| Author |
Topic:
Fan Fiction's Future
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obi_ew
Registered:
Apr '02
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Date Posted:
6/29/05 4:56pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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Renata posted:
Obi-ew, I can only say that I have talked to many, many people whose viewpoint of what has happened is VERY different from yours, completely opposite, in fact.
Could you clarify that please? Viewpoint on what?
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In Loving Memory Of CC  Price of Courage- Obi/Whie/Luke- http://boards.theforce.net/The_Saga/b10476/20124958/?37 Updated 4/20 Finally!!
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DarthBreezy
Title: Retired Mos Everett Cantina Founder & JMPR
Registered:
Jun '02
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Date Posted:
6/29/05 5:01pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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Mistress_Renata posted:
The fact that a mod HAS the ban button means that he or she must be very careful of when and how it is used. I let people say things to me that I would never let them say to another user, because I knew that if I (justifiably) banned them, they would spread the word to their "clique" that I was just being vindictive and unjust.
Well again, the COMMON SENSE APPROACH would be to treat it as you would as a USER, something even a MOD is first and formost. You take it to other mods and say "I believe this person is [flaming/baiting/harrasing] me, can you check it out?
In the end, the truth will come out and the matter will get resolved.
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Although the singer is silent, There is still the truth of the song. http://boards.theforce.net/beyond_the_saga/b10477/28747916/p1/ Sailing little Boats - with GoldenJedi Anywhere is possible.
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TKeira_Lea
Registered:
Oct '02
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Date Posted:
6/29/05 5:11pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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Mistress_Renata posted:
I let people say things to me that I would never let them say to another user, because I knew that if I (justifiably) banned them, they would spread the word to their "clique" that I was just being vindictive and unjust.
You just said you let them say things because you knew that if you banned them, they would spread the word. You didn't say they told you they were going to go to their friends and get you. And if that was really a problem I'd have to concur with Breezy that you should have gotten help from another mod or admin. Besides, as a mod you should be able to deal with the fact that people are going to take their issues back to their friends. It happens all the time. It's your responsibility to accept that truth and still do your job.
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LadyPadme
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Sep '02
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Date Posted:
6/29/05 7:31pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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I let people say things to me that I would never let them say to another user, because I knew that if I (justifiably) banned them, they would spread the word to their "clique" that I was just being vindictive and unjust.
I'm sorry you felt that way, Renata. Yes, I've let things slide that were said to me that I would not have allowed were they said to others, but I did so because I felt that as the person in authority, I should have enough sense to be able to judge when a person was venting vs being truly malicious.
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Crest MD Naimé Evil Twin of Gabri_Jade  When a baby smiles the world is happy  VOTE OBAMA '08
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Myri_Antilles
Registered:
Aug '04
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Date Posted:
6/29/05 10:35pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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I don't want to focus so much on the words that are being used that we lose sight of what's actually being said. You know, whether or not we use the word "bullying" or some other word really isn't that big an issue in the larger scheme of things... my suggestion is that we all just "agree to disagree" and maybe get creative and use our thesauruses.  
I think what's being said is that *sometimes* it's easier for mods to ignore users who cause trouble, be it one time or many, thus creating *temporary* peace. Now, I'm not saying *anyone* in here is a problem user.
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big sis of Myra  adopter of Jedi_Tigris | Master to correllian_ale padawan sis of MysteriousRaven13, Jaina_Solo_15, and any other padawans my crazy master gets "boys can't live with 'em, can freeze 'em in carbonite" - Jaina_Solo_15
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TKeira_Lea
Registered:
Oct '02
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Date Posted:
6/30/05 7:59am
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
- Date Edited:
6/30/05 8:00am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
TKeira_Lea
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Since we seem to have stalled here, how about one question at a time? Work to resolve it then move on. From the opening post…
LadyPadme posted:
1) Role of moderators within fan fiction – more hands-on or hands-off, role of policemen only or guides as well? How involved and what kind of role do you want the moderators to play
And shame on me I never addressed the topic before! 
I want the moderator to be a user first and foremost. Participate in discussions. Have an opinion. Be a role model. I want them to at least have been around enough that users have seen them, that the mod isn’t a great mystery. Hands-on there I suppose.
I want a moderator to give threads in Resource a chance to balance socialization and on-topic discussion. A little hands off.
I want moderators to enforce the rules and only the rules. There will always be a reason for shifts in policy and rules, but a moderator should always explain them. I want moderators to heed the concerns of users whether made via PM or public post, but also recognize that not everyone may have weighed in, so then it is their obligation to see if the opinion of the few reflects the opinion of the masses.
I want moderators to be policemen not lawmakers.
Let's move this puppy forward... 
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DarthBreezy
Title: Retired Mos Everett Cantina Founder & JMPR
Registered:
Jun '02
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Date Posted:
6/30/05 8:02am
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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TKeira_Lea posted:
I want moderators to be policemen not lawmakers.
[Ophelia] If you wish to be our sitter
Please be sweet, and never bitter
Help us with maths and book reports
[McEwok] Might I add, eat my shorts
[LadyPadme] Ewok!
[McEwock] Just cuttin' through the treacle
[Jesina] If users's fussy, don't avoid her
[DarthIshtar] Let me get away with moider
[Shandi] Teach us songs and magic tricks
[Drabbofet] Might I add, no fat chicks!
[Leona] Drabbo!
[TKL] The nanny we want is kindly and sage
[Philwise] And one who will work for minimum wage
[DarthBreezy] Hurry, nanny, things are grim -
[*insertBitterexmodofchoice*] - I'll do it!
[All] Anyone but him!
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Although the singer is silent, There is still the truth of the song. http://boards.theforce.net/beyond_the_saga/b10477/28747916/p1/ Sailing little Boats - with GoldenJedi Anywhere is possible.
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LadyPadme
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Sep '02
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Date Posted:
7/1/05 7:00pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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In the interest of not letting this forum drag on forever, I'm going to put a timeline onto things. I'm going to keep this thread open until Tuesday, July 5 at 6PM board time. If there are things you would still like to discuss regarding the following issues:
1) Role of moderators within fan fiction – more hands-on or hands-off, role of policemen only or guides as well? How involved and what kind of role do you want the moderators to play
2) Mod presence/sociability – how important is it that moderators be seen within the community?
3) Possibility of creation of a senate – instead of having moderators creating rules for things such as the interspecies guidelines, would you like an intermediary body of users create policy for mods to enforce?
4) Direction of fan fiction for the future – where would you like fan fiction to be in six months or a year from now?
Or, if there are other points you'd like to bring up to discuss fan fiction's future, please do so as soon as possible. If an active discussion is ongoing by Tuesday evening, we can re-evaluate whether or not the thread should remain open. However, if there are just loose ends left for discussion but that are not important enough to affect over all policy, the discussion can be moved back into Resource, where all users can have a chance to go over the issues.
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Crest MD Naimé Evil Twin of Gabri_Jade When a baby smiles the world is happy VOTE OBAMA '08
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ophelia
Registered:
Jun '02
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Date Posted:
7/1/05 9:20pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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Just a re-statement, really:
I would like to see moderators in largely a passive monitoring role. They don't need to be *doing* tons of things in the community, but they need to be *aware* of what's going on. That way, when they do have to act, they can do it early and in the right places to head off trouble.
I'd also like to see a shift in focus away from reactive modding, in which messes are cleaned up and punishments handed out after something has gone wrong, to preventive modding, in which problems are stopped before they spiral to the mess-and-punishment phase. I realize our mods already do much of this, and that it's not possible to predict all problems before they happen. However, I'd like to see a continued movement in that direction. This would likely require some reorganization of the way fanfic operates, and would therefore come with risks, as all change does. I hope our recent negative experiences haven't caused us to back away from risk-taking permanently.
Finally, the perception that mods are friendly and available is a preventive measure in itself, and high amounts of social activity is one way to encourage that perception. However, we've had successful mods in the past who weren't tremendous extroverts at all. They all contributed *something* to the community, whether it was maintaining popular threads, organizing fun activities, keeping informational threads organized and up-to-date, posting in story threads, or what have you, but they didn't all have highly sociable personalities. If we restrict our choices to only those whose natural style leans toward high-volume posting, I think we'll lose out on the service of some valuable community members.
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TKeira_Lea
Registered:
Oct '02
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Date Posted:
7/2/05 4:38am
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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ophelia posted:
However, we've had successful mods in the past who weren't tremendous extroverts at all. They all contributed *something* to the community, whether it was maintaining popular threads, organizing fun activities, keeping informational threads organized and up-to-date, posting in story threads, or what have you, but they didn't all have highly sociable personalities. If we restrict our choices to only those whose natural style leans toward high-volume posting, I think we'll lose out on the service of some valuable community members.
I think that's a great point. Looking back, most of the call for mod's to be more visible came from a lack of trust. Just one or two ways that a mod is seen - and seen acting in a personable and approachable manner - would have made people feel easier about approaching that mod if a problem would arise. Take the problems in Saga - Why didn't people PM mods with the stuff they saw? The only reason I can think is that they just didn't feel comfortable approaching mods about it because they had no reference to how the mods would react.
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Healer_Leona
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
7/2/05 8:26am
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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1) Role of moderators within fan fiction – more hands-on or hands-off, role of policemen only or guides as well? How involved and what kind of role do you want the moderators to play.
As I've stated in the first FG while I'd love to have ideas for all sorts of fun games, challenges and the like I don't, nor do I believe the fourms need nor want the mods to be regulators of all that goes on. I believe most users would prefer the policman approach as I would as well.
2) Mod presence/sociability – how important is it that moderators be seen within the community?
Perhaps my post in Moderator Accountability is best served here.. While mod activity is still somewhat of an odd expectation in some respects, it has proven obvious that being visible beyond the strict modding actions gives the users the feel of being approachable and a part of community both of which are beneficial in modding.
Live and learn... I'd like to think I've found a nice little balance in being visible and sociable. in respect to those coming on board at mods in the future, I would believe they would have a pretty good idea of what would be expected of them as well.
3) Possibility of creation of a senate – instead of having moderators creating rules for things such as the interspecies guidelines, would you like an intermediary body of users create policy for mods to enforce?
While I heartily agree that mods should not be the ones creating rules, I don't personally care for the idea of a Senate. The Focus Groups have worked well or just a thread in Resource should be able to cover things.
4)Direction of fan fiction for the future – where would you like fan fiction to be in six months or a year from now?
Well, other then the obvious cough*Qui-Gonboard*cough I would love to see fanfic relatively drama free... and sooner than six months. I'd like to see a better tolerance of those with differing opinions. I'd like to see better communication between users/mods users/users in general. I'd like to see us working on more fanfic then focus groups. I'd like to see users having more fun and have more myself.
I'd like to teach the world to sing in perfect harmony.... 
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To me, you're strange and you're beautiful,
You'd be so perfect with me but you just can't see,
You turn every head but you don't see me.
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Jesina_Dreis
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
7/2/05 9:10am
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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Looking back, most of the call for mod's to be more visible came from a lack of trust.
Not on my part. For me, the call for mods to be more visible came from the fact that I just wasn't seeing mods. It wasn't in any way related to a lack of trust. Perhaps a misunderstanding of the way responsibilities in fanfic had been divided up, but not a lack of trust. It was simply because I wasn't seeing anyone. I saw Dana and Herman in Resource and I didn't see anyone anywhere else, outside of their own story threads. (Though I admit I never set foot in Before, so...)
It wasn't trust. It was just the lack of visibility that I felt wasn't appropriate for moderators. I've been in other forums, and the mods there were much more visible than ours were at the time.
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obi_ew
Registered:
Apr '02
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Date Posted:
7/2/05 12:22pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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Jesina posted:
It was just the lack of visibility that I felt wasn't appropriate for moderators. I've been in other forums, and the mods there were much more visible than ours were at the time.
I agree that for the majority, it didn't begin as a trust issue but, just as Jesina said, they just weren't there. I know in the past, that's the way the boards were modded. It was believed that a mod should be heard (when trouble arose), but not seen otherwise. Times and people change. That may have been fine one or two years ago, but I think it's been made very clear that the users want something different now from their mods. We want to know them and see they are part of the fanfiction community. Personally, for me at any rate, if a mod isn't out in the trenches getting to know the people they serve, I see that as a lack of concern for said users.
Just my 2 cents. 
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In Loving Memory Of CC Price of Courage- Obi/Whie/Luke- http://boards.theforce.net/The_Saga/b10476/20124958/?37 Updated 4/20 Finally!!
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CodeName_Targeter
Registered:
Nov '03
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Date Posted:
7/2/05 12:53pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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1) Role of moderators within fan fiction – more hands-on or hands-off, role of policemen only or guides as well? How involved and what kind of role do you want the moderators to play
2) Mod presence/sociability – how important is it that moderators be seen within the community?
I think that the mods need to be visible but not doing everything within the community. For example, the awards are run by regular users and those end up working out pretty well. I agree
with Jes and obi-ew, it wasn't from a lack of trust, we simply did not see the mods. I'd like to see the mods continue to be active and to branch out into other eras perhaps, such as Leona has.
3) Possibility of creation of a senate – instead of having moderators creating rules for things such as the interspecies guidelines, would you like an intermediary body of users create policy for mods to enforce?
I think a senate's an okay idea, but it won't work for fan fiction. However, I think that perhaps we should have a poll so all users can say what they think.
4) Direction of fan fiction for the future – where would you like fan fiction to be in six months or a year from now?
Hopefully foward and away from this. However, I think that asking to be drama free forever more is too much to ask.
I might have more to add to this later....
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YodaKenobi
Title: TFN EU Staff
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
7/2/05 4:22pm
Subject:
RE: Fan Fiction's Future
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1) Role of moderators within fan fiction – more hands-on or hands-off, role of policemen only or guides as well? How involved and what kind of role do you want the moderators to play
Policemen, I suppose. Though I don't necessarily have a problem with mods being involved in activities if they're willing.
2) Mod presence/sociability – how important is it that moderators be seen within the community?
I know I'm in the minority here, but I really have never been bothered by the visibility of mods. I like seeing Leona and LadyPadme post, but I don't feel like I need it for my own peace-of-mind. As long as there isn't SPAM, or obscenity, or other violations going unedited, I assume they're doing their jobs.
That being said, I know a lot of people want to see the mods alot, and again, I like seeing them as well. Both Leona and LadyPadme seem to be very active to me and I hope the new mods take a page from their book in this instance again.
3) Possibility of creation of a senate – instead of having moderators creating rules for things such as the interspecies guidelines, would you like an intermediary body of users create policy for mods to enforce?
No, I've never really liked this idea. I agree that moderators shouldn't have the burden of making all the rules, but we seem to have a focus group hashing things out at the moment. Though I don't like all the decisions the FG has come down with, I will respect them as what the community at large wants within the limits of the existing board rules.
I think 4 mods is enough for rule enforcement. A senate would really just confuse things and add a level of bureaucracy that we don't need.
4) Direction of fan fiction for the future – where would you like fan fiction to be in six months or a year from now?
Well, hopefully all this stuff will be long dead and I'm confident that it will be. RotS is still fresh in all of our minds and there are new books coming out, so I'm sure we'll have lots of good fics to read and things we all want to write. And that's mostly what I want to see in Fan Fiction.
I feel like the lines of communication between users, mods, and admins are now opened up and I really don't foresee us having any of these problems again. We've got two mods that I think are doing an excellent job, with two more coming who will hopefully follow their lead, as well as better defined guidelines and rules.
In six months I think the Fan Fiction boards will be as strong and fun as they've ever been, and that's what I'd like to see
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