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Topic:
(D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Donp
Registered:
Mar '03
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Date Posted:
6/7/06 8:16pm
Subject:
(D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Hi.
I'm a DM in a KOTOR era campaign. There are three players, two Jedi and one scoundrel/soldier. The character are currently 9th level. The thing is that I am having some difficulty providing challenging encounters for the characters.
One of the reasons the players are hard to come by is that one of the Jedi is uber-powerful and nigh-on unstoppable.
He is a Wookie Jedi Guardian 5/Jedi Weapon Master 4. He has a threat range of 17-20 on his lightsaber and a Strength score of 22 so that without boosting himself with the force hiss attack rating goes something like this:
M. Att. : +16/+11 (Personalized Lightsaber w/impr. critical 17-20/Damage 4d8+9). If he boosts himself up with say Battlemind and Enhance Ability (Str) and gets average rolls his attack rating looks like this:
M. Att. : +22/+17 Damage 4d8+10
If he chooses to use Wookie rage also he gets a +4 to Str and gets the attack rating of:
M. Att. : +24/+19 Dam: 4d8+13
Now even in his unboosted state he is very likely to hit avery enemy (Non-Jedi/Sith enemies of appropriate levels generally have a defense of 18-22). This means that in his un-boosted state he will hit on a roll of 2-6. Not hard.
Now here comes the tricky part. He also has the JWM ability Devastating Strike. This means that 9 times a day (his Jedi level) he gets to make an attack with a threat range of 13-20. Coupled with his enormous damage he has an about 40% chance of killing an opponent with an attack he can use nine times a day.
How can I make things hard for this group that has such a monster. In D&D it would be no problem, just throw in some Demons or whatever and this guy is in deep trouble, or a creature that is immune to critical hits.
But in the SW RPG it's really hard to make opponents that won't be hacked down easily.
Any advice??
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Indigo_Jade
Registered:
Apr '02
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Date Posted:
6/7/06 8:20pm
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Throw him against a Dark Jedi or two that have the ability to drain energy on his lightsaber. That'll slow him down right quick.
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Koohii
Title: Games: RPG d6 GM
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/8/06 12:46am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Boosting with wookie rage? DSP! Rage is the path to the dark side. Anger, fear, Agression.
I would be awarding a DSP per round for that.
but that's just me.
You have a couple of alternatives:
Build a better combat monster
Put in situations where the characters have to role-play their way out.
Or make attacking the bad guy endanger the lives of others. I had the party seriously stagnated by a malignant force-user who transfered the damage done to him to a woman he help hostage--one of the PCs wife. They ended up killing her to get to him. The same fight took down 4 other players.
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Donp
Registered:
Mar '03
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Date Posted:
6/8/06 8:31am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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I think I read somewhere that a wookie should not get a DSP for using his wookie rage as it is a natural thing or something. Anybody seen that?
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Koohii
Title: Games: RPG d6 GM
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/8/06 11:54am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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As an ordinary wookie, perhaps, but a jedi wookie, certainly.
It's kinda like multi-classing a barbarian and a monk in D&D.
If you start as a monk, and take a level in barbarian, you have to shift your alignment to non-lawful and loose one of your benefits (I don't remember exactly what).
If you start as a barbarian and take a level in monk, you become non-chaotic and loose something from the barbarian class.
Especially considering the character is deliberately invoking wookie rage (unless I'm mis-interpreting) while using the force, he should be in trouble.
But hey, that's why I'm D6. I freely confess to not understanding or knowing all the rules to d20. It's my interpretation, and the D20 rules may say that I'm wrong.
-----signature-----
Create happy mediums: Free prozac to all psychics & Jedi
I'm met 6yo adults and 36yo children
Still working toward Ni-Kyu Go Ju Ryu
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Blithe
Registered:
Jun '03
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Date Posted:
6/9/06 11:30am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
- Date Edited:
6/9/06 11:36am (3 edits total)
Edited By:
Blithe
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Donp posted:
I think I read somewhere that a wookie should not get a DSP for using his wookie rage as it is a natural thing or something. Anybody seen that?
Yes, that is correct; however, on page 182 of the RCRB:
Wookiee Force users don't gain Dark Side Points for following their natural tendencies and using the Wookiee rage species ability. They do receive a Dark Side Point, however, if they incorporate Wookie rage with anyof their Force skills. In addition, while in Wookiee rage, a Wookiee Force user can't call upon the Force (except for calling upon the Dark Side when using a Force Point). All other uses of the Force require more calm and peace than the Wookiee can manage while in the natural frenzy.
The Wookiee will still be quite a combat beast without using Force skills anyway, so like Indigo suggested, it's a good idea to throw a few Darksiders with Drain Energy at him to disarm him. Further, the inability to use key combat skills -- such as Enhance Ability and Battlemind -- or spend Force Points without gaining a DSP should help even the odds. (Unless of course, he doesen't mind the DSP, or just drops the Wookiee rage) 
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Jedi Merkurian
Title: Games: RPG d20 GM
Registered:
May '00
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Date Posted:
6/9/06 11:50am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Also, put him up against an opponent with Improved Disarm  Most 'saber twinks are pretty useless without their glowsticks...
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Rogue_Thunder
Registered:
Jan '03
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Date Posted:
6/9/06 9:00pm
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Hehehe... I took a 14th level JG/2nd level DSM, applied thew Ghoul template from D20 Modern... he has no Con score and instead of a Fort save he's always immune. He also has Dissipate Energy, so when my party's JWM tried to use Devastating Strike he gave my Dark Jedi a whole lot of VP. He automatically makes his Fort Save for Diss. Energy.
It took them awhile to beat that guy. 
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Jedi_Matt
Registered:
Jul '02
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Date Posted:
6/9/06 11:55pm
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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^^^  ^^^
Almost messed it up didn't we. He was one nasty mofo
Can i somehow become ghoulish? i want to not be able to fail my dissipate energy roll for that fight with dooku we might be getting
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Koohii
Title: Games: RPG d6 GM
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/10/06 1:51am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Present the Jedi with a situation in which being a combat beast in a liability instead of an asset.
Try this one:
A terrorist from the Droid Liberation Front is using Droids to spread chaos. He does this by using droids to re-program other droids into various acts. The reprogrammed droids, if captured intact, cannot provide any information about the person's responsible. Any attempt to counter their reprogram sets off a security code that wipes the memmory of the incident. Not just delete's it, but over-writes the information in the droid's brain with 0's, including (eventually) the over-write program. A good slicer will find that information was over-written but have no way of recovering it.
Droids will:
Taxi droid will dump passengers into the middle of busy intersection
Power droid will jump off an overpass
Logging droid reprogrammed to view (pick an alien species--sentient plant would be good) as trees to be chopped down.
Medical droids prescribe fatal medicine or otherwise cause severe problems for patients (this can be creepy, or ludicrious (like attaching a prostetic arm instead of a leg, or a tentacle instead of an ear).
Astromechs plot jump coordinates that place a capital ship inside the atmosphere of a planet.
Messenger droids deliver holo images (faked?) that cause domestic disruption or divorce filings within powerful families.
Protocol droids provide inaccurate translations between species in business or political negotiations (this can be subtle, or rediculous (or both) depending on the mood needed at that point).
You get the idea
And there is no much the Jedi powers can do in most of these instances because the perpetrators aren't organic, don't know that they are behaving incorrectly, and their reprogramming is being destroyed before they can access the information about where it came from.
All this from a villan who is a lvl 10 tech specialist with a concentration in droid programming and security systems.
More ideas can be found in the old thread "Jedi Killers" and my favorite "Adventure Ideas Go Here".
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Create happy mediums: Free prozac to all psychics & Jedi
I'm met 6yo adults and 36yo children
Still working toward Ni-Kyu Go Ju Ryu
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NJOfan215
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/10/06 7:39am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Have a bounty put on the guy. HAve him be chased by a bounty hunter/ sharp shooter or something like that. HAve the guy use a snipper rifle that deals sonic damage or something.
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jasconsolojediknight
Registered:
Jan '06
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Date Posted:
6/10/06 8:35am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Take an idea right from KOTOR and have go in a tmeple that is full of dark jedi and elite troopers that are there level or high. They might get a lot of ex but the have a hard time fighting them if there were say 10-15 guys that range from 9-12 per battle. Make sure the places they can Heal so they know that your not trying to kill the, just give them a hard time.
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Koohii
Title: Games: RPG d6 GM
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/10/06 4:46pm
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
- Date Edited:
6/10/06 4:53pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Koohii
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Jedi Killers thread
Now, you may not want to actually kill  the characters, but you can certainly use these ideas to make their lives challenging and difficult.  
One nice variation: Dark-sider uses Smite Weapon to detroy Jedi's lightsaber(s). The Temple is out of "spares" because of a recent trend, and the Weapon smiths haven't been able to keep up with demand. The only lightsaber currently available is from the Dark-sider (assuming they manage to defeat him/her). That lightsaber, however, has no visible switches or activating mechanism, and also no visible way to dismantle it (extremely unusual design, and will explode if someone attempts to tamper with it). The activation switch is on the inside, and only someone with telekenisis and fine control can activate it. What's more, the user has to know WHERE the switch is. The anti-tamper mechanisms are very effective, and attempting to cut into it will set off the equivilent of a grenade in the hands of whoever is so foolish. (I'm sure clever players will find a way to locate the switch, but make them think about it).
In the meantime, the Jedi in question will have to get by without sabers.
-----signature-----
Create happy mediums: Free prozac to all psychics & Jedi
I'm met 6yo adults and 36yo children
Still working toward Ni-Kyu Go Ju Ryu
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NJOfan215
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/11/06 10:27am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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That's a really cool idea.
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This council has zero tolerance for any sexual deviancy regarding our Jedi Knights.
Go Eagles
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Koohii
Title: Games: RPG d6 GM
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/11/06 2:51pm
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
- Date Edited:
6/11/06 2:58pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Koohii
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Thanks!
Of course, the jedi are of advanced enough level that they will know how to build new lightsabers, but finding the appropriate parts... 
And the weapons smiths won't have even those. Anything they did have they would be using to build new sabers. Even their parts stores are used up by other jedi needing to build sabers.
Now, there is something called a "lightfoil", which is a cheap, mass-produced lightsaber that does significantly less damage (3d instead of 5d, convert to d20 rules) because they aren't properly focused, bulk materials instead of custom-made, etc. oh, and they accidentally switch off 1/6 of the time (random 1-in-6 deactivation malfuncion, roll at beginning of character's initiative, after s/he has declared actions reflex save to abort stated to reactivate weapon if you're feeling generous).
Oh, BTW: go ahead and throw the occasional D&D monster at them. Change the description a little and it's a rare alien. Problem solved. My favorite was a tentacled bloby swamp monster that attacked the party. Everyone was trying to remember what swamp monster throws lightning bolts from its tentacles. I was just using the stats of a Blue Dragon with a different description.   Didn't tell them for 2 weeks. The ubergeeks were combing through all the monster manuals, monstrous compendiums, fiend folios, etc, trying to find what I'd thrown at them. It's fun to be evil GM.
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Create happy mediums: Free prozac to all psychics & Jedi
I'm met 6yo adults and 36yo children
Still working toward Ni-Kyu Go Ju Ryu
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Donp
Registered:
Mar '03
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Date Posted:
6/14/06 5:37am
Subject:
RE: (D20) Challenging powerful Player Characters
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Those are some really good ideas, thanks guys!
If you've got more ideas or stories about how you've dealt with pesky Jedi PC's keep 'em coming!
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