| Author |
Topic:
Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
Jada
Title: Chapter Rep
Charlotte, NC
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
8/22/07 2:48pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
I was thinking about that too and I know last year at the Holiday party we hosted at our house we had champagne and cranberry mixed together but I watched anyone under 21 like a hawk.  <---- [i]pretend it is a chicken hawk  ].
I speak to the parents of one of our members whenever we are going to be having outside of our normal meeting so that they are 100% completely aware of what is going on and what to expect. Then again, she is 17 and just got her license.
-----signature-----
Ward 316 | Proud member of Donkey Squad! Honey, you forgot your pants! ~ TK-2970  DZ-5232 Old Mother Tusken Carolina Garrison Charlotte Regional Representative http://www.heroes4heroes.org
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jada
Title: Chapter Rep
Charlotte, NC
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
8/23/07 1:19pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
I've been doing some research on liability and coming up blank.  Mostly all I can find is other Fan Clubs Waivers of Liability. Here is one from the Sierra Club:
To the fullest extent allowed by law, I agree to WAIVE, DISCHARGE CLAIMS, AND RELEASE FROM LIABILITY
the Sierra Club, its officers, directors, employees, agents, and leaders from any and all liability on account of, or in
any way resulting from Injuries and Damages, even if caused by negligence of the Sierra Club its officers, directors,
employees, agents, and leaders, in any way connected with this Outing. I further agree to HOLD HARMLESS the
Sierra Club, its officers, directors, employees, agents, and leaders from any claims, damages, injuries or losses
caused by my own negligence while a participant on the outing. I understand and intend that this assumption of risk
and release is binding upon my heirs, executors, administrators and assigns, and includes any minors
accompanying me on the Outing.
Another thing that they have is a sign in sheet with a built in Waiver:
sign in and waiver
Perhaps for a real cover your buttocks we could adopt a sign in sheet such as this and have a waiver?
I still agree that we might be best to also consult a lawyer. Anyone in FF/JC a lawyer?
-----signature-----
Ward 316 | Proud member of Donkey Squad! Honey, you forgot your pants! ~ TK-2970 DZ-5232 Old Mother Tusken Carolina Garrison Charlotte Regional Representative http://www.heroes4heroes.org
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
RedneckJedi
Title: Historian, JediOKC
Manager Emeritus
Registered:
May '02
|
Date Posted:
10/3/07 4:10pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
Hello, all. I am a representative of the MidSouth region's Oklahoma City "FanForce" fan club, JediOKC. It was brought to our attention by my city's RSA that my city's forum would be moved to inactive status due to forum inactivity.
I posted a reply to the RSA with questions about the nature of our FanForce status regarding this change, and what we might be able to do to maintain our status. The RSA cut-n-pasted the FanForce Rules as a response, and that answered all of my questions. Basically, our club no longer qualifies as a FanForce fan club.
However...
Our Star Wars fan club has had great success and dedicated membership for more than 6 years now. We hold meetings twice a month, with an average of 20 attendees per meeting. Our club has various fun and charitable events throughout the year, averaging 1 to 2 a month over a year's time (not counting meetings). While the FanForce forums helped get us started, they're woefully inadequate for an online and in-person community to discuss the different facets of Star Wars and club business. That is to say, the FanForce forums are too restrictive and, to be honest, antiquated. As a former manager of a FanForce forum, I’ve discussed this issue with the FanForce forums’ powers-that-be a few years ago. Today, little to nothing has changed... not that I expected it to based on their response back then.
Since our club started on FanForce forums, and because we have an online presence, we're glad to be a part of TF.N as a FanForce fan club, especially since TF.N is the largest online fan-based Star Wars website in the world. Now that our status is in obvious jeopardy, I had to determine if that status was worth saving.
What I gather from the rules is that a chapter gets a single online forum, forum moderation, rudimentary chapter “startup rules,” and the "right," I suppose, to call itself a FanForce fan club chapter. Is there anything more to being a FanForce fan club chapter? That is to ask, what does it mean to be a FanForce fan club chapter? What is the purpose of FanForce? FanForce has rules, but no goals, vision, or mission statement. If the implied goal is to support online and in-person Star Wars fandom, then it has failed in the case of the successful Star Wars fan club I'm a member of. Our club, in my estimation, adheres to at least 90% of the FF rules. At this point, my criticism begins.
FanForce rules Articles 1 and 6 contain rules that are particularly damning to such clubs that choose to start their own forums out of necessity. This policy punishes success. Our club's own website offers an online calendar, forums broken into logical sections, links to related online content, and the ability to post and enforce our own local club's policies which may or may not conflict with, or have different restrictions than, FanForce's. Once a club starts its own forums, what sense does it make for its club members to post in another forum?
It’s ambiguous whether or not FanForce can impose jurisdiction or authority offsite from its forums. Article 6 of the FF rules essentially states "FF is not responsible for offsite forums in the matters of dispute settlement and our protection." Well, not directly. But if a club is truly a FanForce fan club, how does FF resolve disputes and protect such club members when it comes to offsite, offline activities such as in-person club meetings and events? That's where Article 12 comes in. FanForce mandates in-person activities based on “rules more strict" than the FanForce forums’ in spite of inadequate or nonexistent rules for such in-person activities. In what way does in-person rules and enforcement differ from offsite, online forums? The CR Code of Conduct is inadequate (it basically says you have to “be nice” and follow the FanForce forum Terms of Service) and only applies to the CR and the club chapter’s officers. The FF Terms of Service only apply to the forums, and not in-person activities. Also, no rules for dispute settlement exist. It occurs to me that conduct and dispute settlement is based on the opinion of the GSA, RSA, and/or CR privy to a given in-person event. Also, considering there is only one CR per city, bias on the CR's part can lead to improper sanctions made by a GSA or RSA (as it so happens, no GSA or RSA ever attended one of our club's meetings). Ultimately, though... the only sanction levied against any violation incurred is a forum ban. I'm not sure just what kind of "protection" FanForce otherwise provides. Even still, if a FanForce CR can be a member of a club that meets in person, why can’t they also be a moderator/administrator of that club’s own forum as an extension of FanForce?
Article 7 states that club officers are to be elected, but no election method is recommended and no offices are specified. Furthermore, duties, responsibilities, and the level of authority granted each office within the chapter and in FanForce as a whole are not specified.
To be honest, FanForce status has made no difference whatsoever in our club's success other than the initial online forum location, and the exception that some people were redirected to our website from the FanForce forum. Noone outside of FanForce has any idea what “FanForce” means. If our club touted itself as a FanForce fan club chapter at a club event, I'd get a blank stare and a shrug. The average person would ask, "It's obvious you're a Star Wars fan club, but what does 'FanForce' mean?" What would I say?
A small concern I also have is that since our club will lose its Oklahoma City FanForce forum, what happens if someone else from our club’s area, but not in our club, chooses to restart the Oklahoma City FanForce forum? Even with our club events and a few local television appearances, we still manage to miss Star Wars fans who'd be interested in joining a local Star Wars club. It occurs to me that FanForce would allow a club startup (knowingly or not) to assume Oklahoma City's FanForce forum.
So, to summarize my questions:
- Once a club starts its own forums, what sense does it make for its club members to post in another forum?
- If a FanForce CR can be a member of a club that meets in person, why can’t they also be a moderator/administrator of that club’s own forum as an extension of FanForce?
- What happens if someone else from our club’s area, but not in our club, chooses to restart the Oklahoma City FanForce forum?
- What does it mean to be a FanForce fan club chapter?
- What is the purpose of FanForce?
-----signature-----
--Redneck Jedi (JediOKC Council Member) JediOKC >>> http://www.jediokc.com Star Wars:TCG fan site >>> http://www.rebelbasers.com
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jada
Title: Chapter Rep
Charlotte, NC
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
10/3/07 5:38pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
RedneckJedi posted:
FanForce rules Articles 1 and 6 contain rules that are particularly damning to such clubs that choose to start their own forums out of necessity. This policy punishes success. Our club's own website offers an online calendar, forums broken into logical sections, links to related online content, and the ability to post and enforce our own local club's policies which may or may not conflict with, or have different restrictions than, FanForce's. Once a club starts its own forums, what sense does it make for its club members to post in another forum?
Actually, if your club was to make announcements of meetings and activities on this forum and if the club's Chapter Representative (seems to be you at this point) would keep in touch with the RSA on a fairly regular basis (is once a month to much to ask?) this would keep your forum current and fulfill your status as a fan force club. Having offsite forums is perfectly acceptable as long as you keep the one on these boards updated with announcements.
RedneckJedi posted:
Even still, if a FanForce CR can be a member of a club that meets in person, why can’t they also be a moderator/administrator of that club’s own forum as an extension of FanForce?
I think that as a Manager Emeritus you know the limits of snowboards and that they cannot isolate moderator abilities to one forum. A great many CRs would love to be able to sticky their own threads, unlock threads, change titles, etc. This just isn't the way these boards are set up. And I, for one, don't see Fan Force leaving theforce.net just so that we can give CRs the ability to moderate their chapters.
If chapters do set up offsite forums they can either a) give the RSA moderator powers or b) make sure the RSA has access to every forum on the offsite so that they can see exactly what is going on.
Yes, Fan Force has to rely on the written word of the CR and others as to the situation. But consider this. If a member shows up to a meeting and threatens another member and this is done in a public place (say Barnes and Noble) then not only will there be the word of the CR but there should at least be a Security Report that documents what happened.
Also if the CR is acting inappropriately other members of the chapter can let the RSA know.
RedneckJedi posted:
Article 7 states that club officers are to be elected, but no election method is recommended and no offices are specified. Furthermore, duties, responsibilities, and the level of authority granted each office within the chapter and in FanForce as a whole are not specified.
As far as I know the only two positions that I have seen defined are the Chapter Representative and the Treasurer. As for other position I believe it is up to each chapter to define them. Some chapters have a Historian who is the club photographer. Other chapter's Historians take notes at the meetings. Another chapter might have a Events Coordinator while others don't.
RedneckJedi posted:
What happens if someone else from our club’s area, but not in our club, chooses to restart the Oklahoma City FanForce forum?
Again, your club doesn't have to lose its forum. All you have to do is maintain announcements and event notifications. I can't answer for the Old Folks Home but that has been my understanding of the requirements.
As to your other questions, I believe I'll let someone else take a shot at it. 
-----signature-----
Ward 316 | Proud member of Donkey Squad! Honey, you forgot your pants! ~ TK-2970 DZ-5232 Old Mother Tusken Carolina Garrison Charlotte Regional Representative http://www.heroes4heroes.org
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
gandalfbmg
Title: Retired Councilor Alliance KC, MO FF
Registered:
May '02
|
Date Posted:
10/3/07 7:39pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
RedneckJedi: I've never met you but I'm the recently-former CR of the KC chapter just up the road a ways. I'm glad to hear someone making these points because when this came up I made a lot of the same arguments, but I would say 'to Jada you listen'. If you're willing to play ball a little bit on the stuff she mentioned, you can have your foot in both 'worlds'. Our chapter's council and former council members discussed it at length and there are a lot of benefits to being FanForce. For one, there ARE people that recognize the name, namely members of other chapters and of other fan groups (such as the Rebel Legion and 501st). It give us a measure of 'legitimatcy' in the eyes of these groups and other entities we may deal with. And when people move, they have another chapter to call home. We've had people move to KC from other cities and they 'transfer' their membership and have a built in support base when they come to a new city, and we have contacts when we visit many other cities around the region as well.
If you ever want to discuss, please feel free to drop me an email or PM to know you have an sympathetic ear.
-----signature-----
Treasurer - http://www.heartofthealliance.net PR Officer - Dantooine Base, Rebel Legion Avid Listener - http://www.radioparadise.com
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
RedneckJedi
Title: Historian, JediOKC
Manager Emeritus
Registered:
May '02
|
Date Posted:
10/4/07 2:12pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
I appreciate your responses! While I'm not the CR of my FanForce chapter, another "council member" of our club is. It is the estimation of our RSA that event announcements aren't enough, and the RSA is adhering to the letter of the FanForce rules. In other words, we need online social activity on our FF forum of at least 3 unique individuals per month. In my original diatribe above, I forgot to mention that except for a lapse in September, I posted event announcements for each month at the beginning of each month for over a year.
When it comes to particularly large events, our club usually only shows up to "experience the proceedings," and doesn't promote itself beyond our t-shirts, business cards, and word-of-mouth. We usually have a formal club presence to promote ourselves at smaller, more local, events, where we never encounter other FanForce clubs (wink, wink, DFW). As far as "legitimacy" goes, and I'm not wholly disagreeing with you gandalf, there aren't many hoops to jump through to become a FF chapter. Again, it's just 3 people in a common area/city with the desire to meet in person quarterly, and to post in their area's forum. The real problem every single fan club faces is maintaining membership and solvency. Many grassroots startups tend to rally around specific events or particular ascepts of fandom (books, games, costuming, trivia, etc.) and then fade away along with the event "high", as members drop due to lack of interest, or the next "big thing" comes along that grabs their attention. Our club membership swelled considererably in the months before and just after ROTS was released. A year later, we never heard from most of those people ever again. That's something of a segué, but my point is if I did bump into another FanForce fan club chapter, and I said, "Hey, I'm in a FanForce chapter, too!" what more is there to say? Besides being an ice-breaker, I don't see it any different than bumping into another Star Wars fan club member and saying, "Hey, I'm in a Star Wars fan club, too!"
I've been discussing this with my fellow council members, and we're in agreement that attempting to maintain "social activity" on the FF Board provides little return for the effort invested. I'll discuss it with the RSA, to see if we can compromise with the monthly Event announcements. Otherwise, we're going to just let it go... but keep an eye on the that forum in case it gets revived.
-----signature-----
--Redneck Jedi (JediOKC Council Member) JediOKC >>> http://www.jediokc.com Star Wars:TCG fan site >>> http://www.rebelbasers.com
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jada
Title: Chapter Rep
Charlotte, NC
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
10/4/07 3:09pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
You can also talk to Dajuan (whom I'm sure appreciates me volunteering her ).
It was my understanding that if chapters had an offsite that they had to at least keep up with announcements, etc. here.
I can see your frustration from the point of view.
As far as what can being a Fan Force do for you, I know I have friends all over the US from Fan Force. I have visited other Fan Forces when I've gone through their areas (I even spent one night of my honeymoon hanging out with the Albuqureque Fan Force  ). Then again, I make the effort to try to get to know other fan forces. Not everyone is as spammy . . . I mean social as I am. 
Hopefully someone from the Old Folks Home will chime in here soon and address some of your concerns.
-----signature-----
Ward 316 | Proud member of Donkey Squad! Honey, you forgot your pants! ~ TK-2970 DZ-5232 Old Mother Tusken Carolina Garrison Charlotte Regional Representative http://www.heroes4heroes.org
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jedi_Dajuan
Title: •Admiral of FanForce
•RPG & Minis Forum
Registered:
Dec '02
|
Date Posted:
10/4/07 4:09pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
|
I've been following the thread but been so busy with work that I've not gotten a chance to respond. I'll try to write out something more than this tonight. Sorry work's just been kicking my ass lately.
-----signature-----
EV got me demoted, a winnar is him "you will quickly be known as the cool teacher. just be sure to start of the clas by explaining to all students they are to address you as the admiral." -- jedi_knight_birr Ok, this is why evolution is bunk. You're
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jada
Title: Chapter Rep
Charlotte, NC
Registered:
Apr '06
|
Date Posted:
10/12/07 5:14pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
Redneck Jedi, this is something that Dajuan had used at C4 for letting people know what Fan Force is. I think it is the definition and purpose you are looking for.
The FanForce Forums, on the other hand, are all about organizing real life meetings with fellow Star Wars fans. The forums are an online tool to help members plan events, recruit new members, get the word out about their chapter, and socialize with fans near and far. Members are encouraged to post in other FanForce forums and make connections with fellow fans across the world.
Does that help?
-----signature-----
Ward 316 | Proud member of Donkey Squad! Honey, you forgot your pants! ~ TK-2970 DZ-5232 Old Mother Tusken Carolina Garrison Charlotte Regional Representative http://www.heroes4heroes.org
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
RedneckJedi
Title: Historian, JediOKC
Manager Emeritus
Registered:
May '02
|
Date Posted:
11/1/07 1:54pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
Jada posted:
Redneck Jedi, this is something that Dajuan had used at C4 for letting people know what Fan Force is. I think it is the definition and purpose you are looking for.
The FanForce Forums, on the other hand, are all about organizing real life meetings with fellow Star Wars fans. The forums are an online tool to help members plan events, recruit new members, get the word out about their chapter, and socialize with fans near and far. Members are encouraged to post in other FanForce forums and make connections with fellow fans across the world.
Does that help?
That answers my question about purpose, but technically, no... it doesn't help. As written, the FanForce club membership rules do not support established Star Wars fan clubs that have outgrown the limited and antiquated forums TheForce.Net provides. That's a harsh criticism, but I'm not slamming TFN by any means... I'm merely stating a fact. These forums serve a great purpose by allowing a network for Star Wars fans, but even StarWars.com has similar content-based and region-based forums that can do the same.
As a forum admin myself, layered sub-forums add very little mass to a database and underlying code, and administration of such is quite simple. To me, adding this would be a boon to TFN and make it less necessary for clubs to search for other answers to their online socializing and planning needs.
-----signature-----
--Redneck Jedi (JediOKC Council Member) JediOKC >>> http://www.jediokc.com Star Wars:TCG fan site >>> http://www.rebelbasers.com
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jedi_Dajuan
Title: •Admiral of FanForce
•RPG & Minis Forum
Registered:
Dec '02
|
Date Posted:
11/1/07 2:47pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
|
Considering you were a mod here for a couple years you should know the limitations that we have here. The admins have no way to change the coding of the forums, only IGN or zerosleep can do that. It has nothing to do with the load it would put on the database. We have asked IGN to add in the features you are describing, but it's not a high priority for them so it hasn't been done. It's something we can't change, though we really wish we could.
-----signature-----
EV got me demoted, a winnar is him "you will quickly be known as the cool teacher. just be sure to start of the clas by explaining to all students they are to address you as the admiral." -- jedi_knight_birr Ok, this is why evolution is bunk. You're
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Allie Fox
Title: FanForce CR
Macon GA US
Registered:
Jan '00
|
Date Posted:
2/6 7:41am
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
|
This discussion is interesting to me as I am seeing more than a few forums in the Southeast disappear too. I haven't seen my own forum threatened but I also try to maintain some contact with FanForce by posting meeting announcements when I remember.
Our group, The MACON CLONES, have also moved on to our own site with a club specific messageboard but I still think it's important to check in here once in a while just to see if there have been any new folks checking us out(there has not!).
I liken FanForce to a parent that has certain rules you have to follow while you live under their roof. Eventually you grow up and move out. (Some do. This IS Star Wars we are talking about and there is no telling how many of us still live in their parents' basement ). Just because we have moved out does not mean that we shouldn't have any further contact. I still see my parents every now and then.
We have been self supporting since about six months after gaining "FanForce Status" and the message board here is rarely used for "general zaniness." But I still check in and post once in a while just to let people know the we are still around especially those who might be looking for our type of interaction.
I don't think FanForce pries into the affairs of individual clubs. Do they? I've been CR for for five years and have only heard from each RSA about a half dozen times, if that many. I post info on the board, I've asked for our meeting info to be posted to the main page and had the design for our forum updated and personalized. That's it.
All I'm saying is. . .
Move out of FanForce's basement. Go ahead. BUT!, don't be a stranger.
-----signature-----
Visit the Clone Home at http://www.maconclones.com Don't Be Like Everyone Else. Be A CLONE!
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
Jedi Trace
Title:
• SouthEast RSA
• Fan Fiction Manager
Registered:
Dec '99
|
Date Posted:
2/17 7:32pm
Subject:
RE: Updated FF Rules Q&A thread
- Date Edited:
2/17 7:47pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Jedi Trace
|
Allie Fox: Sorry to be so late in responding, but to answer your comment about moving away from TFN -
"FanForce" is an entity of FanForce.Net/TheForce.Net. Yes, it is about meeting fellow fans in your area but it is also about being part of the entire global community of FanForce.
Off-site boards are fine as long as a group does not isolate itself completely from the TFN FanForce community.
The spirit of TFN’s FanForce is to be a part of a global community of like-minded fans. If a group is not participating on their board here, then they are not a TFN FanForce - they are a local Star Wars fan club. And that’s not a bad thing. Any Star Wars fan club is a friend of mine. However, to justify the use of TFN’s free bandwidth, there are guidelines in place for maintaining TFN FanForce status.
-----signature-----
Captain of the Cade Brigade  “Light, dark – They are just directions. Do not be fooled that you stand on anything other than your own two feet.” ~ Shaak Ti, The Force Unleashed The Society for Girls Who Like Things that Go Boom
|
Locked Topic |
Active Topic Notification |
Private Message |
Post History
|
 |
|
