn't shave her armpits! He doesn't shave his mustache and it itches! The list goes on and on. Eventually you have to pitch the list in the trash can and make adjustments to yourself that make YOU a better person, rather than worrying about what she's doing or he's doing that might not complete your list of the perfect mate. Anakin and Padme haven't gotten that far in their courtship. I wonder if they ever will before the relationship is destroyed from outside forces.
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Undomiel Registered: May '02	Date Posted: 6/30/02 1:39pm Subject: RE: Official Love Story discussion thread.
	Anakin_Player, We already discussed that Padme pledges her love for Anakin because she thinks that they will die in the arena scene, so there is no need to hide their love from their respective professions. However, why do they go on to get married after they survive? What the h**ll were they thinking? Were they really that foolish to think that they can hide the marriage from the Jedi Council? I think at this juncture, once Padme confesses to Anakin in the arena, it's much too late to turn back. The finality of death convinces people to do larger than life things, or to be braver in finding real happiness for themselves. Even GL's brush with death was a life-changing experience that made it possible for him to become the man of wealth, talent and power he is today. Of course, it doesn't appear Anakin thinks he's going to die, as if he has already set in his mind that he is invincible. However, the chance still remains that Padme may not survive the Arena and they both know it. I believe this, above all else, convinces them both that if they survive, they WILL be bonded to each other in marriage, rather than miss the opportunity to live their entire lives without knowing what it would've been like, only to die prematurely or of old age, never having known what true happiness might've been available to them.
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