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Topic:
New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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TaintedJedi
Title: SVRF Officer
Registered:
Mar '04
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 5:59am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
- Date Edited:
6/14/07 6:01am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
TaintedJedi
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Jedi_Matt posted:
Luke... was going around cocksure of himself, on a sure thing to become just like his father. That was the point of the black outfit too, to demonstrate how close he was to falling.
Really? I never thought of it that way. I mean, I know Luke was trying to be a badass, but I don't know if he was actually flirting with turning to the darkside at the beginning of RoTJ. I liken it more to Bond trying to be a bad ass in parts of Casino Royale even when he's hurting like hell emotionally. Like putting on a brave front/bravado. But interesting observation. Sorry for hijacking the thread away from it's intended purpose.
EDIT: That's what I get for not reading clearly enough. I see you're saying he wasn't intentionally doing it, but merely in danger of sliding that way because of his actions.
-TJ
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Rogue 8, The Hawaiian Shirt Warlord
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Corporate_Jedi
Registered:
Mar '02
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 8:15am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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Ender_Sai posted:
Also, reading the Talent trees, I'm getting the impression it's not like mine or dp's World of Warcraft build where I'm classed as Holy because I have 2/3rds of my talent points in that discipline. If I look at the Consular talent tree - I'd take Adept and Master Negotiator and then maybe branch off into a Sentinel or Force talent tree. By my 8th level I would be Jedi 7/Jedi Knight 1 and my talents would change until Jedi Master. Yes, I could max out all my Consular talents but my character wouldn't be as well rounded. The point of talents is not to start at one tree and completely absorb it, it's to define a character.
E_S
I still feel that to some degree there aren't enough Talent slots to represent Jedi.
Every Jedi we have seen wield a lightsaber in combat is able to deflect and redirect blaster bolts. So basically you need to spend your 1 and 3 Talents right off the bat to accurately represent just being a Padawan like Zett Jukasa. This means that you have to wait until lvl 5 just to start expanding your suite of Talents. I think for my games I will combine the two into one Talent and will make the same reccomendation to any GM I play with. Jedi don't wear armor, so they are relying on the Force and a lightsaber to protect them. Why the rules don't reflect this fact I don't understand.
Unless of course the Jedi Temple doesn't let you out the door until you are level 3 or so. But this runs counter to the description of the Class.
I think in the end this is my greatest gripe with level based gaming. I really like the flexibility of an experience point purchase system. The Talent/Feat invention is a good one, and the fact that every level now comes with a nice benefit was a wise choice.
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Jedi Merkurian
Title: Games: RPG d20 GM
Registered:
May '00
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 8:19am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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posted:
Is the autofire overpowered? For some reason, anything that deals damage no matter what sounds like trouble to me.
Kinda like D&D mages? 
Actually, I think it makes Evasion useful in SW d20. In the RCR, Scouts had Evasion, but why? The only area-of-effect attacks were grenades. Also, a Jedi with the Deflect talent essentially has Improved Evasion vs. autofire weapons.
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dizfactor
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 11:22am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
- Date Edited:
6/14/07 11:25am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
dizfactor
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Corporate_Jedi posted:
So basically you need to spend your 1 and 3 Talents right off the bat to accurately represent just being a Padawan like Zett Jukasa.
I think it would be entirely appropriate to stat Zett Jukassa as a Jedi 3. Read his bio on Wookieepedia.
A Jedi 1 in the Prequel Era is probably a wet-behind-the-ears preteen leaving the Temple grounds for the first time.
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Julian Dibbell
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TaintedJedi
Title: SVRF Officer
Registered:
Mar '04
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 11:29am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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And don't forget how the first edition d20 core rulebook had those silly penalties to lightsaber attacks and no actual personal lightsaber built for like half a dozen levels... sheesh...
-TJ
-----signature-----
"Don't make me bring the hammer down."
Rogue 8, The Hawaiian Shirt Warlord
Sergeant-at-Arms
Sacramento Valley Rogue Force
Terrorizing the Galaxy Since 1984
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Corporate_Jedi
Registered:
Mar '02
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 12:49pm
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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dizfactor posted:
Corporate_Jedi posted:
So basically you need to spend your 1 and 3 Talents right off the bat to accurately represent just being a Padawan like Zett Jukasa.
I think it would be entirely appropriate to stat Zett Jukassa as a Jedi 3. Read his bio on Wookieepedia.
A Jedi 1 in the Prequel Era is probably a wet-behind-the-ears preteen leaving the Temple grounds for the first time.
Which can make them hard to rationalize being alone among adults often 4-5 years older without a Master. I dislike having to either create an NPC Jedi who then has to mysteriously vanish so they don't take over scenes or contrive reasons a 12 year old is zipping around the galaxy with a dangerous weapon and a novice grasp of phenomenal cosmic power that can be turned to evil. Also it makes for level/age progression in characters difficult. If the campaign goes for three years the other characters would likely hit their twenties and be in their prime with low double digit levels where my former Padawan is now a 15 year old Master who barely got any training with his mentor?
I think any game I run will start at 3rd level at least. I like giving the players some opportunity to multi-class to start or get to some of the 'cool toys' available to them right off the bat. And it lets me play with ages some.
As for poor Zett (who likely had more Clone Trooper kills under his belt than most of the Council before his demise) I think Jedi 4 or even 5 might be better. His Miniature stats (ok the 'Jedi-Padawan-even- though-he-looks-exactly-like-Zett' are pretty rockin for the points cost (he and the Jedi Weaponmaster are a great pairing for me).
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Ender_Sai
Title: Manager Emeritus
Registered:
Feb '01
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Date Posted:
6/14/07 3:06pm
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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Wow, you use the Padawan?  I never used the Knight and it's more or less the same thing...
(Gen Windu, JWM, Mas Amedda, Boss, and Sevs x ?? FTW)
I haven't played any L1s in this yet but in D&D et al, Level 1 chars are almost as tough as your average 8 year old. The speed of levelling compensates for this.
E_S
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Pawnnolonger
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
6/19/07 3:02pm
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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What do you think of a Feat to let you take a Talent from your available Talent trees?
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Jedi Merkurian
Title: Games: RPG d20 GM
Registered:
May '00
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Date Posted:
6/20/07 7:54am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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Interesting...
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Pawnnolonger
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
6/20/07 8:36am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
- Date Edited:
6/20/07 8:37am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Pawnnolonger
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I was just thinking most of the feats are combat oriented someone playing a scoundrel or noble may want a few more talents and a few less feats. Considering Talnets are basically class specific feats exchanging one for the other wouldn't be too game unbalancing.
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NJOfan215
Registered:
May '03
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Date Posted:
6/20/07 9:51am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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IN d20 modern, they have feats that allow you to take additional talents, we may see something like that down the line.
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dizfactor
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
6/20/07 10:01am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
- Date Edited:
6/20/07 10:01am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
dizfactor
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Many of the talents are designed around the idea that the earliest you could get them would be X level, or that you would never be able to get more than Y number of them at once without sacrificing other things. Feats and talents are not, and should not be, intraconvertible. They're supposed to be scarcer than feats.
That goes in the same category for me as being able to get trained in a cross-class skill without multiclassing: no way, no how.
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"You gotta love an elite killing force that you can fool by putting on a hat."
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Pawnnolonger
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
6/20/07 10:34am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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dizfactor posted:
Many of the talents are designed around the idea that the earliest you could get them would be X level, or that you would never be able to get more than Y number of them at once without sacrificing other things. Feats and talents are not, and should not be, intraconvertible. They're supposed to be scarcer than feats.
That goes in the same category for me as being able to get trained in a cross-class skill without multiclassing: no way, no how.
Under the old system you could get cross class skills without multi classing. Giving Talents instead of bonus feats, yeah that would be a bad idea. The regular level required feats I think it's a reasonable trade off. Some players just don't want to have their character have all these combat specializations, if they did they'd oplay a Soldier, I thing getting an extra talent or two instead of a couple of feats is good and in no way unbalancing.
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dizfactor
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
6/20/07 2:24pm
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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Pawnnolonger posted:
Under the old system you could get cross class skills without multi classing.
Not in my game. I houseruled out cross-class skills, and I applaud removing them from the game.
Pawnnolonger posted:
Giving Talents instead of bonus feats, yeah that would be a bad idea. The regular level required feats I think it's a reasonable trade off. Some players just don't want to have their character have all these combat specializations, if they did they'd oplay a Soldier, I thing getting an extra talent or two instead of a couple of feats is good and in no way unbalancing.
I think that a better solution would be putting more non-combat feats back in, personally. Plus, they can always go for Skill Training and Skill Focus.
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"You gotta love an elite killing force that you can fool by putting on a hat."
Gryph
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Corporate_Jedi
Registered:
Mar '02
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Date Posted:
6/21/07 8:16am
Subject:
RE: New Star Wars RPG Core Rulebook Coming!
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dizfactor posted:
Pawnnolonger posted:
Under the old system you could get cross class skills without multi classing.
Not in my game. I houseruled out cross-class skills, and I applaud removing them from the game.
Pawnnolonger posted:
Giving Talents instead of bonus feats, yeah that would be a bad idea. The regular level required feats I think it's a reasonable trade off. Some players just don't want to have their character have all these combat specializations, if they did they'd oplay a Soldier, I thing getting an extra talent or two instead of a couple of feats is good and in no way unbalancing.
I think that a better solution would be putting more non-combat feats back in, personally. Plus, they can always go for Skill Training and Skill Focus.
While I agree about not allowing talent for feat conversion (want the talent? take a level in the class and get it then), it did seem like the non-combat characters were left in the cold. Skill Focus is kind of bland, but I suspect what we might see in future supplements are Talent Trees which will be available to more than one class. There really needs to be a Mechanic Tree, Medic Tree, Slicer Tree etc. which I would make open to ANY class with a Skill at trained as a prereq.
Of course this won't be happening for a while since WotC chose to release a product and then provide squat for support for about 6 months. Online stuff is fine I suppose, but really there should have been 2 or three supplements before year end to capitalize on the initial interest in the line. Poor business decision guys. But I'm not bitter. 
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