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Topic:
Example of uncertainty?
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Kimball_Kinnison
Registered:
Oct '01
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Date Posted:
1/29/06 5:46am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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TheBoogieMan posted:
Yes, but the point remains the same. 250 posts is not many posts for a Senate topic, and discussion would be difficult to maintain. However, as I said, I think I'm representing a lot of people when I say I'm hesitant to jump into a thread that is over 10 pages.
Here's a question, then. Just because some people are hesitant to jump into a thread longer than x pages (it varies from one person to the next, and everyone uses different page settings), does that mean that the Senate needs to cut threads back to only x pages in order to encourage more people to participate?
As I post this, I count 17 threads on the first page (50 threads) in the JCC that are over 250 posts. They range from classics (technical help thread, the user above me, etc) to discussions (sports threads, TV show threads) to social groups, and so forth. At the same time, I count only 14 threads longer than 250 posts on the first page of the Senate. On the next page in each forum, I found another 8 in the JCC and 6 in the Senate. In fact, the longest Senate thread I could find was 3991 posts (the classic Iraq thread), and all of the rest were under 2000 posts (in keeping with the newer policy), and only 4 of the threads still open were over 1000 posts. In the JCC, there were 16 threads longer than 4000 posts, with 4 more between 2000 and 4000 posts. Again, those threads in the JCC come from a variety of categories, including discussions on various topics.
That tells me that the length of threads isn't really a problem, but the perception of the long threads is. Trying to limit Senate threads to 250, or even 500, posts would not solve the perception. If anything, it would reinforce it. I look at the first page or two of the Senate and the JCC, and I see a healthy mixture of thread sizes, ranging from 1-2 replies, up to thousands. If you were to just look at the length of the threads, there's very little difference between the forums.
So, what can be done to break down that perception? A real solution would require compromise, which means that both sides are willing to meet in the middle. Simply trying to cut Senate threads down to 250 posts or less doesn't do that, and would not work in the long run.
Kimball Kinnison
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You deserve the wrath of Kimball...- OWM
Why, Kimball... I didn't know you had it in you.- KW
I think that Kimball just made a joke, and a funny joke at that.- Raven
Stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?
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MariahJSkywalker
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Mar '05
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Date Posted:
1/29/06 6:05am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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I think the problem lies with the content inside of a large thread. Many people like to post in a thread while it's still on it's first page, because most likely they won't be repeating what someone has to say or know what the current flow of discussion is.
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many people here should be fixed, but that's another story.-KW Smut Peddlin' Squaw of the Knights of the 3SA/JCC Sarcasm Table R.I.P. Snowie 
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TheBoogieMan
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Nov '01
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Date Posted:
1/29/06 6:13am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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Right, but you are ignoring the types of threads you are looking at. In the JCC, almost all the large threads are social threads, fan clubs or games, all of which are very different from a thread debating the one topic.
However, I agree with you that a large amount of it is perception. A 1500 post thread cannot possibly be the one continued discussion, yet I feel that if I jump into it I'll just be repeating what someone else has said. So, how do you propose to change this perception?
Edit: Mariah also raises a good point.
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Kimball_Kinnison
Registered:
Oct '01
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Date Posted:
1/29/06 9:40am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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TheBoogieMan posted:
Right, but you are ignoring the types of threads you are looking at. In the JCC, almost all the large threads are social threads, fan clubs or games, all of which are very different from a thread debating the one topic.
Actually, I was very careful to address that when I looked over the threads. Yes, there were many social groups and games in there, but there were also some discussion threads. Three that stand out in my recollection are the Battlestar Galactica thread, the NHL thread, and the soccer thread. All of those are well over 1000 posts each, and each one probably has contained quite a few different discussions.
If anything, the same arguments being made against people joining in the Senate threads are almost identical to the arguments against having only "official" sports threads in the JCC. People may not want to jump into a large thread like that, or may feel like they are simply repeating what others may have already said. Some people don't feel comfortable with posting in threads if they don't post on the first page.
Which way is it? It seems like the argument is one side when it comes to sports threads, but the other side when it comes to Senate threads. I highly doubt that the basic principles involved change all that much when the topic changes to sports.
Kimball Kinnison
-----signature-----
You deserve the wrath of Kimball...- OWM
Why, Kimball... I didn't know you had it in you.- KW
I think that Kimball just made a joke, and a funny joke at that.- Raven
Stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?
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epic
Title: ex mod / rsa
RICHARDSON/Forum Feud Champion
Registered:
Jul '99
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Date Posted:
1/31/06 5:29am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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discussion within sport threads are constantly changing and updating, so anyone can join in at any stage -- there is always a new game that has been played, a new player transfer rumour that's making headlines -- not congruent with a Senate discussion on one particular topic.
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Kimball_Kinnison
Registered:
Oct '01
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Date Posted:
1/31/06 6:01am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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epic posted:
discussion within sport threads are constantly changing and updating, so anyone can join in at any stage -- there is always a new game that has been played, a new player transfer rumour that's making headlines -- not congruent with a Senate discussion on one particular topic.
Obviously, you haven't been all that involved in the Senate in the past year or so. Most Senate threads are constantly changing and updating as well. It's rare to find a discussion that references anything more than a page back, especially with the recent (last 3-4 months) efforts to get people to stop responding with comments like "I already answered that 5 pages ago".
The comparison still holds. Why are long sports threads not a bad thing for users, but long Senate threads are? Again, it is perception, not truth, and it is a perception that you are perpetuating through your stereotypes.
Kimball Kinnison
-----signature-----
You deserve the wrath of Kimball...- OWM
Why, Kimball... I didn't know you had it in you.- KW
I think that Kimball just made a joke, and a funny joke at that.- Raven
Stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?
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ObiWan506
Title: JC Head Admin
Registered:
Aug '03
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Date Posted:
1/31/06 8:01am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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But how can you change perception? What can be done to change the public's view of The Senate?
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Kimball_Kinnison
Registered:
Oct '01
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Date Posted:
1/31/06 8:26am
Subject:
RE: Example of uncertainty?
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ObiWan506 posted:
But how can you change perception? What can be done to change the public's view of The Senate?
One of the first things is for people (especially those involved in this FG) to stop propagating the false perceptions of the Senate. Comments like epic's are demonstratably false, and only perpetuate the false stereotypes. As long as there are people actively asserting that those stereotypes are true, and not being coorected in the matter, it will be almost impossible to get rid of them.
Beyond that, we've been suggesting such ideas in other threads, specifically about trying to break down the perception barriers between YJCC and the Senate.
Kimball Kinnison
-----signature-----
You deserve the wrath of Kimball...- OWM
Why, Kimball... I didn't know you had it in you.- KW
I think that Kimball just made a joke, and a funny joke at that.- Raven
Stupidity got us into this mess, why can't it get us out?
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