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Topic:
ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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sithreaper
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
2/10/05 6:22am
Subject:
ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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ROTS spoilers
Hopefully a ROTS source book will be released soon. But here what levels I think from spoilers I’ve seen.
Anakin – level 20 GL’s most powerful force user ever, hero of the clone wars, kills dooku, saves palps from mace, slaughters numerous jedi in the temple purge. But loses to Obi
Sidious/Palpatine – level 20 – kills Fisto, Tinn & Kolar. + beats yoda
Yoda – level 19/20 I think the level 20 may be ever so slightly to high for yoda but I suppose they cant go back on stats now so level 20.
Mace Windu – Level 19 beats palps before getting jumped by Anakin
Obi wan – Level 17 in his prime in ROTS kills Grievous & beats AS
General Grevious – Level 17/18 slaughters jedi for fun + like maul he has kenobi beat before been killed
Dooku – level 18
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MasterKazur
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
2/10/05 6:29am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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ROTS spoilers
Anakin – level 12, Level 13 during the duel. He can't be 20 because 20 years later he's level 18. Do the math :-)
Sidious/Palpatine – level 20
Yoda – level 20
Mace Windu – Level 19 could be right. Maybe 18. And he doesn't beat Sidious! No more than Sidious beats him that is. Sidious fights less than him to draw him in. His begging for mercy is "playing to the crowd" (Anakin) Just wait and see.
Obi wan – Level 13. He CAN'T be level 17, because in ANH he's level 15.
Dooku – level 18.
-----signature-----
Yoda: You seek Yoda!
Luke: You know him?
Yoda: Take you to him I will... Ehehe. But now we must eat -- COME! (it's just not as funny after the censor)
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sithreaper
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
2/11/05 2:14am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Anakin – level 12, Level 13 during the duel. He can't be 20 because 20 years later he's level 18. Do the math :-)
But after his lava bath Anakin loses a lot of his powers GL OT commentary. In game terms Anakin losing limbs will surely have a huge affect on his VP, HP , FP & speed + skills with the saber, surely he would lose enormous amounts of everything. + He will have to relearn how to use & do a great many things now that he is using a robot suit rather then his own limbs. So level 20 seems fine to me. its like revan (KOTOR) when he loses his memory, he has to relearn what he learned.
Mace Windu – Level 19 could be right. Maybe 18. And he doesn't beat Sidious! No more than Sidious beats him that is. Sidious fights less than him to draw him in. His begging for mercy is "playing to the crowd" (Anakin) Just wait and see.
Motee the spoiler king has said that mace disarms sidious (not literally) and later blocks sidious lightning with his saber until palps basically runs out of steam & surrenders. But of course sidious had for a time fought four jedi at once which would have weakened even a level 20 sith lord. Still mace goes up to level 19
Obi wan – Level 13. He CAN'T be level 17, because in ANH he's level 15.
Inactivity, Surely sat in a desert for 19 years will lead to a regression of your skills. Its like saying I haven’t played football for 19 years but if I play tomorrow I will still be as good if not better.
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MasterKazur
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
2/11/05 3:12am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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But after his lava bath Anakin loses a lot of his powers GL OT commentary. In game terms Anakin losing limbs will surely have a huge affect on his VP, HP , FP & speed + skills with the saber, surely he would lose enormous amounts of everything. + He will have to relearn how to use & do a great many things now that he is using a robot suit rather then his own limbs. So level 20 seems fine to me. its like revan (KOTOR) when he loses his memory, he has to relearn what he learned.
No matter how much lava you get on you your levels will NEVER descrease. It's just not possible game wise! The only effect loss of limbs has is the power of you force points will be reduced wich will explain his loss of power (also his Wisdom and Charisma drop one point making some of his Force related skills drop too). Sure he has to ajust to his robot suit but that doesn't mean he will drop 8 levels. Revan is from a computer game. It's not the same and Anakin doesn't lose his memory. Anakins level is not 20.
Motee the spoiler king has said that mace disarms sidious (not literally) and later blocks sidious lightning with his saber until palps basically runs out of steam & surrenders. But of course sidious had for a time fought four jedi at once which would have weakened even a level 20 sith lord. Still mace goes up to level 19
Mace chops Sidious lightsaber in half. Palps then blast him with force lightning. Both combatants are hard pressed and call to Anakin for help. Palps then "begs" for his life, in order to gain sympathy from Anakin. (This whole scene is F***** up if you ask me). Motee also said we should strike the word "defeat" from any specualtion. But I guess Mace could be level 19 by this point.
Obi wan – Level 13. He CAN'T be level 17, because in ANH he's level 15.
Inactivity, Surely sat in a desert for 19 years will lead to a regression of your skills. Its like saying I haven’t played football for 19 years but if I play tomorrow I will still be as good if not better.
It's not the same in RPG. Thats what the Ability Points Age modifiers are for. No matter how long you sit still your levels will NEVER EVER drop.
He is level 13 by Episode III.
-----signature-----
Yoda: You seek Yoda!
Luke: You know him?
Yoda: Take you to him I will... Ehehe. But now we must eat -- COME! (it's just not as funny after the censor)
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NJOfan215
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
2/12/05 5:04pm
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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i would put obiwan at level 14. He really isn't that active from episode 3 to episode 4. He really can't be. He can't risk drawing attention to himself.
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MasterKazur
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
2/12/05 7:26pm
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Yeah, he's level 14 after "the duel". But from the beginning of Episode III and through-out the duel he's level 13.
-----signature-----
Yoda: You seek Yoda!
Luke: You know him?
Yoda: Take you to him I will... Ehehe. But now we must eat -- COME! (it's just not as funny after the censor)
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sithreaper
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 5:27am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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No matter how much lava you get on you your levels will NEVER descrease. It's just not possible game wise! The only effect loss of limbs has is the power of you force points will be reduced wich will explain his loss of power (also his Wisdom and Charisma drop one point making some of his Force related skills drop too). Sure he has to ajust to his robot suit but that doesn't mean he will drop 8 levels. Revan is from a computer game. It's not the same and Anakin doesn't lose his memory. Anakins level is not 20.
It's not the same in RPG. Thats what the Ability Points Age modifiers are for. No matter how long you sit still your levels will NEVER EVER drop.
He is level 13 by Episode III.
Sorry MasterKazur but thats not true read this little snippet from the wizards of the coast website under kyle katarn.
"One of the Rebellion's most successful intelligence agents, Kyle Katarn also danced on the edges of Jedi greatness for years before fully joining Luke Skywalker's New Jedi Order. In the chaotic early years of the New Republic, however, Katarn grew distrustful of the Force for many years after too many perilous brushes with the dark side. He returned to intelligence work full-time, giving up his Jedi studies (albeit temporarily) and handing over his lightsaber to Master Skywalker.
During this stretch of his career, Katarn willfully gave up many skills and techniques he had learned over years of study. He took to the spacelanes in a new ship, the Raven's Claw, which replaced the Moldy Crow.
By the time Kyle Katarn resumed his studies, he did so as a green apprentice."
So during the stretch between fighting Jerec & desaan Katarn loses levels. because he willfully casts them aside aka he stops using them. Obi wan also stops using then when he’s sat in a desert so his levels will also regress. anakins levels will be forcefully down graded. This article shows that wizards of the coast are willing to reduce levels in special cases to fit the story Anakin & obi are special cases. so lvl 20 for AS & lvl 17/18 for obi..
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JoinTheSchwarz
Registered:
Nov '02
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 5:59am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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I had toyed with the idea of a Lvl 19-20 Anakin during ROTS. Who knows, maybe the lava bath and the posterior reconstruction have a similar effect to D&D's energy drain. 
I don't think Grievous should be higher than Level 15.
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MasterKazur
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 6:27am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Thats not what that says, Sithreaper.
It just means that he stops using his abilities for awhile and needs some "getting in shape" training (Gamewise probably a -2 penalty on Force Skills for two days). Gamewise he wouldn't have dropped any levels whatsoever! It's just not possible!
And Kyle only had 1 Jedi level and 2 Force skills. And he WILLFULLY decides not to USE them. He can't just forgot how and drop a level.
Just as Anakin can't just forget how to use 8 levels of Jedi training because his body gets burned.
The Force has nothing to do with your body.
His loss of power is clearly spelled out in the Hero's Guide book as being loss of Force Point Power, which gamewise was the power of the Skywalkers: Extremely High Force Point Power.
Bottom line: No matter how much you want Anakin to be level 20, and Obi-Wan to be level 17 thats just not the case.
-----signature-----
Yoda: You seek Yoda!
Luke: You know him?
Yoda: Take you to him I will... Ehehe. But now we must eat -- COME! (it's just not as funny after the censor)
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sithreaper
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 6:28am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Grievous is tough to rank he smashed Ki Adi Mundi, Secura, Kruush, Shaak Ti & two others simultaneously (3 jedi killed the rest wounded) in the CW cartoon. Along with his magma bodyguards he also smashed through jedi (6) + clone troopers (over 40) + royal guards (7) in capturing palpatine (LOE) .add at least another 7 jedi kills from his comic book series + rumour has it that he’s going to add even piel and adi gallia to list of scalps in the next CW series. I expected that he will get a few kills in the film as well + he will have kenobi beat. However in LOE mace windu gets the better of GG who is lucky to survive. + dooku can outduel GG & kenobi eventual kills him. Very hard to rank but I reckon a level 17/18 not sure what classes though
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JoinTheSchwarz
Registered:
Nov '02
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 6:36am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
- Date Edited:
2/22/05 6:37am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
JoinTheSchwarz
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Yeah, he's tough to rank, mainly because the cartoon series was greatly exaggerated (point in case: Mace Windu, level 18, single-handedly devastating a Confederacy army, super-weapon included).
I was just thinking on the power Grievous has in the Miniatures game. He's powerful, but not that powerful. I mean, look at Darth Maul.
Would someone be interested in starting a thread to post home-made CW-ROTS stats? There are lots of new starships, vehicles and characters. With spoilers, of course. dp, would that be cool with you?
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MasterKazur
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 6:39am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Take a look at these GG stats and tell me what you think... Me and some guys from Starwars.com put them together.
General Grievous: Male droid general, Soldier 8/Elite Trooper 5/Officer 5; Init +4 (Dex); Defense 26 (+12 class, +4 Dex); DR 3; Spd 10 m; VP/WP 131/15; Atk +21/+16/+11/+6 melee (2d8+6/19-20, lightsaber) or +17/+17/+16/+12/+7/+2 melee (2d8+6/19-20, two lightsabers) or +20/+15/+10/+5 ranged (3d6 or DC 10 stun, blaster pistol); SQ Uncanny dodge (Dex bonus to Defense), weapon specialization (lightsaber), leadership, requisition supplies, tactics, droid components – vocabulator; SV Fort +15, Ref +12, Will +8; SZ M; FP 0; DSP 0; Rep +7; Str 18, Dex 19, Con 15, Int 14, Wis 11, Cha 12.
Equipment: Various lightsabers, blaster pistol, cloak.
Skills: Astrogate +12, Computer Use +12, Diplomacy +11, Disable Device +12, Hide +14, Knowledge (Confederacy) +18, Knowledge (tactics) +22, Move Silently +19, Pilot +14, Read/Write Basic, Repair +7, Sense Motive +11, Speak Basic.
Feats: Ambidexterity, Armor Proficiency (light, medium, heavy), Combat Expertise, Dodge, Exotic Weapon (lightsaber), Frightful Presence, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Mobility, Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, Power Attack, Spring Attack, Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Focus (lightsaber), Weapon Group Proficiencies (blaster pistols, blaster rifles, heavy weapons, simple weapons, vibro weapons), Whirlwind Attack.
-----signature-----
Yoda: You seek Yoda!
Luke: You know him?
Yoda: Take you to him I will... Ehehe. But now we must eat -- COME! (it's just not as funny after the censor)
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sithreaper
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 7:02am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
- Date Edited:
2/22/05 7:05am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
sithreaper
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nice stats. well thought out & put together.
here Katarns stats
Kyle Katarn: Male Human Scoundrel 5/Soldier 6/Jedi Guardian 1; Init +3 (Dex); Defense 22 (+9 class, +3 Dex); Spd 10 m; VP/WP 107/18; Atk +12/+7 melee (1d6+2, unarmed) or +12/+7 melee (2d4+2, vibrodagger) or +13/+8 ranged (3d8, heavy blaster); SQ Illicit barter, lucky, precise attack +2, deflect (defense +1); SV Fort +12, Ref +11, Will +4; SZ M; FP 7; DSP 0; Rep +8; Str 15, Dex 17, Con 18, Int 12, Wis 11, Cha 13. Challenge Code D.
Equipment: Heavy blaster, blaster rifle, thermal detonator, vibrodagger, combat jumpsuit (DR 3), space transport (Raven's Claw).
Skills: Astrogate +6, Balance +3, Bluff +9, Computer Use +4, Demolitions +7, Diplomacy +3, Disable Device +11, Disguise +3, Gather Information +5, Hide +11, Intimidate +6, Jump +4, Knowledge (streetwise) +4, Knowledge (Jedi lore) +4, Knowledge (tactics) +5, Listen +8, Move Silently +14, Pilot +9, Read/Write Basic, Repair +7, Search +5, Speak Basic, Speak Huttese, Spot +8, Treat Injury +5, Tumble +8.
Force Skills: Battlemind +8, Enhance Ability +11.
Feats: Ambidexterity, Armor Proficiency (light), Dodge, Exotic Weapon Proficiency (lightsaber), Force-Sensitive, Improved Two-Weapon Fighting, Martial Arts, Mobility, Skill Emphasis (Move Silently), Spacer, Spring Attack, Starship Operation (space transport), Two-Weapon Fighting, Weapon Group Proficiencies (blaster pistols, blaster rifles, heavy weapons, simple weapons, vibro weapons).
Force Feats: Control.
Your telling me that katarn beat jerec (a former jedi knight) & his cronies as a level 1 jedi guardian. the guy lost levels between facing jerec and desaan i recon that he reached about level 6 jedi gaurdian when he fought jerec.
were does it say that losing levels isnt possible? + im sure wizards will alter whats required to keep in line with the films
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JoinTheSchwarz
Registered:
Nov '02
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 7:04am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Yeah, I like your Greevy stats. I might end using them in my upcoming pre-ROTS series. 
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MasterKazur
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
2/22/05 7:34am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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Thanks. Glad you like them (GG stats).
Your telling me that katarn beat jerec (a former jedi knight) & his cronies as a level 1 jedi guardian. the guy lost levels between facing jerec and desaan i recon that he reached about level 6 jedi gaurdian when he fought jerec.
were does it say that losing levels isnt possible? + im sure wizards will alter whats required to keep in line with the films
No way Kyle was level 17 at the end of Jedi Knight!! He has like a week of training (He's not a Skywalker :-). Jerec himself was "only" level 15.
The stats you posted are Kyle as of Jedi Knight and also as of Jedi Outcast. He just didn't gain any levels because he stopped using his powers and once you take levels in Jedi, you can't take levels in any other class, which explains why his soldier or scoundrel levels haven't increased.
Losing levels isn't possible because you just can't "throw away" life experience and training, which is what levels mean. You can gain temporary (or even permanent) penalties to skills, attack rolls, and abilities and such which is likely the case with ANH Ben Kenobi and JO Kyle Katarn, but losing levels simply can't happen.
I'm sure WotC will alter what is required but they will not change the rules of the game just to make Anakin a level 20 by Episode 3.
-----signature-----
Yoda: You seek Yoda!
Luke: You know him?
Yoda: Take you to him I will... Ehehe. But now we must eat -- COME! (it's just not as funny after the censor)
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NJOfan215
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
2/23/05 11:45am
Subject:
RE: ROTS Levels (Spoilers)
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nice gg stats
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This council has zero tolerance for any sexual deviancy regarding our Jedi Knights.
Go Eagles
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