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Topic:
Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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FloridaFilmGuy
Registered:
May '00
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Date Posted:
5/10 9:47pm
Subject:
Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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Check it out
They are interesting.
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Shut up. You're boring everybody. Booooring.
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Phantom_Menace
Registered:
Apr '07
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Date Posted:
5/10 10:23pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
- Date Edited:
5/10 10:24pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Phantom_Menace
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Interesting read. Many of the faults of the film sounds familiar of what some would say about Episode I, II, III. Too much special effects and a story that goes nowhere. No matter, I don't think any of these criticisms can be applied to any of the episodes. But, what do I know. You would expect me to say that because I am a Star Wars fan.
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“'Star Wars' is fun, its exciting, its inspirational, and people respond to that. Its what they want.” - George Lucas
"I don't want to hear your wrong opinion." - Braden Boe
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voodoopuuduu
Registered:
Mar '04
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Date Posted:
5/10 11:50pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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A second view by Jennifer Rightmire, a freshman at Herndon High School:
Heh, the freshman high school girl got it right closer than the professional reviewer. 
Just shows how far from reality the professional reviewers are. Its like theyre in their own Galaxy Far Far Away sometimes.
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rumsmuggler
Registered:
Aug '00
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Date Posted:
5/11 4:08am
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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There is one black, Billy Dee Williams as a man who seems to have been set up with his own planet by the Small Business Administration and keeps complaining that he has "no choice" about betrayng everyone.
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Retcons = making the dumb stuff look even dumber.
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TwiLekJedi
Title: Classic Trilogy & YJCC Manager
Registered:
Jun '01
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Date Posted:
5/11 7:20am
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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"The Empire Strikes Back" has no plot structure, no character studies let alone character development, no emotional or philosophical point to make.
yeah, who are these Brackett, Kasdan, Kershner, Kurtz and Lucas hacks that they can ruin the Star Wars universe with this trite nonsense? I just doesn't offer anything at all.
and why does everyone always miss the "a long time ago" bit?
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FirBholg
Registered:
May '02
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Date Posted:
5/11 6:51pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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Judith Martin is better known as the author of the syndicated column, "Miss Manners". She is programmed for etiquette and protocol, not film criticism. All in all, that is a positive review. But Martin fails to mention that Shakespeare was pop-culture in his day. The hot dog of today may be the châteaubriand of tomorrow.
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F.I.G.S.
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Alpha-Red
Registered:
Apr '04
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Date Posted:
5/13 12:12pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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I can see some of what the first reviewer meant....ESB is somewhat of an oversized soap opera episode, with its only appeal being that it took place in the Star Wars universe.
So as far as movies go, I suppose it's true that it doesn't have that much substance....but as far as Star Wars movies go, it was brilliant.
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JEDI-RISING
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
5/14 8:29am
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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The first review sucked. shows there were bad critics in 1980 too.
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
5/15 1:58pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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So Ben Burtt was telling the truth after all?
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zombie
Registered:
Aug '99
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Date Posted:
5/15 4:26pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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Arawn_Fenn posted:
So Ben Burtt was telling the truth after all?
In what sense?
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I'll swallow your soul! --------------------------------- If you're gonna die, die with your boots on! -------------------------------- author of The Secret History of Star Wars http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
5/15 8:04pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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That TESB got bad reviews.
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The world will look up and shout, "Save us." And I'll whisper: "No". - Rorschach
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DarthDuckie
Registered:
Jan '04
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Date Posted:
5/15 9:14pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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You know how reviewers are. If something has massive and broad appeal it can't be considered arty enough to be appreciated by such elite viewers as themselves. It's certainly interesting looking back.
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Apathy is the glove into which evil slips its hand.
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A hero is a person who understands the responsibility
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Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon
Registered:
Dec '00
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Date Posted:
5/15 11:58pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
- Date Edited:
5/16 12:01am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon
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Gotta love internet fandom. Any review that isn't positive and/or glowing about one's beloved film/game/show is automatically a review that 'sucks' and the reviewer is 'far from reality'.
EDIT: Just to make clear, I did see the more intelligent responses to these reviews. But the other responses are the kind of thing that make me embarrassed to be posting on a Star Wars message board.
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the_immolated_one
Registered:
Sep '06
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Date Posted:
5/16 11:17am
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
- Date Edited:
5/16 11:31am (3 edits total)
Edited By:
the_immolated_one
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Jedi_Keiran_Halcyon posted:
But the other responses are the kind of thing that make me embarrassed to be posting on a Star Wars message board.
Then stop posting here if it embarrasses you.
As was mentioned earlier on this thread the women is just pretending to be a cineast when in reality her forte is etiquette not cinema. There is nothing wrong with a fan saying that this woman's critique sucks; however, one should elaborate as to why they believe it sucks.
I think she sucks because the following paragraph shows she has never studied American cinema:
"The Empire Strikes Back" has no plot structure, no character studies let alone character development, no emotional or philosophical point to make. It has no original vision of the future, which is depicted as a pastiche of other junk-culture formulae, such as the western, the costume epic and the Would War II movie. Its specialty is "special effects" or visual tricks, some of which are playful, imaginative and impressive, but others of which have become space-movie clichés.
has no plot structure
She's right it has no plot structure and that is because she is viewing the movie as a stand alone movie, but if you accept the belief that "Star Wars" is a group of episodic movies that are stylized after the old serials from the 30's and 40's; and if you ever watched those old serials then you'll notice that the first episode/chapter, for the most part, sets up the story and then the twelfth or fifteenth episode/chapter, for the most part, resolves the story while all the episodes in between are just the heroes and villians running around after one another. And if we look at "A New Hope" as the set up movie and "Return of the Jedi" as the movie that resolves all the issues then "The Empire Strikes Back" is just like the old serials where it is just the hereos and villians running after one another.
If Judith Martin was just the slightest bit of a cinema aficionado then she would have reconized "The Empire Strikes Back" as what it is and that it's postmodern art: A movie about movies. Just like "Once Upon A Time in the West" is postmodern art and is considered is some circles to be a masterpiece. But I'm betting Judith Martin would look down her nose at Sergio Leone just like she does George Lucas.
no character studies let alone character development
Again, this is only if you see "The Empire Strikes Back" as a stand alone movie. The apathetic character of Han Solo started to redeem himself in "A New Hope" and this is carried over into "The Empire Strikes Back" when he rescues Luke not by simply shooting an enemy from the comfort of his ship but by going out into a harsh environment with nothing but his wits to save Luke and himself. Then we see the next apathetic character: Lando Calrissian who will start down the path of redemption in "The Empire Strikes Back" and this character deveopment will be resolved in "Return of the Jedi" when Lando places himself in the lion's den to save his friend Han Solo. Both these once apathetic characters will be the leaders of the Rebel's victory over the Empire and we see that the Luke character is really just there to help bring the Ewoks and Rebels together and to help his father find his way back.
no emotional or philosophical point to make
Again, this is only if you see "The Empire Strikes Back" as a stand alone movie. To me the six movies together say something truly profound about the human experience but Lucas has packaged it in a children's fairy tale so the episodes don't drone on and on about: spirituality, free will, why people do cruel things to each other and can't just be happy together, because most children and adults would lose interest very fast. Like I said this woman is wrong on so many levels and she should have stuck to what she does best and that's telling people that if you have to rip one off then do your best to blame the person standing next to you.
It has no original vision of the future, which is depicted as a pastiche of other junk-culture formulae, such as the western, the costume epic and the Would War II movie.
I really don't have to even comment on this because it's so absuletly absurd but I will anyway. The days of spacemen in silver suits were over and George Lucas helped usher in the used universe but this lady just seems to be incapable of letting go of the past.
Its specialty is "special effects" or visual tricks, some of which are playful, imaginative and impressive, but others of which have become space-movie clichés.
Whatever that means? Which special effects are cliche? She doesn't bother to elaborate so why does she bring it up in the first place? It was like she just wanted to throw in a compliment just so she could tear it down. She really just brought it up so she could segue into the her next paragraph about a freaking hot dog.
So if "The Empire Strikes Back" is the good hot dog then what is the haute cuisine? Is "Bicycle Thieves" the haute cuisine? The neorealism stuff is good but I prefer cinema to take me away from reality not put me right where I already am.
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Vortigern99
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
5/16 11:53am
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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^ ^ 
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"I knew from the beginning I was not doing science fiction.
I was doing a space opera, a fantasy film, a mythological piece,
a fairy tale."--George Lucas
My "Vader's Origins" thread:
http://boards.theforce.net/Classic_Trilogy/b10002/8708417/p1
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drg4
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
5/16 11:20pm
Subject:
RE: Two 1980 reviews of TESB for your enjoyment
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Alpha-Red posted:
I can see some of what the first reviewer meant....ESB is somewhat of an oversized soap opera episode, with its only appeal being that it took place in the Star Wars universe.
So as far as movies go, I suppose it's true that it doesn't have that much substance....but as far as Star Wars movies go, it was brilliant.
I would argue that much like Disney’s Beauty and the Beast and Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon, ESB managed to completely and utterly transcend its family, insofar as it’s blessed with emotional profundity and consequence. (Though Revenge of the Sith has some very lovely passages of its own.)
There’s quite a bit of substance to Empire if you ask me. More than anything, it’s a story about a despotic father who aims to consume and pervert his virtuous children. A very Greek story: before the end, the god Vader defiles and ruins his daughter—entombing her prospective lover, and with him, any prospect for woman/motherhood—and castrates his son, subsequently forcing him onto the path of self-annihilation. Throw in the incestuous kiss and Yoda’s Sermon on the Mound, and you’ve got a comparatively sophisticated fantasy film. There’s so much at stake in Empire that it’s hard for me to think of it as a Star Wars movie, certainly not a precursor to ROTJ. It’s an aberration, a riff—from one who probably didn’t know Flash Gordon from Fu Manchu.
Want an interesting experience? Watch Empire, Blade Runner, and Pan’s Labyrinth in the same evening. They compliment each other beautifully.
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