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Topic:
The Official TFN Archive Thread: Three new fics/two new covers for June :)
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Persephone_Kore
Registered:
Jan '06
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 11:46am
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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We're glad you like it, thanks! 
And that's a good question. The TFN Archive doesn't take any songfics or crossovers, partly for that very reason. The site owners and the founding archivists decided that although there are other creators who don't mind fanfic and there's plenty of public-domain stuff, that wasn't something the Archive staff could be expected to police, especially since copyright law does vary across countries.
The other reason, however, is that the TFN Archive was designed to be strictly a Star Wars archive, with no overt references to other works or even the real world. And that lets out songfics, crossovers, epigraphs from Shakespeare, and other "Earth references."
Earth references can be subject to interpretation, though. If you're not referring to a specific person, place, or thing, there's room for interpretation as to how much is simply the normal use of language and what constitutes an undue reference. I'm puzzled by people who want "the Star Wars word for bread" or something like that but use words like "sadistic" without blinking. I've run across people who object to calling a particular metal "copper" in a fantasy set in a world that never had Cyprus. (For the record, I would not reject a story for Earth references for using "sadistic," "maudlin," or even "quisling." Or, for that matter, "copper.") There's also room for debate sometimes as to what's a reasonable translation of a concept into Star Wars and what's too much like the real-life equivalent.
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Pallas-Athena
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 11:48am
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
- Date Edited:
9/11/07 11:56am (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Pallas-Athena
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We can't accept songfics, crossover fics (including crossovers with Earth), incomplete fics, actorfics, and brownie recipes. 
Edit: she stole ma thunder again!
Earthisms are indeed subject to interpretation. I tend to be a little loose on it. As, if Zahn had never wrote a SW novel, a fic with hot chocolate in it would have been rejected ...
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Persephone_Kore
Registered:
Jan '06
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 11:49am
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Right, those too.
But I think we can accept fics that include brownie recipes!
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Pallas-Athena
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 11:55am
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Providing the brownies are in character  And, interesting to note, as I mentioned above, chocolate exists in the GFFA, so get to writing, people!
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DarthIshtar
Title: Former CR
Registered:
Mar '01
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 1:09pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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What constitutes as a "crossover"? I submitted a fic featuring a character who is now "c-level canon" due to being a character in a Timothy Zahn book, but met her original incarnation as a Star Wars fanfilm character. How does that qualify for being rejected as a "Crossover"?
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Pallas-Athena
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 1:15pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
- Date Edited:
9/11/07 1:32pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Pallas-Athena
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Um, that you should PM the editors or the reviewer that read your fic. The answer to that question is a little too specific and relates more to your fic in particular.
Edit: To be more general, fan film characters, because they are not canon, are held at the same level as OCs. That is, they must be believable characters within the GFFA. Like an OC, any elements they have that can be considered crossovers will be. Any character that makes an appearance in the EU must also behave in tune with what they are shown as in that EU source.
Edit 2: Say for example, you took that small senate rotunda scene with ET and wrote a vignette during that scene of ET thinking about how much he misses Elliot and reeses pieces (which would be kind of awesome, don't get me wrong). This would be a problem, because it crosses with Earth and the movie ET. But, if you had ET, with a proper GFFA name, thinking about how right after this meeting, he's going to explore a new planet in another galaxy, but made no mention of Earth, it would be fine.
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DarthIshtar
Title: Former CR
Registered:
Mar '01
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 1:18pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Okay.
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ardavenport
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 3:23pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Pallas-Athena posted:
And, interesting to note, as I mentioned above, chocolate exists in the GFFA, so get to writing, people!
What???  Where is chocolate used in the GFFA? I must know the reference. 
I just try to avoid Earth slang, formal names and recent words to keep the tone GFFA in a story. I would never have anyone use a 'cell phone', but a bad guy might be 'sadistic' since the later term has been in use for so long that many don't know that it came form a specific person. One can always pick the ultimate language nit and ask why they're speaking English at all, but then you wouldn't have time for writing the fic in the first place.
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Pallas-Athena
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 4:01pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Somewhere in the first chapter of The Last Command. Couldn't tell you exactly where - I tossed the thing a while back, in small part, at least, to that. It completely threw me out of the book. I laughed at first, then was confused (like had Earth been found after RotJ?), then was angry.
I think this is the crux behind problems with Earthisms. The most definite sign of an Earthism is if it throws the reader. Every word in our language is part of a rich linguistics tradition that is forever mixed with history and culture. We can't deny that, but we can say that, given their context in our culture, some words are going to be less appropriate in the SW universe. Take for example, saber. Sabers are perfectly acceptable in SW, despite their ties to earth history. Following this path, katanas, swords, and knifes might also be perfectly acceptable, if just because they are basic terms in English. But if you start using words like cutlass and epee, those tend to draw more attention to the specific times and cultures where they were used. Much the same way, a character might go to market or even to the grocery, but he shouldn't be caught dead at a wallmart.
To sort of nullify this argument, though, fics are rarely rejected for crossover problems alone. I think, as a writer grows in the fandom and as a writer, word choice becomes less confusing and arbitrary.
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Persephone_Kore
Registered:
Jan '06
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 4:12pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Heh. I'd have lumped katana with the second group, if anything. I'd definitely say it's fine to use "knife" though.
But then, it's actually a bit of a pet peeve of mine when people feel compelled to make up words for things that already have an obvious one, or use a Star Wars "equivalent" that actually means the wrong thing. (It's okay to say "money." Ask Han. It's not always okay to say "credits." Ask Watto.  )
And Earth species really don't bother me, in fanfic or profic, though I'd get dubious if you start listing specific breeds of dog or something. You've already got humans; in a galaxy with thousands of planets, there's plenty of room for chocolate, ducks, and probably parsley, ostriches, lions, tigers, and bears. (Oh, my.) On the other hand, if undisguised Earth species are all over everywhere and the story stops feeling like Star Wars, then there's a problem.
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ardavenport
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 4:49pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Pallas-Athena posted:
Somewhere in the first chapter of The Last Command. Couldn't tell you exactly where - I tossed the thing a while back, in small part, at least, to that. It completely threw me out of the book. I laughed at first, then was confused (like had Earth been found after RotJ?), then was angry.
Hmmmmmmm, there seem to be more than one 'Last Command'. Is it this one?
The Last Command (Star Wars: The Thrawn Trilogy, Vol. 3) by Timothy Zahn (Paperback - Jan 1, 1994)
Or this one?
Star Wars: The Last Command by Mike Baron, Edvin Biukovic, and Eric Shanower (Paperback - Jun 2, 1999)
Either way, I would be reluctant to put chocolate into any of my fics. It is distinctly earth-like. Basically, if I wanted chocolate (or bananas or lettuce or mayonaise) I would just describe it, as is, and give it another name. I will use the ordinary names for really generic foods like cake or bread or grain or juice.
Not using earthisms sounds like something that would go into an Archives style guide. Is anything like that in the Archives FAQ.
Also, writing styles where POV changes in a scenes always seems to get rejected at the Archives. Shouldn't this preference be put into the FAQ as well?
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Pallas-Athena
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 5:07pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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er, sorry. It was Heir to the Empire, by Zahn, first in The Thrawn Trilogy.
Not using earthisms sounds like something that would go into an Archives style guide. Is anything like that in the Archives FAQ.
It's in the FAQ, 5d: Set exclusively within the Star Wars universe. All stories must be set in the Star Wars universe only. No crossovers with other media or the real world.
Also, writing styles where POV changes in a scenes always seems to get rejected at the Archives. Shouldn't this preference be put into the FAQ as well?
Good point. Since we can't, at this time, alter the FAQ, we put up the UFAQ, here. Once we manage to put up new guides, I'm sure it will be included officially.
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ardavenport
Registered:
Dec '04
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 5:18pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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OK, here's a quick emergency Archives question:
I just submitted a story to the Archives and now realize that I sent the wrong file. How do I retract it and re-submit?
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LLL
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 5:19pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
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Actually, that is not a preference, but part of good writing mechanics.
We're glad ppl are finding the thread helpful. A special thank-you goes to Atty, who wrote all this up and has been working hard on it for over a month.
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''Overall, to get a real deep, nuanced understanding of human behaviour, art is the best way.'' --Natalie Portman. Have a question or suggestion for the Archive? PM me anytime. 
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Pallas-Athena
Title: TFN Fan Fiction Archive Editor
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
9/11/07 5:37pm
Subject:
RE: The Official TFN Archive Thread
- Date Edited:
9/11/07 5:38pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Pallas-Athena
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ardavenport: Resubmit a completely new version (refill out the form, upload the file, etc). Email the editors and ask them to remove the first file. Two stories with the same name in the queue will cause us to pause and wait for the correction before reviewing anything.
LLL: *warm fuzzies* 
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