Darth_Davi posted:Even if we are generous, and assume that Vader issues the withdraw command, AND that all of the Imperial forces listen, you still have the Death Star to deal with. You can't leave it in the hands of the Imperial Forces, nor does the Alliance fleet have enough personnel to leave even a skeleton crew on board. Granted, it would have been useful to still have the Death Star during the YV invasion in the EU, but for the movies, you would have to ask what happens to it. The rebel victory does not cheapen the throne room battle, either. There were two different fights going on, you had Rebels v. Imperials, and you had Jedi v. Sith. The throne room didn't win the war for the rebels, but it did serve to defeat the Sith. Luke's battle was not the Rebellion's battle. Once Luke started Jedi training, he was serving an even higher purpose than the Rebellion. Two separate, distinct battles going on, both needed to be resolved.
BigBoy29 posted:Darth_Davi posted:Even if we are generous, and assume that Vader issues the withdraw command, AND that all of the Imperial forces listen, you still have the Death Star to deal with. You can't leave it in the hands of the Imperial Forces, nor does the Alliance fleet have enough personnel to leave even a skeleton crew on board. Granted, it would have been useful to still have the Death Star during the YV invasion in the EU, but for the movies, you would have to ask what happens to it. The rebel victory does not cheapen the throne room battle, either. There were two different fights going on, you had Rebels v. Imperials, and you had Jedi v. Sith. The throne room didn't win the war for the rebels, but it did serve to defeat the Sith. Luke's battle was not the Rebellion's battle. Once Luke started Jedi training, he was serving an even higher purpose than the Rebellion. Two separate, distinct battles going on, both needed to be resolved. OMG ... that's rich.
Darth_Davi posted:I don't think Bigboy29 understands what I was saying...Had Luke been only serving the Rebellion, he would have stayed on Endor and helped Han & Leia destroy the shield generator. His actions in turning himself in to Darth Vader, and then consequently going before the Emperor had nothing to do with the battle between the Empire and the Rebels. With the shield generator's destruction, the Death Star, with Vader and the Emperor aboard, was going to be blown up anyway. His going there did not advance the Rebel mission. Luke actions were completely independent of the Rebel mission, he turned himself in for personal reasons, to try to convince his father, Anakin Skywalker, to cast away the Darth Vader persona that he had been wearing for the last 23 years, and to defeat the Sith. Luke was not trying to defeat the heads of the Imperial State. He was trying to defeat the Sith Lords. That they happen to be the same people is merely coincidence. Luke's mission as a Jedi Knight was to defeat the Sith, not to defeat the Empire. For Luke, the battle between the Jedi and the Sith was more important to him than the battle between the Rebels and the Empire. If that wasn't the case, he would have stayed on Endor and helped with the shield generator. His Jedi status represents a higher calling than being a Commander in the Rebellion forces. In fact, his actions probably could have warranted a court martial. A Commander, with detailed knowledge of the mission, and Rebel command structure willingly turn himself into the enemy? Borsk Fey'lya may have even considered it treasonous...Yet, Luke was serving the Force by his actions, even if it meant potentially compromising the Rebel mission. THUS, he was serving a higher purpose than the Rebellion.
Darthdias posted:well, to be fair, voodoopuuduu , it wasn't finished yet.
Darth_Davi posted: Luke's battle with Vader and Palpatine was that of a Jedi against Sith, not Rebel Commander against Imperial leaders. How you fail to see this, I cannot fathom.
TwiLekJedi posted:Though what with his constant refusal to kill his own father, I think it's safe to say that destroying the Sith wasn't his primary objective. He went to Vader just to make him turn back to the Light Side. He was disappointed that Darth "then my father is truly dead" Vader takes him to the Emperor - he didn't count on it. "When Luke enters, there are two Sith Lords, when he leaves there are none" is more of a correlation, really. All the time spent on the Death Star (except when he swings at the Emperor) is used to try to redeem Vader. Luke didn't destroy the Sith, Anakin did. Solely because of Luke, but that doesn't make it Luke's mission. In fact, he seemed to care little about the Emperor's presence either way.
