Author Topic: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
jedimasterbac  6237 posts
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Date Posted: 12/18/08 5:00pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
Well, it wouldn't really be a distraction, because it would be in the background and focus wouldn't be put on that. To me, I think it would make sense to have just a few shots of rebel ships and TIE fighters in the background, and maybe a few shots of Yavin behind them too. It's smart cinematography, in my opinion.

 

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BarkingFrog  80 posts
Registered: Jan '09
7017_Bubo
Date Posted: 1/10 9:36pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2. - Date Edited: 1/10 9:45pm (1 edits total) Edited By: BarkingFrog
I know most people would hate something like this, as it's quite a major thing... but I think Ian McDiarmid should re-record his lines in Return of the Jedi. He sounds so different from how he does in the prequels and The Empire Strikes Back. I much prefer the deeper, more gravelly voice he used in the other films.

And fix the slugs.

Some more changes:

- Remove the Jabba/Han scene from A New Hope. A CG Jabba will never look as good as the puppet. Put it as a Deleted Scene to be included on the disc.

- Put Lapti Nek back into ROTJ. Jedi Rocks is just awful. If Lucas really likes the CGI, they could use the same singer model, but use Lapti Nek instead of that horrible pop song.

- Redo the scene with Han melting out of the carbonite.

 

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jedimasterbac  6237 posts
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Date Posted: 1/10 9:48pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2. - Date Edited: 1/10 9:49pm (1 edits total) Edited By: jedimasterbac
The slugs I agree with because that was just poor make up design, but I don't see why McDiarmid should have to re-record all of his lines from Return of the Jedi just to retroactively fit with the prequels. Now I'm not taking a shot at the prequels or anything, and it's obvious that McDiarmid's voice isn't going to sound exactly the same after nearly thirty years, but in my opinion that doesn't justify a change of that magnitude.

I also agree with you about the Jabba scene and Lapti Nek, but why should the carbonite part be changed?

 

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BarkingFrog  80 posts
Registered: Jan '09
7017_Bubo
Date Posted: 1/10 11:38pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
Not the entire scene, just the effect of Han being released from the carbonite. The red glow and his skin illuminating like the sun doesn't quite make sense.

 

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jedimasterbac  6237 posts
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Date Posted: 1/11 8:15am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
A lot of things in Star Wars don't make sense. Why single that one out? tongue

 

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Arawn_Fenn  10330 posts
Registered: Jul '04
46079_Darth Plagueis
Date Posted: 1/11 9:51am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
I'm sure there's a creative retcon that would explain it. Something about photonic energy. tongue

 

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Drewton  310 posts
Registered: Jan '09
49174_Darth Malak (91109)
Date Posted: 1/14 5:31am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
Episode IV: A New Hope
*Slightly rewrite the opening crawl so that it relates more to the events in ROTS. Mention clone troopers, Order 66, Anakin Skywalker becoming Darth Vader, Mustafar, the Separatists, Dooku, the Jedi, the Sith, and Chancellor Palpatine.
*Add shots of Imperials bording the Tantive IV.
*Change some of the lighting.
*Add shots of Vader with lightsaber on the Tantive IV.
*More explosions on the Tantive IV.
*Change all blaster, lightsaber, and explosion effects.
*Clean up all the audio, replacing blaster and lightsaber sound effects with those from the PT.
*More digital-ness.
*Add completely new music to some scenes and in others just rerecord it to improve the quality.
*Replace Vader's entrace theme with Imperial March.
*Add a brighter glow to C-3PO's eyes.
*Make Stormtroopers on the Tantive IV clearly members of the 501st, perhaps have Temeura Morrison record their lines, and perhaps add blue markings.
*Have James Earl Jones rerecord Vader lines. Mention Bail Organa when speaking with Leia.
*Extend Tantive IV sequence. This can easily be done when the rebels and stormtroopers are all generic, and anyone can be in a Vader suit.
*Change Vader's suit to something more similar to in his other appearances.
*Reshoot some of the Tatooine scenes which do not involve Luke, Owen, and/or Beru.
*The Tatooine scenes are rather slow-paced. Add some scenes of Vader and other rebels or something.
*Add a battle droid the the Jawa droid sale.
*Add a new scene of Palpatine disbanding the Senate.
*Have the rebels mention Galen Marek.
*Use some TFU music.
*Give 3PO a more shiny look.
*Redo all holograms.
*Redo the Twin Suns. Make the Luke-staring-at-suns scene look more like the ending of ROTS.
*Shoot new shots of Tunisia; add the actors from the original footage to these shots.
*Animate the banthas.
*Animate shots of the Death Star.
*Film new scene of stormtroopers destroying the Homestead. Either that or include TROOPS.
*Give cantina music a slightly more techno/bar-style.
*Replace some of the aliens in the cantina.
*Remove the walrus man's blood.
*Replace the doctor's voice with someone else's.
*Change the lighting the cantina.
*Han shoots first.
*Improve animation for Jabba.
*Film new scene with Bail Organa on Alderaan. Make him look older with simple makeup.
*Redo the destruction of Alderaan sequence.
*Fix Luke's green lightsaber.
*Redo the dejarik players/pawns/whatever.
*Animate space shots.
*Add new scene of Rebels vs. Empire.
*Film new scene with Juno Eclipse and PROXY. Use the same TFU actor for Juno and the same voice actor for PROXY.
*Restore the Luke and Biggs scene.
*Completely redo Obi-Wan vs. Vader scene; make it more intense. This would be simple because Obi-Wan is hooded in this scene.
*Film/animate more rebel hangar shots.
*Completely redo Death Star attack. Films new shots of pilots.
*Show Vader's TIE Advanced crashing.
*Add a new scene just before the Yavin ceremony with Vader and the Emperor on Coruscant.
*Give Chewbacca a medal.
*PT music to use: Duel of the Fates (short cue), some notes from Battle of Heroes in new track for Vader vs. Obi-Wan, Across the Stars used once or twice for Luke, Imperial March used much more (not exactly PT, I know), some notes from The Tusken Camp/The Homestead for the discovery of Owen and Beru's fates.
*Film flashbacks of Order 66-surviving Jedi being hunted down.

More later.

 

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jedimasterbac  6237 posts
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Date Posted: 1/14 7:12am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
That's rather....over the top, especially the TFU stuff.

 

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Drewton  310 posts
Registered: Jan '09
49174_Darth Malak (91109)
Date Posted: 1/14 11:15am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
Why do you say that? TFU music probably would be over the top, yes, but why not have Marek, the founder of the Rebellion, mentioned, and Juno and PROXY given cameos?

 

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Merlin_Ambrosius69  1931 posts
Registered: Aug '08
6602_Obi-Wan Kenobi
Date Posted: 1/14 11:24am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2. - Date Edited: 1/14 11:26am (1 edits total) Edited By: Merlin_Ambrosius69
Drewton posted:
Episode IV: A New Hope
*Slightly rewrite the opening crawl so that it relates more to the events in ROTS. Mention clone troopers, Order 66, Anakin Skywalker becoming Darth Vader, Mustafar, the Separatists, Dooku, the Jedi, the Sith, and Chancellor Palpatine.


None of the crawls of the other films "relate more to the events" of the previous film. The crawls fill in the gaps between the films; they don't re-iterate the events of the last one. Because, you know, that would be boring and pointless.

Drewton posted:
*Add shots of Imperials bording the Tantive IV.


There are already several shots of Imperial Stormtroopers and Darth Vader boarding the ship. Perhaps you blinked continuously for several minutes, and missed these?

Drewton posted:
*Change some of the lighting.
*Add shots of Vader with lightsaber on the Tantive IV.
*More explosions on the Tantive IV.


No, no and no.

Drewton posted:
*Change all blaster, lightsaber, and explosion effects.


Rather than changing these, perhaps Lucas should consider restoring the original versions of the blaster and explosion effects, which were considerably brighter and more intense. I will agree that the lightsabers need tweaking in two places: On-board the Falcon and briefly during the Duel.

Drewton posted:
*Clean up all the audio, replacing blaster and lightsaber sound effects with those from the PT.


The audio has been cleaned up sufficiently. It's time to leave it alone. Since this is the original film, I would hope Lucas would consider replacing the PT sound effects with some more closely resembling those found in the original.

Drewton posted:
*More digital-ness.
*Add completely new music to some scenes and in others just rerecord it to improve the quality.
*Replace Vader's entrace theme with Imperial March.


No, no, and are you kidding?

Drewton posted:
*Add a brighter glow to C-3PO's eyes.


I lay awake at night praying to heaven above that C-3PO's eyes will be made brighter. My peace of mind depends upon it.

Drewton posted:
*Make Stormtroopers on the Tantive IV clearly members of the 501st, perhaps have Temeura Morrison record their lines, and perhaps add blue markings.
*Have James Earl Jones rerecord Vader lines. Mention Bail Organa when speaking with Leia.


Horrifying and pointless.

Drewton posted:
*Extend Tantive IV sequence. This can easily be done when the rebels and stormtroopers are all generic, and anyone can be in a Vader suit.


Unnecessary and destructive to the pacing.

[quote=Drewton]*Change Vader's suit to something more similar to in his other appearances.[/quote]

[sarcasm]Because people don't change their suits in the SW universe. Ever. Once they develop a look, they adhere to this design until the end, refusing to make any alterations or improvements. Darth Vader's suit is cast in iron, cannot be removed or altered in any way, and must look exactly the same in every episode.[/sarcasm]

[quote=Drewton]*Reshoot some of the Tatooine scenes which do not involve Luke, Owen, and/or Beru.
*The Tatooine scenes are rather slow-paced. Add some scenes of Vader and other rebels or something.[/quote]

Or, alternately, don't, since the above would be pointless and destructive to the pacing.

[quote=Drewton]*Add a battle droid the the Jawa droid sale.[/quote]

I have no problem with this, as long as it's subtle and does not scream "Hey look at me! I'm a Battle Droid like the one in those other movies! Get it? Huh? Do ya? Huh?"

[quote=Drewton]*Add a new scene of Palpatine disbanding the Senate.[/quote]

Boring and pointless. Imagine this scene playing out. EMPEROR: "Imperial Senate, I'm disbanding you all. Go home!" SENATOR ORGANA: "But how will you keep the peace without the bureaucracy?" EMPEROR: "The regional governors will have direct control over their systems. Fear will keep your systems under control! Fear of my battle station!" Now cut to Tarkin on the DS, reiterating the scene we've just watched. Is that brilliant cinema, or what? If your answer is "yes", smack yourself in the head and then re-evaluate your opinion.

[quote=Drewton]*Have the rebels mention Galen Marek.[/quote]

Who?

[quote=Drewton]*Use some TFU music.[/quote]

What?

[quote=Drewton]*Give 3PO a more shiny look.[/quote]

So C-3PO should be "more shiny" when he's on a desert planet encrusted with sand? I'm going to go with a resounding "No" on this one.

[quote=Drewton]*Redo all holograms.
*Redo the Twin Suns. Make the Luke-staring-at-suns scene look more like the ending of ROTS.
*Shoot new shots of Tunisia; add the actors from the original footage to these shots.
*Animate the banthas.
*Animate shots of the Death Star.
*Film new scene of stormtroopers destroying the Homestead. Either that or include TROOPS.
*Give cantina music a slightly more techno/bar-style.[/quote]

You're way off on every one of these pointless, unnecessary changes.

[quote=Drewton]*Replace some of the aliens in the cantina.[/quote]

Yes, replace them with the original werewolves and have done with it.

[quote=Drewton]*Remove the walrus man's blood.[/quote]

The shot doesn't "read" as a severed arm without the blood. It's a necessary cinematic conceit. Besides, Darth Maul gets a spray of blood when Kenobi slices him. Or should that scene be changed, too, to fit your inaccurate understanding of the way lightsabers work?

[quote=Drewton]*Replace the doctor's voice with someone else's.
*Change the lighting the cantina.[/quote]

Why?

[quote=Drewton]*Han shoots first.
*Improve animation for Jabba.[/quote]

Yes and yes.

[quote=Drewton]*Film new scene with Bail Organa on Alderaan. Make him look older with simple makeup.
*Redo the destruction of Alderaan sequence.[/quote]

Unnecessary and pointless.

[quote=Drewton]*Fix Luke's green lightsaber.
*Redo the dejarik players/pawns/whatever.[/quote]

Yes and whatever.

[quote=Drewton]*Animate space shots.
*Add new scene of Rebels vs. Empire.
*Film new scene with Juno Eclipse and PROXY. Use the same TFU actor for Juno and the same voice actor for PROXY.[/quote]

What?, Why?, and What the hell are you talking about?

[quote=Drewton]*Restore the Luke and Biggs scene.[/quote]

Spoils the pacing (which by your own admission is slow on Tatooine in the first place) and ruins the structure of the first act, which is Droids-->Luke-->Leia.

[quote=Drewton]*Completely redo Obi-Wan vs. Vader scene; make it more intense. This would be simple because Obi-Wan is hooded in this scene.
*Film/animate more rebel hangar shots.
*Completely redo Death Star attack. Films new shots of pilots.
*Show Vader's TIE Advanced crashing.
*Add a new scene just before the Yavin ceremony with Vader and the Emperor on Coruscant.
*Give Chewbacca a medal.
*PT music to use: Duel of the Fates (short cue), some notes from Battle of Heroes in new track for Vader vs. Obi-Wan, Across the Stars used once or twice for Luke, Imperial March used much more (not exactly PT, I know), some notes from The Tusken Camp/The Homestead for the discovery of Owen and Beru's fates.
*Film flashbacks of Order 66-surviving Jedi being hunted down.[/quote]

Unnecessary, pointless, no, why?, spoils the pacing, ridiculous, pointless, and no.

[quote=Drewton]More later.[/quote]

Let's hope not.

 

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Drewton  310 posts
Registered: Jan '09
49174_Darth Malak (91109)
Date Posted: 1/14 11:42am Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2. - Date Edited: 1/14 12:15pm (6 edits total) Edited By: Drewton
I don't know why you commented on every thing I said, but anyways...

posted:
None of the crawls of the other films "relate more to the events" of the previous film. The crawls fill in the gaps between the films; they don't re-iterate the events of the last one. Because, you know, that would be boring and pointless.


You misunderstood me. What I meant was to add small additions which would better connect ANH to ROTS. For example, "Darth Vader, a Dark Lord of the Sith who was once known as Anakin Skywalker" and "Emperor Palpatine, previously the Supreme Chancellor". Etc. Nearly two decades have past, so this film needs it more than any other of the saga

posted:
There are already several shots of Imperial Stormtroopers and Darth Vader boarding the ship. Perhaps you blinked continuously for several minutes, and missed these?]


I should have clarified: the shots being outside the ship.

posted:
No, no and no.


Well, that's your opinion. Everything in the list is simply my own opinion of what should be done.

posted:
Rather than changing these, perhaps Lucas should consider restoring the original versions of the blaster and explosion effects, which were considerably brighter and more intense.


I completely disagree with that (restoring them, to clarify).

posted:
The audio has been cleaned up sufficiently. It's time to leave it alone. Since this is the original film, I would hope Lucas would consider replacing the PT sound effects with some more closely resembling those found in the original.


Disagreed.

posted:
No, no, and are you kidding?


No.

posted:
Or, alternately, don't, since the above would be pointless and destructive to the pacing.


Once again, your own opinion.

posted:
Boring and pointless. Imagine this scene playing out. EMPEROR: "Imperial Senate, I'm disbanding you all. Go home!" SENATOR ORGANA: "But how will you keep the peace without the bureaucracy?" EMPEROR: "The regional governors will have direct control over their systems. Fear will keep your systems under control! Fear of my battle station!" Now cut to Tarkin on the DS, reiterating the scene we've just watched. Is that brilliant cinema, or what? If your answer is "yes", smack yourself in the head and then re-evaluate your opinion.


Completely disagree here. This would be the best opportunity to show the Emperor in ANH.

posted:
Who?


The main character of The Force Unleashed.

[quote=]So C-3PO should be "more shiny" when he's on a desert planet encrusted with sand? I'm going to go with a resounding "No" on this one.[/quote]

I didn't say to give him a more shiny look just on Tatooine. Tantive IV and the Death Star would both be fine places for him to "shine".

[quote=]The shot doesn't "read" as a severed arm without the blood. It's a necessary cinematic conceit.[/quote]

Right. I think it's easy to see that someone's arm has been cut off without blood.

[quote=]Besides, Darth Maul gets a spray of blood when Kenobi slices him. Or should that scene be changed, too, to fit your inaccurate understanding of the way lightsabers work?[/quote]

I haven't noticed that, but if so, then yes, that should be changed. Lightsabers cauterize wounds, FYI.

[quote]Let's hope not.[/quote]

Please, make your own list of what they should and should not do rather than going through and criticizing mine as if your opinions are fact. Everyone has their own opinions. If you don't agree with my suggestions, that's fine, I have no problem with that. I'm not saying my suggestions should, absolutely, happen no matter what anyone else thinks. Discussion is fine, but frankly, your post seemed to come across more as bashing. It seems like you don't want anything to be changed in the special edition whatsoever, anyway.

 

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jedimasterbac  6237 posts
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Date Posted: 1/14 1:20pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
Drewton posted:
Please, make your own list of what they should and should not do rather than going through and criticizing mine as if your opinions are fact. Everyone has their own opinions. If you don't agree with my suggestions, that's fine, I have no problem with that. I'm not saying my suggestions should, absolutely, happen no matter what anyone else thinks. Discussion is fine, but frankly, your post seemed to come across more as bashing. It seems like you don't want anything to be changed in the special edition whatsoever, anyway.


Merlin could have phrased his responses to you a little better, but I don't think they were bashing. Let's just ensure that we're having a discussion here, like you said, and this doesn't resort to anything tense. happy

 

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BarkingFrog  80 posts
Registered: Jan '09
7017_Bubo
Date Posted: 1/14 1:28pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
I disagree with pretty much every single change you suggested, but the biggest ones are:

- Why do you think it would be a good idea to reveal that Vader is Luke's father within the first 30 seconds of the first film? Just because we know the saga from beginning to end does not mean that there will never again be someone who is watching the movies for the first time.

- Palpatine has no place in A New Hope. Tarkin sums up the Emperor's involvement in 2 sentences.

- The Force Unleashed has no place in the saga at all.

 

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Drewton  310 posts
Registered: Jan '09
49174_Darth Malak (91109)
Date Posted: 1/14 3:38pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
jedimasterbac posted:
Drewton posted:
Please, make your own list of what they should and should not do rather than going through and criticizing mine as if your opinions are fact. Everyone has their own opinions. If you don't agree with my suggestions, that's fine, I have no problem with that. I'm not saying my suggestions should, absolutely, happen no matter what anyone else thinks. Discussion is fine, but frankly, your post seemed to come across more as bashing. It seems like you don't want anything to be changed in the special edition whatsoever, anyway.


Merlin could have phrased his responses to you a little better, but I don't think they were bashing. Let's just ensure that we're having a discussion here, like you said, and this doesn't resort to anything tense. happy


Well, when someone says,
posted:
Drewton posted:
More later.


Let's hope not.


I take that as bashing. But anyways, I hope I'm not sounding rude and my apologies if I am. I don't want to make this an argument.

BarkingFrog posted:
I disagree with pretty much every single change you suggested, but the biggest ones are:

- Why do you think it would be a good idea to reveal that Vader is Luke's father within the first 30 seconds of the first film? Just because we know the saga from beginning to end does not mean that there will never again be someone who is watching the movies for the first time.

- Palpatine has no place in A New Hope. Tarkin sums up the Emperor's involvement in 2 sentences.

- The Force Unleashed has no place in the saga at all.


- It's embarrasing, but honestly, I forgot about that...lol.

- Why not? After seeing the rise of the Empire in the previous episode and Palpatine being a major player, I think it's important we see him in the next episode. We'd all be scratching our heads if the episodes were made in order and the Emperor hadn't appeared in ANH. It would also be a chance to show Bail Organa going to Alderaan if a shot of him just its destruction would seem awkward. It would add just as much emotional impact.

- Galen Marek really needs a mention because of how important a figure he is for the Rebels (some people thought it was a continuity problem that no one ever mentioned him in the OT), and Juno and PROXY are both part of the Alliance, so that they would be good for cameos. They add as much (or as little) to the story as the mention of Quinlan Vos, but they're nods to the EU, and EU fans (such as me) love it.

 

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jedimasterbac  6237 posts
Title: CT and Fan Design Manager
Registered: Jun '04
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Date Posted: 1/14 4:28pm Subject: RE: Official Thread: Discussion of Potential Changes to the Classic Trilogy for Future Release, V.2.
Drewton posted:
- Why not? After seeing the rise of the Empire in the previous episode and Palpatine being a major player, I think it's important we see him in the next episode. We'd all be scratching our heads if the episodes were made in order and the Emperor hadn't appeared in ANH. It would also be a chance to show Bail Organa going to Alderaan if a shot of him just its destruction would seem awkward. It would add just as much emotional impact.


The Emperor is supposed to have shut himself off from the populace, using subordinates to carry out meaningless tasks like overseeing Senate meetings and stuff like that. If you have him go to the Senate just for that, it takes away from that mysterious Emperor quality.

Drewton posted:
- Galen Marek really needs a mention because of how important a figure he is for the Rebels (some people thought it was a continuity problem that no one ever mentioned him in the OT), and Juno and PROXY are both part of the Alliance, so that they would be good for cameos. They add as much (or as little) to the story as the mention of Quinlan Vos, but they're nods to the EU, and EU fans (such as me) love it.


They're only important retroactively. We shouldn't be throwing in stuff to the films ever time some EU author decides to come up with something or someone of importance to the rebels or the Empire.

 

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