Discussion in 'Literature' started by Barriss_Coffee, Dec 12, 2012.
That would be great if Luke gets to Mortis only to find Jaxxon in charge.
In another dimension, another time and space,
A planet called Mortis was fallin' on its face
When out of the chaos, who else could it be
But the animal adventurers from S.P.A.C.E.?!!!!
And here I was thinking Obi-Wan's 20 years on Tatooine saw him meeting up with the sandpeople regularly, turning them into drunks who can't aim straight. That's also why he knows so much about them. You know, they didn't run away from a Krayt dragon howl, or from a Jedi-in-anger howl. They ran away because that crazy hermit with his liquor was coming around again.
Heck, I guess you could even retcon that into the tribe taking him on as their new leader after he gets Hett thrown out. I can see JJM's novel before it's happened...
Lol! Yeah, and he yells, "This...is...STAR WARS!" when he does it.
Personally, I have a really hard time trying to explain the SWEU to anyone who doesn't know about it. Most people either don't care, or they're like, "Huh? Why?" Trying to explain EU to fans who don't care for it is even worse. I have met people who say they like the movies, but have never read a book in their entire lives, unless you count Dick and Jane or Archie comics as books. I have met people who claim to be fans, but have no clue who IG-88(B) is. But fans who outright hate the EU ...well, I'm pretty much giving up there.
This is great... We should totally have a thread for that some time.
Also, summarizing the EU for people who don't know any of it usually feels like this for me.
I do not explain the EU to people who are not into SW. It's a mission impossible.
Hmmm, "normal people". What does that make me? Not normal?
Just joking, I know what you mean!
You don't need a detailed foray into the convolutions of the EU to answer the question "Did this Sifo-Dyas guy really exist?" The answer to that question is evident just from paying attention to AOTC.
Huh? I don't get this thread. Normal people read the EU.
People who only watch the movies
We are Lit. We are the social elite.
My geekdom was on display because of a ROTS hoodie. Its my own fault.
If someone asks. We were watching the movie and they had already seen in before, so they had speculations about whether he existed or not that were not based on the EU, but they knew the EU existed and assumed whatever the EU said was the truth.
I see that a lot come to think of it -- people who aren't aware of the G/C/N-canon-categories automatically assuming whatever the books/games say is the legit deal. Ah, innocence.
I can see speculating on whether the clone order was really him, but speculating on whether or not he ever existed at all? Obi-Wan knew of him.
Their point was more along the lines of, "did Sids just pull any old dead Jedi name out of a hat and pass it off to the Kaminoans?" Like writing a check in someone else's name. Obviously, we know there's more to it than that. But the regular joe just going off the movie wouldn't.
Wasn't Sifo-Dyas originally meant to be a cunning alias for Sidious (and not a real Jedi name at all)? I know it was my first expectation while seeing the movie. And it would make sense to use an element that movie viewers would actually understand (like, that secretly scheming Sith who'll actually be using this army in his takeover of the galaxy secretly scheming to create it) instead of something that will have everyone puzzled until some people read a novel in which a solution for the problem is found, and it's not even clear if this was Lucas' plan all along since it could also be that he maneuvered himself into trouble when he started changing AOTC around, or that Luceno just felt obliged to mix the info he got from Lucas with other stuff that EU already mentioned offhand. I think the Dyas-Dooku friendship was established before LoE, wasn't it?
Also, isn't it outrageous that Dyas only ever really appeared in Darth Plagueis, where he is just one of about 500 continuity ingredients that gets shown like a trophy and then put back into the fridge? Couldn't they cut down on the Sith (I'm looking at you, Maul) and write some Jedi books that, unlike Crosscurrent/Riptide and Scourge, actually help flesh out the Jedi Order of the movies? I don't mean Jedi-X-as-a-general plots like they did in the Clone Wars, but something that pretends that publishers don't only think that audiences don't only think that Jedi are generally boring and don't sell well?
EDIT: I just realized that what I essentially want to say is that the EU explanation here is actually counter-intuitive to what you might expect after seeing the movie, even though Dyas is a real Jedi and not just a cover there. But seeing how he's dead, it's more likely identity theft than some Jedi we never get to know anything about doing something as profound as ordering an army that is obviously an important puzzle piece for the Sith. It might all be Lucas' fault, but still - EU would probably be very unstaisfactory in this case (just like the Plagueis-Palps-Maul business that's been reinterpreted). Normal people might take issue with the fact that you can't understand what's "really" going on in the movies when watching the movies.
I liked The Essential Guide to Warfare's take on it- Sifo-Dyas was from the "Cassandran worlds", he saw some (but not all) of the future, and sought to prevent it by arranging for the creation of the army.
In that version of the script his name was Sido-Dyas, because Palpatine has the criminal mind of an eight-year-old. This article explains how he morphed from a clever alias into the unfinished second half of a hack mystery plot.
Judging by the fact that I'm the only one who liked this, it appears that no one else has watched Bucky O'Hare...
Shame on all of you. It starred a big, green space rabbit!
Interesting article, thanks (even if it misses something the wook apparently knows - the Sido/Sifo drift coming from a keyboard spelling mistake - so all available information still seems to be a puzzle).
As for Palpatine's mind, I thought it's obvious that everyone in SW has the mind of an 8-year-old, and this is why these plots can be fun. The problem with smart takes on pop culture stories is that you can never be smart enough to outsmart the basic silliness of the juvenile genre stuff you're selling. See Nolan making Batman as realistic as possible and then tripping over his own shoes with that. It's everywhere in nerd culture. At some point you just have to swallow that Superman's perfect disguise is a pair of glasses.
With Sifo-Dyas, I basically feel like Lucas dropped the ball and EU then proceeded to use this ball for a game of checkers.
On a lighter note, my girlfriend just asked me a few days ago (reading ROTS) if Leia ever got to be a Jedi, since she should in all fairness have Luke's talent. She knows I stopped enjoying the books at some point, so she's not surprised when my answer on such topics starts with "Well...".
@ For your girlfriend, the answer is yes!!
People love Boba Fett in the movies...and what did he really accomplish other than dying?
Ugh. It really is hard being an avid EU fan amongst the sea of people who've only seen the movies. I remember the time I told my mother that Chewie dies eventually. That was a hard conversation. lolI also have issues remembering that my friends aren't really into the EU and I can't just fall into EU storylines at will.
I hate to break it to your mother, but everyone dies eventually.
True, but in Marvel comics, everyone somehow comes back to life or fakes their death...so at least we have that going for us with the whole Disney thing...
Comic book Heaven has a revolving door. Though, back in the day, there were many a non-comic reader who did not realize that. During the whole Death of Superman arc, non-comic readers thought that was that—Superman wasn't coming back. Comic readers, however, knew that DC wouldn't off their long-standing flagship character permanently. It was only a matter of time before he came back. There are also some people who only know the Hulk from the TV series and the made-for-TV movie, and when the Hulk died at the end of that movie, that was that for him. People were surprised to know that the Hulk was still alive and well and smashing through the pages of Marvel every month. Death in comics perplexes non-comic readers. To them, dead is dead.