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Author	Topic: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
JediAlly Registered: Oct '00	Date Posted: 6/6/07 5:56pm Subject: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
	In light of the release of the Saga Edition and my lack of success in finding an answer to this question, I must turn to this forum for answers. I have tried in the past to convert established d6 stats for certain characters to d20 first for fun, then eventually to post on the SWRPGNetwork website. I tried at first the alternate Force conversion rules provided by one of the authors at SWRPGNetwork, but I often get stats that seem either too powerful or too weak for the characters in question. Therefore, that system doesn't really work for me. After doing a search of the WotC site, I managed to find the conversion guidelines that's presented at that site. Incorporating the feats and prestige classes that have been introduced in all the sourcebooks that have been released since the OCRB won't be much of a problem. Here's the catch - while the conversion guidelines allow me to convert most of the various powers that have been presented in d6, it doesn't detail what to do with the Force skills. In other words, there's a character who has Control 3D, Sense 3D, and Alter 3D. What do I do with the die codes associated with them? Incorporate them into the total skill points pool? Keep them separate? How do I distribute them amongst the various Force skills that have been obtained by converting the d6 Force powers? Does the WotC site have a page that deals with converting the Force skills from d6 to d20? Can anyone help here? -----signature----- A Gathering of Light - new site: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798221 Liberty and Custody: http://boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=14219579 Solo Rogue Jedi: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798533
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Jedi_Matt Registered: Jul '02	Date Posted: 6/7/07 1:15am Subject: RE: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
	AFAIK you're supposed to give the character a rank in the power for each 'pip' he has in d6. So 3D in Control would mean they'd have 9 ranks in all Control based Force Skills (before ability modifiers and other bonuses) for the powers focused on more than one aspect, i'd take the average of the two or three, and use that as the rank. I suppose taking a few points out of, say, battlemind, to add to some other control based skill wouldn't be so bad if that was what the character was like, to add some character and flavour. -----signature----- Excellence - "'Cause some American-accent informed me Kun is Koon and Yun is Yoon doesn't mean I'm going to Megazord myself into robotic obediance."
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JediAlly Registered: Oct '00	Date Posted: 6/7/07 9:51am Subject: RE: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
	A nice idea, but I have three questions about it. First off, as you know, in d20 you get a set number of skill points each level and use them to purchase ranks in your skills, be they class or cross-class skills Be they Force or non-Force skills. That's why I asked about allocating the ranks I gain from the Force die codes into the total skill points pool. Tell me if the following is the way to do this: 1. Find out how many ranks I get from each Force die code. 2. Total them up, and add them to the ranks I get from the non-Force skills. 3. Determine the character's classes and levels, even if it means multiclassing or adding in levels in prestiges. I generally have an idea which class or combination of classes and prestiges I want the character to have. 4. When I have the total number of skill points available, set aside that set number of skill points that were obtained from the Force die codes. Or do I have to play around with it in case a character should have ranks in a cross-class skill, since that cost two skill points rather than one. Second, let's do what you say. The 3D in Control becomes 9 ranks which need to be distributed amongst the Control-based Force skills. Battlemind is Control-based Force skill. The corresponding power for Battlemind in d6 is combat sense and maybe danger sense, and those are Sense-based Force powers. So in this case, woudln't it make more sense to allocate ranks to the Battlemind skill from the total ranks I obtained from the Sense die code rather than the Control die code? Finally, take affect mind, a Control, Sense, and Alter power in d6, and the "healing another" powers like control another's pain and detoxify poison in another, which are Control and Alter powers. Say the character has 5D in all the Force die codes. That gives me 15 ranks in each case. Now what do I do? Take a rank from Control and Alter and give the character Heal Another +2? Or take a rank from each die code and give him Affect Mind +3? And FYI, d6 Force powers that become d20 Force feats - I can handle them. I create a list of them first. I remove from that list feats a Jedi automatically gain at certain levels, like 1st level, then just refer to the prerequisites to see which of them are available for the character. Then it's just a matter of deciding what mixture of Force and non-Force feats the character will have. But what about the "qualifier" feats - those feats that give a +2 bonus to certain skills like Gearhead, Attuned, and Dark Power? -----signature----- A Gathering of Light - new site: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798221 Liberty and Custody: http://boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=14219579 Solo Rogue Jedi: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798533
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Jedi_Matt Registered: Jul '02	Date Posted: 6/7/07 2:46pm Subject: RE: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
	I think you might have misunderstood what I meant, so I'm just going to clarify. With 3D in Control, each d20 control Power would receive 9 ranks, not have 9 skill points to distribute between all control powers. (heh, now you might see the problem with the conversion rules I've found). I think your idea of pooling all the points for redistribution is probably the safest bet, and yes, that would make working out your level that much easier. And strongly look at what force powers you had previously and the level of your base attributes & skills to determine your class direction (you more than likely have already done this, just showing my suggestions). As for Battlemind, I'd be able to argue it's closest resemblance in d6 is the Lightsaber combat power, and Danger Sense is covered (though quite naffly) by the Sense feat, giving you a wisdom check DC to avoid being surprised. It only goes into more depth with the Baran Do Sage Force Tradition Prestige Class. Jedially posted: Finally, take affect mind, a Control, Sense, and Alter power in d6, and the "healing another" powers like control another's pain and detoxify poison in another, which are Control and Alter powers. Say the character has 5D in all the Force die codes. That gives me 15 ranks in each case. Now what do I do? Take a rank from Control and Alter and give the character Heal Another +2? Or take a rank from each die code and give him Affect Mind +3? Why not both? One point for each force area it was covered by seems like a logical idea to me. I think I might be misunderstanding what you've typed there cos i'm tired, or maybe you made the typo? I don't know! One rank for each area it's covered by * One rank for each Force power it's the equivalent to. ie; accelerate another's healing (ctrl & alter) + control another's pain (ctrl & alter) + detoxify poison in another = Heal Another +6 I would also, after determining what my d20 force powers would be, and therefore how many are control based, sense based, and alter based, use this to determine the order you choose your Force Training feats. As for the "qualifier feats", I'd possibly make the decision as GM to scrap their necessity as a pre-req, or change the pre-req to a skill requirement instead (to generate some sort of synergy-style effect) I don't know if there's anything I've missed -----signature----- Excellence - "'Cause some American-accent informed me Kun is Koon and Yun is Yoon doesn't mean I'm going to Megazord myself into robotic obediance."
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JediAlly Registered: Oct '00	Date Posted: 6/7/07 3:19pm Subject: RE: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
	Nine ranks each?! Seems a bit overpowered, but I'll give it a try. It might work. I think I asked the question about powers using more than one Force die code, like control another's pain, the wrong way. I'll try again. Control 5D, Sense, 5D, Alter 5D. 15 ranks in each case. Control another pain in d6 is Heal Another in d20. I take away one rank from Control and Alter, leaving 14 ranks in each of those and 15 in Sense. Do I give the character Heal Another +2 or Heal Another +1? I ask +1 because since the d6 power falls under two skills, taking a rank away from just one of them seems to me like you're giving half a rank to the corresponding d20 skill. Finally, I disagree with the qualifier feats like Aware, Compassion, Focus, etc. In a way, they might help make things more balanced rank-wise. Say we have a human Jedi who has more ranks in Force Strike than any of the other powers he might have. By giving him the Focus feat, which gives him a +2 aptitude bonus to Force Strike rolls, you can remove two ranks from that power and give them to a different Force skill or skills, or for that matter even give them to non-Force skills. Anyway, I appreciate the time you took to answer these questions. Now I think I'll go and do a few conversions to RCRB while I still can. -----signature----- A Gathering of Light - new site: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798221 Liberty and Custody: http://boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=14219579 Solo Rogue Jedi: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798533
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JediAlly Registered: Oct '00	Date Posted: 6/7/07 6:53pm Subject: RE: Converting D6 Force skills to d20 - Date Edited: 6/7/07 8:15pm (2 edits total) Edited By: JediAlly
	Forgot two things: Those d6 skills that convert to d20 feats or have no corresponding d20 feat or skill - the die codes associated with them - what do I do with them? Throw them away? Include thm in the pool, but reassign them to Listen, Spot, and other skills that have no equivalents in d6? -----signature----- A Gathering of Light - new site: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798221 Liberty and Custody: http://boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=14219579 Solo Rogue Jedi: http://boards.theforce.net/Beyond_the_Saga/b10477/15798533
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dizfactor Registered: Aug '02	Date Posted: 6/7/07 7:50pm Subject: RE: Converting D6 Force skills to d20
	Just FYI, the Force rules for Saga Edition are totally and completely different, not to mention much, much better. I wouldn't even bother converting to the previous editions. Rodney said on the WOTC boards that 1D in WEG terms is equivalent to a +2 bonus. I suppose having 3D in all three WEG Force skills would translate to having Use the Force as a trained skill. Can't help you beyond that. I would just rebuild, rather than converting, to be honest. -----signature----- "Play is going to be for the 21st century what steam was to the 19th century." Julian Dibbell "You gotta love an elite killing force that you can fool by putting on a hat." Gryph
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