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Topic:
JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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DarthTunick
Title: Host: The JCC Weekly Poll
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
2/25 7:51pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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I know that sounds like a bit of double-talk, but if you take social threads for what they are, and that being an online "community", so to speak, then you should be okay. Some people take forums waaaaay too seriously, though, and use them for a replacement social life. Then there's the people that use forums to blatantly and carelessly attack others, more often than not on a personal level, simply because they have a monitor and a modem (of one fashion or another) separating themselves and the individual that they just tore to shreds.
So for me, users should approach social threads with a delicate balance. It's not a replacement for real life interaction with real live people, but one must also keep in mind that a user is, in fact, interacting with real live people on the other side of that monitor screen.[/i]
I agree, to a point. Personally, I don't use the JC to "replace" a non-existent/bad social life outside the internet (because I know many people outside of this place, alot I would consider dear friends), but, it's hard for people to understand me here, because I'm essentially the same person online as I am offline.
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September 11th, 2001  -Never forget Viva La Ciudad de Los Angeles!  RIP, Cody "Snowball" Reeves, 1978-2008.  Let me explain something to you about the Dude...... 2008 L.A. Dodgers: 65-69, 2nd place N.L. West
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Darrkwolff
Registered:
Aug '04
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Date Posted:
2/25 7:51pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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Boba_Fett_2001 posted:
Darrkwolff posted:
Honestly, I didn't even know there was a chat section.
It's not a section of the forum. It's just an AIM chatroom called "jcchat."
Eh, still....didn't know it was there. And since I don't use AIM, all the more.... 
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Jedi Master and Council Member of the Lightside Barrack Hussein Obama is not the second coming of Christ, because I'm still here. And he's not the anti-Christ, because you're still here. 
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solojones
Registered:
Sep '00
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Date Posted:
2/25 7:57pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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harpuah posted:
Rachel, so are you suggesting that these friendships cease? I suppose I'm failing to see the point you're attempting to make here. I'm on a few moderator's WULs, and I can link to recent examples of my being edited... I do not receive preferential treatment, nor would I ever expect to. I'm 34 years old, and take full responsibility for my actions. If I'm edited, I'm edited... it's not the end of the world. This is the internet.. I'm here in my free time. I don't lose sleep over such petty issues..
Here is one... within the last few days.
Being edited for language is one thing. I think that's pretty neutral. But certain users are almost never warned about baiting/flaming, which goes on a lot. Frankly, I think there's too much of it in general, but it's done particularly frequently by some people who (probably rightly) feel like they have a free pass to do so, just because the users they're attacking aren't well known, are new, aren't liked by the dominant group, etc.
Of course I'm not suggesting that these friendships cease. I'm not sure why you'd jump to that conclusion. I'm simply saying that perhaps the mods need to be a little more aware of it. In my opinion, I think there's a lot of baiting and flaming that goes on here and I'm just suggesting I think that's a problem.
-sj loves kevin spacey
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6 x 9 = 42 Proud member of the Colbert Nation Obi-Wan Kenobi and Obi-Wan Kenobi in Ghost Ship Executor All Hail Cliegg's Blue Leg!
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ApolloSmileGirl
Registered:
Jun '04
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:04pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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solojones posted:
Being edited for language is one thing. I think that's pretty neutral. But certain users are almost never warned about baiting/flaming, which goes on a lot. Frankly, I think there's too much of it in general, but it's done particularly frequently by some people who (probably rightly) feel like they have a free pass to do so, just because the users they're attacking aren't well known, are new, aren't liked by the dominant group, etc.
Have you considered the fact that just because they aren't openly warned in a thread, that they still might get warnings via PMs?
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Queen " Baadasssss Pixie" of the Knights of the Sarcasm Table At first when I see you cry....Yeah, it makes me smile Yeah, it makes me smile At worst I feel bad for a while, But then I just smile I go ahead and smile......  VIN
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solojones
Registered:
Sep '00
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:08pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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If that is the case, I'm not sure why they should be delivered in such a way. It seems like making it clear to everyone, not just them, what is and isn't acceptable treatment of others would be a good idea. Otherwise, whether it's intended to or not, it's tacit approval.
-sj loves kevin spacey
-----signature-----
6 x 9 = 42 Proud member of the Colbert Nation Obi-Wan Kenobi and Obi-Wan Kenobi in Ghost Ship Executor All Hail Cliegg's Blue Leg!
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ApolloSmileGirl
Registered:
Jun '04
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:11pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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Um, maybe because if that line hasn't been crossed quite yet, but is nearing the point? A lot of times warnings are posted in threads when it's two or more people going at each other. However, if it's the one individual that's instigating things, a lot of the time they'll PM a warning.
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Queen " Baadasssss Pixie" of the Knights of the Sarcasm Table At first when I see you cry....Yeah, it makes me smile Yeah, it makes me smile At worst I feel bad for a while, But then I just smile I go ahead and smile...... VIN
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Darrkwolff
Registered:
Aug '04
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:11pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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Sometimes I think warnings via PMs, for whatever violation, is a means of preserving the dignity, and thus avoiding humiliation, of the offendee.
I speak from experience. 
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Jedi Master and Council Member of the Lightside Barrack Hussein Obama is not the second coming of Christ, because I'm still here. And he's not the anti-Christ, because you're still here.
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GrandAdmiralJello
Title:
Emperor
• EUC
• JCC
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:13pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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Sometimes it's more effective to privately warn a user than publically draw attention to them. The goal of moderating isn't necessarily to make everyone aware that someone broke a rule, but to get people to not break them.
But that's just my two cents, I'm not speaking for the JCC mods or anything. I'm just saying that there are instances where private warnings could function better, or--to be honest--some things just might have been missed.
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Roma Æterna|SPQR  Imperium Sine Fine "Moribus antiquis res stat Romana virisque" -Ennius, Annales "Tu regere imperio populos, Romanæ, memento;hæ tibi erunt artes; pascisque imponere morem, parcere subjectis et debellare superbos" -Virgil, Aeneid
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DarthTunick
Title: Host: The JCC Weekly Poll
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:17pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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I don't see why language, depending on the word, is such an issue.
-----signature-----
September 11th, 2001 -Never forget Viva La Ciudad de Los Angeles! RIP, Cody "Snowball" Reeves, 1978-2008. Let me explain something to you about the Dude...... 2008 L.A. Dodgers: 65-69, 2nd place N.L. West
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AaylaSecurOWNED
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:17pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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Rachel, you've voiced to me privately before that you consider me to be part of what you see as the in-crowd, so with that in mind:
I do think there is some leeway given to people who are friends of mods (and I'll address that in a moment), but at the same time, there's certainly no free reign and it's not quite the anarchy you are making it out to be. I've been banned at least once in the last year (maybe twice?) and warned so much more than that for baiting and flaming, which I'll admit I walk a fine line on with some consistency.
However, a lot of warning goes on behind the scenes, because the administration is currently in a place where they like to keep punishments private. There's no more "see you in 24" or publicly outing socks like there used to be, and that's fine, but it also means that people tend to get frustrated by what they see as reluctance on the administration's part to act. I had my own struggle with this, Roo and Sape can both attest to that, and I eventually had to suck it up and learn that I wasn't going to see people getting publicly reprimanded.
This is particularly true when someone is a friend of a mod. In these situations, warnings are often more casual, instead of a directed PM or a bold post in a thread, I occasionally get told to cool it during conversations I was already having with someone who's moderating the forum (and often Strilo, who doesn't even mod JCC but has been responsible for me backing off more times than I can count).
When people who are friends with mods do cross the line, they get punished for it, but when they walk right up to it, they get reprimanded privately before crossing it, and thus escape punishment a lot of the time. I think that might be where your frustration is coming from.
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Women. Jedi. No.
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harpuah
Registered:
Mar '05
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:20pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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solojones posted:
If that is the case, I'm not sure why they should be delivered in such a way. It seems like making it clear to everyone, not just them, what is and isn't acceptable treatment of others would be a good idea. Otherwise, whether it's intended to or not, it's tacit approval.
-sj loves kevin spacey
It may be along the same lines as why a persons ban isn't discussed.
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Darrkwolff
Registered:
Aug '04
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:20pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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GrandAdmiralJello posted:
Sometimes it's more effective to privately warn a user than publically draw attention to them. The goal of moderating isn't necessarily to make everyone aware that someone broke a rule, but to get people to not break them.
But that's just my two cents, I'm not speaking for the JCC mods or anything. I'm just saying that there are instances where private warnings could function better, or--to be honest--some things just might have been missed.
Precisely my point.
Personally, I think it's more effective to pull someone aside (in this case, sending a PM), and letting them know their mistake and giving them a chance to not do it again/make up for it/apologize, etc., than to call someone out in public. It allows the offendee to keep face and maintain their dignity and keep from being humiliated.
And like I said earlier...I speak from experience.
I was acting the fool when the new Post A Pic thread opened up, and a Mod PM'd me, pointed out what I was doing, pointed out that the reason for establishing that new thread was because of knuckleheads like me mucking up the old one, and that I just needed to cool it, and the Mod did so in a gracious and friendly manner. 
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Jedi Master and Council Member of the Lightside Barrack Hussein Obama is not the second coming of Christ, because I'm still here. And he's not the anti-Christ, because you're still here.
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Spiderfan
Registered:
Mar '04
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:30pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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GrandAdmiralJello posted:
Sometimes it's more effective to privately warn a user than publically draw attention to them. The goal of moderating isn't necessarily to make everyone aware that someone broke a rule, but to get people to not break them.
I do think there is something to be said for people learning from others' mistakes when someone is publicly reprimanded and punished and certainly makes clear certain lines that can't be crossed, but on the flip side publicly outing and punishing someone seems terribly cruel. I am glad to some degree that there is a level of discretion taken rather than subjecting someone to the humiliation and subsequent drama that follows the public execution.
I do however agree that there seems to be a leniency shown for some more than others, that I am not entirely pleased with. I feel some people get away with more than they should.
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solojones
Registered:
Sep '00
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:32pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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Dani, thanks for your candor. I understand pulling people aside, it's just that it does give the appearance that the mods approve of what's being said if it's not edited or commented on. And since other users are heavily discouraged from defending people or calling people on flaming others, those people wind up just feeling like the mods and other users must approve of that kind of behavior if they're not taking a stand against it.
-sj loves kevin spacey
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6 x 9 = 42 Proud member of the Colbert Nation Obi-Wan Kenobi and Obi-Wan Kenobi in Ghost Ship Executor All Hail Cliegg's Blue Leg!
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AaylaSecurOWNED
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
2/25 8:38pm
Subject:
RE: JCChat and Social Threads--More Harm Than Good?
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That makes sense to me, but I'm not sure if it can be remedied.
Just to clarify, do you think that there are people getting punished (banned) for things that others would not be punished for? Or just that there appears to be a double standard because some reprimands occur privately and some publicly?
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Women. Jedi. No.
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