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Topic:
People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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SoloFel_RebelGirl
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
1/2 6:14pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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iamobiwan1970 posted:
SoloFel_RebelGirl posted:
Kyp && Zekk, working together.
...Perhaps as Master && Apprentice?
Now that'd be an awesome duo, IMHO.
I wonder why KJA never capitalized on that possibility. After Zekk's darkside trip Kyp would have been old enough to mentor him and possibly be a master. Since KJA created them both I wonder why that never happened. Of course now Zekk needs his own student since he is 34.
Good point.
Though teh Kypster could still work with Zekk to make him a Master or something.
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Furyan_Jedi_13
Registered:
May '07
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Date Posted:
1/6 4:54am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Hey guys, I'm back after taking a few days off of these forums.
I have to be honest here: I have supported Zekk and Jaina getting together since YJK and I still do, but a few of your comments actually made sense to me, albeit in an unusual way.
Zekk is without a doubt one of the most moralistic and righteous Jedi of the new Order. He is also a great character and a loyal friend to those he cares about, especially one Jaina Solo. And yet, I can't help but wonder if he HAS been handled badly by the authors and fans alike. Maybe he has been portrayed as little more than "Jaina's lap dog" or something like that. And that made me think: does Zekk really deserve more than what that b!tch has been giving him?
I'm sure a number of you would say that he does, and part of me actually agrees with you. However, a part of me still wants very much to see Zekk finally win Jaina's heart. So right now, I really don't know what to expect, or even want. It's all so confusing.
And of course, we have to deal with those fans who say that Jaina is definitely going to marry Jag and their union will eventually produce the Fel dynasty, and so on. Nothing wrong with that, but I'm hoping that it turns out differently, if for no reason other than to see the reactions of those fans who are currently so sure of their theories. (No offense if you are one of them)
Besides, I've read Fury, and at the moment Jaina and Jag have decided to just be friends. I told my mother about these events, as well as the shipping wars, and she said that if she (Jaina) needed to do a bit of soul-searching to find the answer (which she DID do), and it was just that of friends, that's probably how it will stay.
Personally, what would you do?
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iamobiwan1970
Registered:
Aug '05
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Date Posted:
1/6 8:41am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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well Furyan, I'm not a romantic kind of person, so I think all of Jaina's ships are stupid if you put them in the real world context. For all of them, too many years have passed without any change or action. that's just dumb. I think they all need new romance! SW is really really lame when it comes to relationships. It messes up in many ways beyond just boy/girl.
Look at how they could have treated Zekk better. Like I said, Kyp could have mentored him.
I think chaotic-force has made a real valid argument. Zekk associates his Shadow Academy days with a sense of camraderie, belonging, and the sense that Brakiss was the father he never had (I'll get to that in a minute). Did Zekk ever get that respect at the Praxeum? I really don't think so. By the time he was there Luke had Mara to occupy his time and he was never ery good with disfunctional teens anyway! 
I mean look at his life. If he hadn't been found by the Shadow Academy he might never have been discovered as a force sensative and probably died on Coruscant. He also was treated with more favor and attention, from Brakiss than any other adult figure in the EU.
I'm not saying that Zekk want's to be a dark jedi, just that he must be very conflicted. The only people who gave him real authority and respect were part of the darkside. So part of him hasn't really renounced the darkside.
chaotic-force: That's the best insight to Zekk I've ever seen. Think about it. Secretly Zekk knows that it was as a dark Jedi that he found his place in the galaxy!
I do think the dark side calls to him constantly and that's why he so blatently denies it. But as for the self-loathing. He will never fully overcome it. I think it goes back to his childhood (pre-nine). I think Zekk may not have had very nice or caring parents. I think they raised him in such a way that it left him more susceptible to Brakiss' promises. I think his esteem was low (and Leia did nothing to improve it) and that he really never felt he belonged.
I wish we knew more of his childhood.
I still think he'll make a fine master. Most of the masters of the NJO have something wrong with them anyways!  Dispite his dark side dip he is the Obi-Wan of the NJO. 
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Neo-Paladin
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
1/6 9:25am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
- Date Edited:
1/6 9:28am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Neo-Paladin
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Hmm, well I do think that Zekk is aware he has more control of his life now as a Jedi with a strict moral code than as a Dark Jedi who was compelled to do things he didn't want to do. I also imagine he's embraced the idea that shades of gray really aren't a compromise between black and white, but white that's gotten black on it. I do think he's an absolutist.
Absolutism is fine (I'm one myself), but on this issue I belive Zekk needs to mature. He needs to motivate his moral code, not with fear or shame, but simply doing the right thing at the right time. A moral code shouldn't be about limitations or fear, but freeing oneself to live a good life and do the right thing (even if your ego wants something else at the moment).
I recall early in Shadow Academy, Zekk declaring he didn't want anyone's charity, when Jaina offered (her heart was in the right place, but come on). I don't think this self reliance ever left Zekk, and I really think he values his self-worth independent of how he is treated by anyone else. Frankly, I think he probably had the highest self esteem before he ever knew he was Force sensitive. He might have some lingering pride from being the Darkest Knight, for what he earned; but I don't think he associates that with the Dark Side persay.
Now, resentment towards the Solo's for having everything handed to them and being so great at everything because they were born sions of the Force? I could see a freighter-load of mixed feelings reguarding that entire family line... 
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Furyan_Jedi_13
Registered:
May '07
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Date Posted:
1/6 8:10pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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well Furyan, I'm not a romantic kind of person, so I think all of Jaina's ships are stupid if you put them in the real world context. For all of them, too many years have passed without any change or action. that's just dumb. I think they all need new romance! SW is really really lame when it comes to relationships. It messes up in many ways beyond just boy/girl.
Yeah. A lot of people that I talk to believe that the Star Wars authors have kind of screwed up the whole aspect of relationships in their little universe. And on starwars.com, there is now a discussion thread where we are saying whether or now Jaina is worthy to be the main protagonist for the rest of the LOTF series. I pointed out that shippers tend to downplay Jaina's role to "what guy will she hook up with". It's just becoming plain stupid at this point!
Anyway, back to Zekk!
I still think he'll make a fine master. Most of the masters of the NJO have something wrong with them anyways! tongue Dispite his dark side dip he is the Obi-Wan of the NJO. grin
You know what annoys me about certain fans? Many believe that just because Zekk brushed the dark side to save his friends, that Jacen will corrupt him to his side, and that Jag will actually kill Zekk! And a number of people actually say that they like this plot development! We need to find them and beat them up! Because Zekk will not die, and he will stay true to the light!
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Grand_Admiral_Sean8
Registered:
Jun '07
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Date Posted:
1/6 11:50pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Furyan_Jedi_13 posted:
And yet, I can't help but wonder if he HAS been handled badly by the authors and fans alike.
Character inconsistency is always one of the most exasperating aspects of a shared universe. It prompts the painful question: would we rather see our beloved characters misrepresented...or absent entirely from new material?
I'm a fencer, so, of course, my answer is always 'death before dishonor'. Tragic to say, but I'd rather see the Y.J.K. crew permanently retired than bungled.
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Grand_Admiral_Sean8
Registered:
Jun '07
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Date Posted:
1/6 11:55pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Furyan_Jedi_13 posted:
I pointed out that shippers tend to downplay Jaina's role to "what guy will she hook up with". It's just becoming plain stupid at this point!
Thank you so very much! The character should be about more than her romantic attachments...although, for obvious reasons, I'm partial to Zekk. But couplings aren't interesting unless the individual components have their own lives. Together we are stronger than the sum of our parts, but our parts have to have strength in order to contribute to the whole.
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Darth_Sabith
Registered:
Oct '06
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Date Posted:
1/7 6:09am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Furyan_Jedi_13 posted:
well Furyan, I'm not a romantic kind of person, so I think all of Jaina's ships are stupid if you put them in the real world context. For all of them, too many years have passed without any change or action. that's just dumb. I think they all need new romance! SW is really really lame when it comes to relationships. It messes up in many ways beyond just boy/girl.
Yeah. A lot of people that I talk to believe that the Star Wars authors have kind of screwed up the whole aspect of relationships in their little universe. And on starwars.com, there is now a discussion thread where we are saying whether or now Jaina is worthy to be the main protagonist for the rest of the LOTF series. I pointed out that shippers tend to downplay Jaina's role to "what guy will she hook up with". It's just becoming plain stupid at this point!
Anyway, back to Zekk!
I still think he'll make a fine master. Most of the masters of the NJO have something wrong with them anyways! tongue Dispite his dark side dip he is the Obi-Wan of the NJO. grin
You know what annoys me about certain fans? Many believe that just because Zekk brushed the dark side to save his friends, that Jacen will corrupt him to his side, and that Jag will actually kill Zekk! And a number of people actually say that they like this plot development! We need to find them and beat them up! Because Zekk will not die, and he will stay true to the light!
Well I for one would love to see Zekk become a sith...at lest for a time being. Jacen and Zekk are two of my favorite Characters in the EU although I don't want to see either of them die. Personnally I would like to see Cadeus lose his connection in the force gain it back just to lose it again then have him become this old hermit that slowly over the years relies the error's of his ways. Then after about 50 years of repentince he starts to regain his connection to the force and lives long enough to complete Cade Skywalkers training as a Jedi Knight.
Upon Completing Cades training have Jacen sacrifice himself to save his great great great nephew.
As for Zek I'd like him to become Empiror establish the begining's of the Imperial Knights eventually face Jaina and reviel to her that it's her fault that he became a sith in the first place. Maybe even have Zekk defeat her but not have it in him to actually kill her. Once pulled back into the light and deciedes to lead Ben, Jaina, and Luke to his "master" the 4 of them face of against Jacen who proves to be much stronger then possible until they Zekk locates the reason Jacen's power is so powerfull.
This object/sith spirit would try to crupt Zekk but the redeemed jedi proves to have overcome his dark tendancies and manages to destroy the sith Holocron that channels the power to Cadeus. Powerless once more Jacen is defeated and placed under arrest. Zekk is given the title Jedi Master and deciedes to hand over the empire to someone he believes worthy to rule it Jag and Jaina....naturally he leaves the jedi order to be the first true Imperial Knight.
Mean while Jacen manages to escape from the jedi prison but crashes on a deserted planet....from there it's the blog above....
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Neo-Paladin
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
1/7 12:43pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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I don't mean to rag on you or anything Sabith, but I just can't sign on to your vision. Quite the opposite really.
Zekk's story of overcoming darkness and searching for redemption is what makes him a hero, and to see him embrace the Darkside again would negate his entire narrative thus far.
Pardon the rant, but this simmers in my gut:
I look back fondly on the days when heroes didn't have to show the world their angst, or how conflicted they were, or even that they had feet of clay. They simply were content to be, and when there was a call to action they answered it. By no means were they perfect, but neither did their life have to be set to an NIN soundtrack.
Normally I wouldn't bring this preference for romanticism up, after all we all have different preferences. But this model of dark filled heroes has pervaded every medium until you can't find a hero who even fits in a white hat. I don't mind if a white hat gets dirty, frankly I think it adds character and history to the hat, but at least put it on! It's not too much to ask of our heroes, and its worth looking for the qualities of such a hero in ourselves.
I would rather see the Sith win, then fall to anything but a Jedi true to the philosophy and ideals of the light. I really do think Yoda was right, the dark is easier, but the light is more powerful. I just miss that from Star Wars so much.
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Just because your voice reaches halfway around the world doesn't mean you are wiser than when it reached only to the end of the bar.
Edward R. Murrow
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Grand_Admiral_Sean8
Registered:
Jun '07
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Date Posted:
1/7 2:34pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Neo-Paladin posted:
I look back fondly on the days when heroes didn't have to show the world their angst, or how conflicted they were, or even that they had feet of clay.
Thank the Force. You just expressed all of my exasperation with current Star Wars characterization. Mind you, I don't mind the current writing. I'm just tired of the soap-operatic teenybopper stereotype of the "angsty, conflicted hero".
I love flawed heroes. I even love a few gritty anti-heroes. But "angst" isn't about characterization; it's about marketing to a self-righteous, insensitive generation. We are afraid to acknowledge sensitive characters, because their pathos cuts too close to our own weakness. Properly "angsty" characters can only have socially acceptable emotions, the predictable kind that sound impressive on the page but don't reflect realistic personality.
So, suddenly, good characterization is "immature". I don't want perfect heroes, and I don't want imperfect heroes. I want human heroes.
Bless you, Neo-Paladin. 
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Darth_Sabith
Registered:
Oct '06
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Date Posted:
1/8 9:04am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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I do have to admit I miss the days when they had a knight in shinning armor be actually a noble. Caring about the people, fighting the monsters and what not. Now a days the knight is the monster which is a shame....no wonder there's no morals any longer.
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Grand_Admiral_Sean8
Registered:
Jun '07
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Date Posted:
1/8 10:56am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Amen to that, Darth Sabith! 
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Darth_Sabith
Registered:
Oct '06
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Date Posted:
1/8 11:05am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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Neo-Paladin I understand what you mean but I don't see anyone I'd like to have become Jacen's apprentice more...though I wouldn't keep him that for long and at the end he'd be forever free of the darkside. Although
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chaotic-force
Registered:
Feb '06
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Date Posted:
1/8 5:44pm
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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I have always felt that Zekk beleives in the Jedi Code more than any of the other Jedi of his generation. I think he draws a comfort from the Code and it's praise of peace and stability. It makes sense if you look at the chaos that dominated much of his childhood.
That being said, I think Zekk might leave to start his own order. He has no loyalty to the government, as the New Republic let him starve as a child on Coruscant, and the Alliance is so corrupt now. Even the NJO is slowly being corrupted as it's members make more and more morally questionable actions to fight Jacen. Jaina being the most obvious example of the emerging selfishness that is occuring.
The common problem with these groups is that they are ignoring it's weaker members. Jedi like Nelani die, but it takes Mara's death for Luke and Jaina to truly take action. I beleive Zekk might grow sick of the elitism and selfishness and leave.
I could see Zekk trying to creat a populist order. Or creating a new Jedi organization that works to protect planets that are neglected by the current order.
This is the only way I can see Zekk leaving and maybe becoming a figure that might even fight Jaina. Personaly I think a conflict between two factions of light Jedi might be more interesting than another conflict with the sith.
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Darth_Sabith
Registered:
Oct '06
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Date Posted:
1/9 5:55am
Subject:
RE: People Who Like Zekk _____ Coalition
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That would be instrusting to see indeed but I don't think they will do it...they always have the current jedi be correct with them fighting darksided and "flawed" jedi.
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