Lit Clone Wars Continuity Discussion (Spoilers Allowed)

Discussion in 'Literature' started by sabarte, May 12, 2008.

  1. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2004
    star 5
    I demand weaponized loincloth then! :p

    ps: Shadow Conspiracy book has nice introspective into Maul too with memories of his killing of Black Sun before TPM, his time on Mustafar etc. when his encounters come full circle then returning to those he had dealt with in his past.
  2. hlc88 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 3, 2012
    star 4
    I do wish that Shadow Conspiracy book was easily available in the UK since it seems to delve into the character's thoughts very well. I don't think it is which is a shame since I'd like to read it!
  3. CeiranHarmony Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 10, 2004
    star 5
    Impressed how many TCW introduced characters died I am. But most impressive was, how much of previous arcs returned or got to play a role, tying it all together very well, though the end makes me curious for exactly what happens next and if the episode goes beyond the books end or not with what was hinted at by Obi Wan, though technically not necessary anymore probably given someone else dealt with the problem for them.. kinda. Also nice shoutouts to classic OT scenes like Death Star prison escape, and others and EU mentions of Fire Rings of Fornax etc.
  4. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    Considering TCW has yet to create any interesting recurring characters, I can't say I'll be sad to see them go ;)
    Last edited by instantdeath, Dec 26, 2012
  5. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

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    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    I thought there were a few neat ones, especially the recurring villains like Hondo and Bane. Satine has potential, but they've sort of wasted her by pairing her off with Padme and dragging out the Mando plot.
    Last edited by Barriss_Coffee, Dec 26, 2012
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  6. blackmyron Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 29, 2005
    star 5
    I found the Separatist Congress to be interesting, a well-thought addition that expanded the Clone Wars, which must be why we've never seen it again.
  7. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    Hondo, Bane, Riyo Chuchi all come to mind.
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  8. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    I will second this, plus Rex, Embo, Sugi, Huyang, the younglings (albeit as a group rather than as individuals), Echo, Fives, Hevy, Mother Talzin, Katuunko, Admiral Trench, Lok Durd, Maar Tuk, Pre Visla, Steela, Ziro (hey, memorable doesn't mean good, before GGrevious facepalms).

    Personally, I think the Clone Wars is actually one of the better sources of memorable characters - I would be hard pressed to remember this many characters from even my favorite comics or novels. TCW is especially good at having characters be something other than white human males.

    On that note, I think TCW has been good at giving in all categories - a lot of interesting species (though, sadly, most are unnamed), the best planets in the EU since....I don't know. Hard to think of any EU planets besides your standard temperate, desert, ice, or jungle planets. It also has some wonderfully designed technology, from droids to vehicles, and excellent architecture and clothing as well. Whatever else you can say about TCW, it is a visual feast - something sadly lacking elsewhere in the EU, even in the more visual mediums.
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  9. Esg Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    Last edited by Esg, Dec 28, 2012
  10. MercenaryAce Force Ghost

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    Aug 10, 2005
    star 5
    I know it is. That is why I said "I think".
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  11. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    star 6
    Guys, this line of conversation never gets anywhere.

    Person A: TCW never does X.

    Person B: They did X that one time.

    Person A: That's your opinion.

    Conclusion: A and B disagree with each other.
  12. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    Hondo and Bane were actually two characters I had in mind when I made that comment. TCW is a kid's show, and deserves some leeway, but even compared with some of its peers, I feel characterization is not its strong point (much like the prequels). I'm down on TCW a lot, but I do enjoy quite a few aspects of it.

    Hondo is not someone I can fully judge, as I have not seen the latest episodes featuring him, which has won him some acclaim... in all prior appearances, though, I have trouble seeing him as anything more than a shallowly written rogue-with-a-heart-of-gold (though the writers never really struck the balance necessary to make those types of characters work reliably).

    Bane, though, is the epitome of my problem with TCW's original characters, in that he's nothing but a caricature. Even after a half-dozen appearances, he barely has more personality than Boba Fett from Return of the Jedi. He's a character with little purpose beyond selling action figures. As I've mentioned, this is a kids show, so I'm not expecting three dimensional characterization from the villains of all people, but it does help if the villains have at least some presence or charisma. Bane has the charisma of a wet dish cloth.

    I could quite easily forgive the fact that Bane is created to fit snugly into a set archetype if he was written to be more, to take the somewhat tired space cowboy and make it interesting, but the writers of TCW are content with him being an exceedingly bland villain of the week.

    To be quite honest, I had to look Riyo Chuchi up. I seem to recall her now, but I honestly can't remember anything memorable about her character, so I'll refrain from commenting more on her.

    I said interesting, not memorable :p. Bane is memorable simply for being a cowboy in Star Wars... though he doesn't bring much to the table beyond that.

    I kind of want to give you Rex, and I have to give them credit for making an attempt to differentiate the clones, though I feel that's something they get very mixed results on. Rex seems to have a distinct personality, if nothing else due to his sheer presence on the show, but I've never truly felt anything for any particular clone, after the first season episode Rookies. Embo embodies my rant on Bane to an even greater extent, but he gets away with it for essentially being a background character. Talzin is the last one I'm tempted to acknowledge. Sure, she's just a witch in space, but I think the important area where she differs from Bane is that she's fairly interesting and mysterious, where Bane's depth ends at his rocket boots.

    Now, I don't think TCW is all bad with characterization. They aren't bad at all when it comes to characterizing existing characters. I feel they do a good job with Obi-Wan's personality, and I actually love Anakin's optimistic personality change. I've always felt that he should have some Han Solo esque swashbuckling hero traits about him. Believe it or not, I also feel they've nailed Maul, even if Savage is largely a disappointment. They captured Chewie well, and actually, in my opinion, made Aurra Sing more likable.

    You do have a good point on TCW not always relying on the White Human Male (and the one prominent original White Human Male TCW original I can think of, Lux, is easily one of the most shallow and ill conceived characters of the show, in my opinion). That said, I do think their diversity owes much to the visual medium; it's actually a benefit to make characters alien, because it will likely lead to a more memorable image (once again, Bane). And besides, I don't feel the (alien) diversity means a whole lot in the long run if the characters themselves are rather boring.

    Well, if you wanted, you could boil almost any internet debate/argument/pissing contest to that formula. Doesn't make it less fun/necessary to more thoroughly outline the steps involved, as long as both sides are willing to elaborate a bit.
    Last edited by instantdeath, Dec 28, 2012
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  13. Zorrixor Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Sep 8, 2004
    star 6
    Person C[ooper] posts the above.
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  14. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    Dear me, I've become predictable. :oops:
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  15. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    Sure, TCW often looks great, but for the nuanced story I'll take the Jabiim comics and Labyrinth of Evil over Umbara or Heroes on Both Sides, thanks very much.
    Last edited by JackG, Dec 29, 2012
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  16. instantdeath Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Jul 22, 2010
    star 5
    I continue to think that TCW and the rest of the Clone Wars stuff can coexist peacefully. I'm far from TCW's biggest fan, and I do feel they sometimes appear almost flippant and disrespectful in the way they casually contradict pretty large things (like character deaths), but overall I feel TCW adds more than it takes away. If nothing else, Star Wars is extremely well suited to the animation medium.

    I think the most annoying thing is that TCW could be awesome, but is content to be merely good sometimes, fairly bad other times. And by "awesome", I don't even mean following canon; I mean the formula of the show as is offers so much more potential than what's being taken advantage of. Of course, this is the part where I say I haven't seen the last few episodes, so for all I know it's the greatest thing since the creation of fire.
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  17. JackG Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Aug 15, 2011
    star 4
    It could, but TCW's flouting itself as the story of the Clone Wars is rather annoying. (See: the Mon Calamari and Kamino rehashs of the older pre-RotS EU)
    The Separatist Parliament, the use of Z-95s and Y-Wings, and the use of EU planets such as Onderon certainly are steps in the right direction at expanding the canon of the conflict for the better, killing Piell and Gallia isn't. I'm cynically hopeful about this show, if that's possible; I don't downright hate it like some others.
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  18. fistofan1 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Dec 8, 2009
    star 4
    Exactly, it's like the TCW writers can't make up their minds on whether or not to acknowledge the EU. At this point, it's certainly possible to make all the Clone Wars stories go together. In the future, however, I hope the show's creators decide to either respect the EU or leave it alone entirely.
    General Immodet and Esg like this.
  19. AdmiralWesJanson Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    May 23, 2005
    star 5
    Well, that is a function of the medium. Novels can take longer to explore the story, while comics you can take the time to appreciate the fine details if you so desire. Clone Wars is a visual show with 22 minutes to cover the plot (if not the entire story, that is what multiparters are for)
  20. Zeta1127 Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Sep 2, 2012
    star 4
    My problem with TCW is I am perfectly happy with the multimedia project timeline, to the point that it is the Clone Wars to me. The way I see that isn't a function of the medium, its a function of George Lucas and LFL doing whatever the heck they want to do because apparently they can.
  21. General Immodet Jedi Grand Master

    Member Since:
    Dec 5, 2012
    star 4
    I still do not get why the Clone Captain serving Anakin was called 'Rex'.
    -) It should have been Alpha! I know Lucas and Filoni did not like that too many names beginning with an 'a', but still...
    -) 'rex' is a reference to a dinosaur. Do dinosaurs even exist in SW???
  22. Barriss_Coffee Chosen One

    Member Since:
    Jun 29, 2003
    star 6
    [IMG]

    Yeah, I estimate we've got like maybe a couple minutes max before the Lit Latin Linguists pounce on this thread.
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  23. CooperTFN TFN EU Staff Emeritus

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    I don't even know Latin and I sighed at that one.
  24. Rogue_Follower Manager Emeritus

    Member Since:
    Nov 12, 2003
    star 6
    I'll let the, er, Lit Latin Linguists deal with the main issue here, but the answer to the question is yes. One of L. Niel Smith's less strange additions to the universe. :p
  25. Lugija Force Ghost

    Member Since:
    Oct 3, 2009
    star 4
    [IMG]

    Yes they exist, and they're smart.

    Seriously, they open and close doors like nobody's business.