Lit SOS: Save Our Skywalker, Luke Skywalker (v3)

Got the news when I woke up and been chewing on it all day. I think worse things could happen - but of course it opens up a whole lot of worrying scenarios. Disney has shown wth Marvel adn Stra trek that they can do a good job in a new universe, I would absolutely HATE a reboot!!!!! But if it was done well, I'd probably see i anyway and who knows, I might even like it. Even like it better that EU as it is. I don't think I'd accept a reboot from Lucasarts - but since Disney's taking over, I might give them a bit more leeway since they didn't create the mess that's EU in the first place. Particularly if they made it the Marvel way that they'd take the basic characters and ideas from EU and mix it up in some interesting way. Just as Child - what I'd take VERY hard was if Mara wasn't there anymore as Luke's (future) wife. Also, I just can't see anyone but Mark, Carrie and Harrison playing the BIG3

And of course I fear that SW will turn even more into a money-milking-machine!

 

While I'm reeling and panicking from the news of Disney buying Star Wars and Episode VII coming out in only three more years (more like, unless its in December 2015 but summer seems more likely so less than three years probably for an entirely new Star Wars movie), I might not mind a new Luke actor if they can find a decent one. Before the Star Trek reboot I wasn't sure about anyone else playing Kirk or Spock or McCoy but all the new actors have turned out quite good. But then the 2009 Star Trek was also clear about not erasing the past, it was just an... alternate take on the iconic trio.

On the other hand, having old Mark Hamill as Grandmaster Luke could be good, or even just as a voiceover. I'm mostly sure Hamill is still doing voice acting, and if he can still do one of the best Joker voices ever (I thought he said Arkham Asylum was his last, but then he did Arkham City too, so large amounts of money were probably involved) he can do a Luke voiceover cameo.

It might be interesting to see Luke on the big screen again (having Luke pushed aside for Anakin Skywalker for most of the last decade has gotten annoying), but I'm afraid they probably wouldn't do it well. While Lucas not being in charge anymore could probably out to be a good thing, he's still advising, and I'm not expecting most other people to handle it well either, much less incorporate any EU aspects. Why bother when they can just make up their own? I'd love a big screen Thrawn trilogy or Dark Empire adaptation but 1) I doubt they could adapt it well (they couldn't even do that with Harry Potter, and LotR took a lot of liberties too) and 2) they probably won't bother adapting rather than just making up their own story... especially since they're planning Episode VIII and IX too before 2020 I think.

It might not be the worst possible news, and its not like Luke in Star Wars has been doing that great recently (that even worse version of the Crucible cover they've decided on for instance), but still, not celebrating.

 

Hard to say how things are going to go, but for me, reboots have been, for the last year, the trigger point for me to seriously prune and jump-off of franchises, not stay on.

Books? If anyone messes with the upcoming Star Wars: Kenobi by JJM, I will not be happy!

Comics? I'm far from as enamoured of Marvel as others seem to be, nor am I convinced we'll get anywhere near the level of risky innovation DHC has done over the last 25 years.

A full reboot? Well, I'm not selling my collection! Far as I'm concerned the stories I have will always count - obviously, some certain infamous texts are not included! I seriously doubt anything as elegant as Trek's blinder of a revamp can be pulled off, Wars works very differently to Trek after all.

 

Tim Battershell:

Do you mean placing Legacy farther down the timeline? I suppose that's possible, but if Disney is truly making new films, they may not want to worry about having to connect the dots to any EU stories. From a blurb I read today, it seems that Episode VII will be a totally new story. It said somelike like "Forget what you think you know about Luke's future," or something like that. The blurb also said that Luke, Leia, and Han would be involved in the story. That would either mean they would have to use an all-new cast (Something I hope they won't do.) if they are planning to have the story soon after RotJ, OR they could set the story many years after RotJ and use Luke, Leia, and Han, probably as background characters. In that case, the original actors could play those roles.

I would prefer it if Abeloth and all of those multitudes of Sith *would* disappear from canon frankly. I'm really not a fan of either. I liked the fact that Luke only had to face two Sith. Even though they were enormously powerful and difficult to defeat, at least there were only TWO of them. It made the task seem at least slightly possible. How Luke and his small Jedi order are supposed to completely get rid of two groups of thousands of Sith and Abeloth is completely mindboggling.

Would they even have known in time to tell TD???? I think I heard that Disney approached Lucas a year and a half ago, but things don't seem to have gotten serious until a lot more recently... maybe even about June. If so, that would have been far too late to include it in Denning's book, I think.







kataja :

For me, since I've been so disappointed in the direction that the post-RotJ EU has taken, and since I haven't liked what's been done with Luke's character very often since VotF, a reboot doesn't sound that awful to me anymore. I might have been annoyed if this had taken place right after VotF, but with what I now know has happened to Luke and the galaxy since then, I wouldnt mind a chance for a different future for Luke and the SW galaxy. Will I like it better? I have no idea. It depends, of course, on what is done in the films. But I'm looking at this as possibly a fresh start. For the first time in a long time, I'm daring to hope that maybe we'll get a new, more positive, and optimistic direction for SW.

And either way, better or worse, we still *DO* have those other Bantam and Del Rey stories out there to read if we wish and to pick what we want to be in our own personal canon.

The more I think about it though, the more exciting it seems. We're actually going to get NEW SW films that take place post-RotJ! It's something I never thought I'd ever see happen, and I know that after seeing RotJ I really WANTED to see those sequel films. I was disappointed that Lucas chose to film the prequels instead.

It's also possible that now the SW saga won't be thought of as "Anakin's Story" anymore....

Yes, that, for me, would be the greatest loss... But she will always be Luke's wife in the current timeline no matter what else happens. Those stories won't disappear.

No, I can't either....









Nobody145:

,

I think this is the way it was originally supposed to be when Lucas first broached the topic with the actor. I would really love to see a series of films about Luke and his Jedi Order, but as I said, I doubt this will happen.

On the other hand, I will admit that I would really enjoy reading about a bit younger Luke as a Jedi knight in the midst of the action. But for this to happen, it *would* mean another actor, sadly.

It would be great!

That's my fear too, which is why my excitement over new SW films is also tempered with nervousness about what they will actually do and how they will do it.

That's what I think too. Besides, if they were to include some of the EU, what parts of it would they include? What parts would be dropped? It would make the project far more difficult and it would even limit their possible storylines.







Jedi Ben:

But you haven't liked or even read a lot of the recent fiction, JB. So maybe this would be an opportunity for you to finally get stories that you might enjoy? I guess I'd like to think positively about this. I have pretty much no faith that Denning will portray Luke the way I want to see him or write a story that I will enjoy in Crucible, but for the first time in a long time, I'm hopeful that maybe there will be a SW story that I can really cheer about again.

I agree. They're still there to read and enjoy and be included in personal canon.

More another time...

 

If Disney plans to really take advantage of the Star Wars license, I hope they open up to the idea of doing animated movies. That would definitely be the best avenue to explore Luke's various stories, I think.

The movies I'm mixed on, but the Star Wars license changing hands does have some exciting implications. I'd love for Star Wars to do something similar to DC, and release direct to video (but very high quality) films semi-regularly, some all new stories, and some adaptations. I'm sure the Thrawn trilogy would be one of the first things on the priority list if they did something like that.

 

Exactly what I meant.

They can make new films to fit into gaps in the existing timeline, I don't particularly care if they connect the dots to EU stories or not.

But what I don't want to hear (and would make me bail if it happens) is "forget what you know about Luke's future". I buy SW books for two reasons, that they have Continuity (otherwise I might just as well have spent all the money on Trek novels, where there is none - and never has been) and because I want to know what happens book to book into the future.

For me a 'personal canon' that does not continue down the road isn't worth the paper it's printed on. I would consider that outcome to be Cultural Vandalism.

If Lucas did talk to Mark and Carrie about a Sequel Trilogy, then it looks a reasonable prospect that they would be invited to reprise their roles.

As stated, Abeloth is (probably) neutralised for a goodish while - having an OOB experience. Was/is there any indication of the Son returning thus far after his encounter with Anakin's Lightsaber? That would seem to be the nearest equivalent.

Individually, Luke's Jedi seem to be better at combat than their equivalent ranks within the Lost Tribe, the same goes for ship-to-ship quality and expertise - one does not learn fleet tactics in two or three years and the Lost Tribe's ships are outdated cast-offs. Even if they managed to get their hands on an SSD it wouldn't be too immediately worrying - they'd have the problem of finding sufficient trained crew for it (for starters) and the GFFA fleet would still have a firepower superiority.

All the Jedi really need to do with the Lost Tribe (once they find Kesh) is to bottle them up on that planet and enforce a blockade. Planetary bombardments optional!

Krayt (unless there's another 'surprise twist') seems likely to keep in the shadows and continue to bide his time

IIRC the posts, the meeting with Mark and Carrie re. the sequels happened sometime August 2011; see Mecalich's post on P 28 of the Disney Purchase thread, pasted below =>

 

http://unitedfederationofcharles.blogspot.com/2012/11/disney-buys-lucasfilmand-my-childhood.html

Here's my thoughts on the Lucasfilm buyout.

Overall, I'm cautiously optimistic.

 

Whatever they do with Episode VII, I hope they include more female heroes.

 

Charles, I really enjoyed your essay on Luke. Kudos.

I'm not worried about the disney buy out. Not at all.
Lucasfilm isn't going away. Its just going to be owned by a parent company, like Marvel or Pixar. Both of those companies still do wonderful work, and can operate fairly autonomously. I'm very excited about the new movies.

I'm assuming that the heads up to Mark Hamilll (who is one of my favorite actors simply for his VO work) and Carrie Fischer leads me to believe that Luke and Leia will be in the movie. Its as if George was saying "Hey guys, we got this thing going on...GET IN SHAPE!"

 

I posted this on the Disney-thread, but as it's Luke related I quote it here too.
Thoughts anyone?

more later...

 

If Luke is in the new trilogy, played by Mark Hamill, I fully expect for him to die. And I will bawl my eyes out.

 

Yeah hopefully that can finally end, as it was such a weird cop out by GL. The OT was clearly not “Anakin’s Story” no matter how much he said it when the PT came out.

He should just leave it as:
PT = Anakin’s Story
OT = Luke’s Story
ST = Jaina’s Story (or whoever)

And you have links between the trilogies, hopefully each spaced about 15-20 years apart so Mark Hamill can play Luke again. Obi won links the PT and OT, and Luke can link the OT and ST.

I do think if Mark Hamill plays Luke and it is set that far down the line, he will die, either like Obi won in ANH or like Yoda in ESB. And I think that would be rather fitting, either way

I think it would be too weird to do something soon after RotJ but not soon enough for Hamill to play Luke. Plus, given the almost 20 year time frame between PT and OT, it seems to fit nicely for them to skip that far ahead for the ST. The could even go ahead the exact same time frame and still have Hamill play Luke, given how much Obi won aged between RotS and ANH.

I wonder what the new threat would be though. I’ll assume Sith in some fashion, which would void the other Sith that have come before (which would be tricky with Caedus, if they keep Han and Leia’s kids the same) and leave it that Luke destroyed the Sith, and they don’t return until the ST. I’d be ok with that


I wonder if Chewie will be alive though

 

....I hadn't even thought of this.

And now, I'm suddenly even LESS optimistic....

 

It's not an absolute rule COW, I reserve the option to buy if a work receives a sufficiently good buzz - so Clone Wars revision and Miller's books are a case in point. BUT on the whole, I do not like reboots, they are, at heart, fundamentally dishonest for me! (Trek's is something of an exception as a strong case can be made for all the prior stories not only still existing but are actually required to create the new timeline!) DC's reboot? It's no surprise the only books I'm getting are those I can graft nigh-on seamlessly to the old structure! Top Cow's? Were it not for the stupidly talented Stepjan Sejic, I'd have bailed, but he and Marz have done something unexpected and that's retained my interest in 1 book, but previously it was 3-4! Star Wars? Would be similar.

Why? DC perhaps offers the best illustration, whenever they reset and DC do it more often than most, the line is: Oh, but you can see characters meet up for the first time, origins have been subtly changed etc. My response? Why should this excite me? I've seen those characters meet up, it was the relationships and stories built up around them that made it work. Origin stories? Is there anything more boring? Maybe there'll actually be some surprises, but I'm sceptical. Which is the other thing here - I estimate I've gone through 3-4 cycles of SW stories, after cycle 3 it was hard to muster up enthusiasm as so many of the moves that can be made I'd seen before. Sometimes that's no bad thing, if a writer is skilled enough, but such has not been the case with the majority of SW EU of the last few years. Can I be bothered to go through the setting up the story stage, then the intermediate part - neither side can reallt win, then onto a conclusion, followed by more stories? Unless it's damn good, I find myself concluding: Nay!

Then there is the corporate angle, which is what really generates reboots. Corporations, whatever they claim, care little for fans or loyalty, all they want is your money. To me, reboots should be punished by the withdrawal of money. It is, true, utterly unfair to the new creative teams, but opposing big corporations means someone who doesn't deserve it is going to get hit in the process. Sad, but too bad. I know Disney will not even register my withdrawal of funds, that's beside the point. I'm not exactly looking to buy much Marvel stuff anyway as I'm cheesed off with their antics too! Why does a reboot offend so much? Because it's throwing out a load of stories I bought, that were sold as counting! Then, due to corporate fiat, they don't! But I should overlook this and buy the new stuff, which will count - until they decide it doesn't? No, I refuse to play! Again, this doesn't mean I can't be sold a really good new work by fan buzz - that door's always open, but the success criteria will be very high indeed!

(I also doubt the injection of poisonous cynicism into SW that the PT represented can really be solved even with a reboot!)

 

I doubt they'd kill Luke just to preserve the Obi-Wan/Qui Gon dies thing.

 

If they do go for keeping Luke alive, what is now thought about him finishing up in a Mortis-Keeper-of-the Balance type role?



I would think it would be pushing things to set Episode 7 any earlier than 40 ABY.

 

would there really be a reboot??? Or is this just movies into the future. What will happen to the EU?

 

I took a peek in the new Episode VII forum, and, from my quick visit, the sense in there seems to be jubilant and celebritory about a new SW film, vastly different than the general sense of sadness, fear, and gloom I'm sensing here in LIT...




instantdeath:

That's probably true. We could at least get some stories where Luke is a far younger Jedi and Jedi Master that way without the necessity of using new actors.

I'm excited, but nervous about them. I don't want them to turn out like the prequels, which I really didn't like. And I really don't want to find out that Luke never married and had kids. That would be very disappointing. I'm hoping that we'll get to see Luke as a Jedi Grandmaster leading and dispensing wisdom to the young Jedi, including his own son/children or grandson/grandchildren. I'm hoping we will see that Luke has restored a flourishing Jedi Order if this takes place several decades after RotJ.








Tim Battershell:

Well, as I said in a previous post, I would really love to find out in the film that Luke did indeed meet and marry Mara Jade and that they shared a son, Ben. However, in all honesty, I doubt that will happen. I think the person who said "forget what you know about Luke's future" really meant it. It would be very difficult for Disney to try to fit in three decades' worth of EU stories while trying to tell an exciting story of their own without being restricted by anything in the books and comics. And to pick and choose just a few EU things would please some and alienate others.

Also, remember that Lucas has always pretty much said that there was his story as told in the films and the other stories that were told through books and comics. He seemed to suggest that the EU was a parallel universe, if I read his comments correctly.

Plus, there's the big important fact that EU readers are really only a very small portion of SW fans. Those other people don't know much or even anything about the EU, and I don't really think that it would be a wise move for them to produce a new film with a lot of "baggage" that most viewers have no clue about just to please a small portion of the fanbase.

Maybe I'm totally wrong about this, but it just seems simpler and less troublesome to pretty much just use the continuity from the previous six films, which all fans have as a common base and to use the EU as an alternate timeline.

Apparently, he really did talk to them over lunch, but it doesn't sound like Lucas broached the subject of using them in the sequel films. It seems like it was more or less a "heads up" for them, to let them know before it became public knowledge. At least, that's the way it sounds.
.

But we don't know that for certain. Either way, would Disney want to deal with her and with two groups of thousands of SIth???

I agree with that, but Luke's Jedi also lack the large numbers that both groups of Sith have. The sheer numbers of Sith are problematic for Luke and his Jedi.

It would be great if they could do that! Unfortunately, it seems as though a lot of them are on the loose in the galaxy, so even if the Jedi "bottled up" the Sith on Kesh, there would still be many more of them unaccounted for.

Would the new filmmakers really want to deal with him and his thousands of Sith? How would you explain Krayt to those who don't read the EU?

Are they sure it was August of 2011 and not 2012? Either way, Jennifer Heddle? (is that right?) didn't seem to know all that much. She didn't seem to have any idea how this news would affect the EU, and Zahn was totally floored.







Charlemagne19:

I'm trying to be cautiously optimistic also, C!

That's probably a good attitude to have. I really do hope that we don't see Luke's death in one of the films, unless it *is* as a very old man, surrounded by family and Jedi!







jedimaster:

I'd like to think so, but from what Hamill said in the interview, it didn't seem like it. I don't want to get too hopeful about that.







kataja:

That's a really interesting and creative theory, K! It could certainly work. It's ingenious in that it could preserve all of the present EU without stepping on anything. But it would need to take place far enough in the future where it really could be a totally new story. It would explain why they couldn't kill Luke. But it could also be as simple as Lucas not wanting his alter-ego killed off in an EU story too...








JediMara77:

That would be two of us, JM!





marmkid: WELCOME BACK! You have been missed!!!! I'll get to your post tomorrow!

 

I won't be going to the cinema for any of these (as I did for all the others), I'll just wait until they appear on Network TV or take out an economical subscription to 'LoveFilm.com' or similar.

So long as the EU carries on (with its existing continuity) then that would be OK with me.

True, but we/they carried the torch (and probably started even more people down the SW path) while GL was 'on pause' with SW.

It would make for some tremendous Lightsaber and Ship to Ship battles - high visual impact.

The Lost Tribe may have mobility problems, they destroyed several of their own ships before Abeloth & Khai left Kesh - the quesion is, how many remain??? Also, with Abeloth's influence removed, what are the crews going to do - they rebelled against their own High Lord, don't forget -- and Sith aren't exactly known for their forgiving natures! Probably their best chance would be to turn pirate -- then it's possible that GAAF Fleet units could eliminate them by the shipload, or at least shadow them until Jedi Stealth Xs or Jedi-crewed warships could close and finish the job.

It doesn't seem to me that Krayt has all that many active Sith available at this time either -- the most that have been seen together is 30. Remember that there was only one actual Sith sent to Lumila's asteroid -- all the others were mercenaries. He has 90 years to turn/train/clone his Legacy attack force, on current continuity.

My guess is that those 'on the loose' would head for Kesh asap. The longer they are away, the more likely it is that some other Sith would help themselves to their holdings and/or status -- and as there is now something of a power vacuum at the top of their society, they would also not want to loose their chance for 'pickings' of their own (something else that might reduce their numbers, in the inevitable dominance fights) -- plus there's the risk of coming across Jedi while they are still 'at large'.

 

I know exactly what you mean! Actually, I think every SW fan at some level, feels this - a new hope...

But I'll do my very best to keep my expectations low. I know nothing will live up to my hopes - nothing can be a great as seeing ESB first time - it's just not possible
But it could still be decent - good even... I just saw John Carter and it was really fun - and adapted very well to film too!

This, I think, is pretty certain...

If they make the new trilogy an original story, leaving the timespan 4-44 ABY untouched, it could well happen in the future. I've always though Mark Hamill was onto somehting when he sad that if they could make movies withut actors, Goerge would do it. He obviously referred to Lucas' awkwaredness with the actors, but imagine when technology becomes jsta little bit better - they'll be able to revive young Mark Hamille & co! What a money machine they'd have!!!

This s definitely a good possibility too! I know many people don't like the stories, the way Eu has gone - but it has still been a wild ride with so much effort spent. And the stories ust lie there - ready to use. I think it would be silly to just throw them away but reboting the lot. If I was Disney, I'd start a new fresh place and wait deciding about a possible reboot!

Besides, as they pointed out in Toshi station -- if a storie makes to film - somekind of change in storyline is inevitable anyway!

This is my take on it too, at least at the moment. I can't just accept that money changes hands and suddenly every story I loved or (even worse) every story I've fought hard to accept and take to my heart JUST BECAUSE ITS STAR WARS is declaired non-valid. It's just not respectful!!! Let Disney show they can handle the heritage - then start talking.

And why does this so make me think of Crucible?!?

Heard! Heard!
BUt a look at Prince of Persia, John Carter and the Avengers gives me hope. Yeah, still males in title, still only one woman in Avengers but then there was Hill and all roles were very well casted.

I hope taht too. And even if it wasn't, its' kinda heartwarming that these from the "old gang" came together

So will I. Both. But if he has no Mara to be united with, I'll be devastated!!!!!!!

The only fitting way, yes. But I'll still cry. And I definitely mean what I say above about Mara!!!!

I have it exactly the same way!!! Great points, Ben!!!

I don't think taht's interesting for the new trilogy at all! But I think it could be a way to 'preserve' Luke until the trilogy. Unles Dening has another, creative way in Crucible

This is very true - which would make it smart to jump so far into the timeline taht you don't have to be affected it it at all. Things is, that an episode 7 will rekindle interest for SW and it would be smarter for them to have novels to send the interested audience off to - if all the books were suddenly invalid, t would be kinda. meek.

What if he was the last of his generation (maybe save Leia) and everyone they loved were eagerly waiting for them? I think that would be fine too.

It could, yeas. But my theory is more rational, so I put my hope in it as for now...

 

Ok, a few late catch ups...

You're right in this. That was the part taht really bored me in Avengers too - where thye just HAD to fight a shortsighted government too I'm so tired of seeing every official and politicians in particular, portrayed as selfish, greedy and stupid!!!

Well,

Exactly - and this is where his heroism first shows. As theyb say in Harry Potter I - ont thing is to face outcoming dangers - another to go against your friends.

A toast to that!

My take is that it's the Big 3 show go into hibernation (or similar - probably not hibernation) and return, still their current age, somewhere in the future there they don't have to care a whit about what has happened in the NR, the GFFA or anything like it.
I'm really in love with taht theory - there's so much taht would fit with it. The Luke-mustn't-die- stuff, the fact that the BIg 3 are the age now taht ObiWan was in ANH (I mean, they've been stomping around there for ages now, ever since LOTF started!), even Mara's death makes sense in that perspective! Lucas has been talking about retiring for a logn time now - and he must have norurished the hopes of the last trilogy all along. He could easily have said he wants Luke alive but with no wife, only Leia and Han! They could have ordered Denning to give more space to the rest of the order in Apocalypse to make them seem ready to take over - that could have come pretty late while hey were writng FOTJ and would explain why Apocalypse was les Luke oriented than the rest of FOTJ! Also, the introduction of the Mortiss into Apocalypse, could be a clue to what will happen to Luke, Leia and Han now... We know it happened rather late in FOTJ - what if it wasn't as much an explanation to Abeloth as a clue to what comes next???

Speculating wildly here...

 

Well what K? A missing paragraph?

 

Hnh? Oh - yeah LOL. I realized that hadn't much intelligent to add to that! You're right of course - women act as bad as men villains but are excused just because they're gals. And the men who already didn't fight, are in an even more odd position than before. Unless you do a Luke and answer to aggression with openness and trust.



Since last post BTW, I've grown more and more certain that I hope for Luke to mirror King Arthur and simply 'go away'. And at the start of episode 7, they realize there's a chance to get him back!

 

What's with all this talk about about Episode 7 ? I'm out of it for a couple of days due to Sandy and people start getting delusions of grandeur.

just a few comments, if Disney maintains a distant ownership while allowing creative freedom see(Marvel Studios and the Avengers) then we might actually have something to look forward too. Heck imagine Joss Whedon doing Episode 7(Firefly) and seeing Luke on the big screen again I'm still racking my brain as this sounds like a rumor yet its actually true that Disney acquired the rights....maybe now us Luke fans now have something to truly look forward too.

though I would wait to see what writers, directors, and actors they get before we get too caught up in the moment. also it seems like Clone Wars will be over(yay)

That said I hope they don't cast Mark Hamill back in the role as I feel he's not right for the role anymore see my avatar and compare his photo....ok I'm being vain but I do think Hamill's days as a jedi are behind him.

 

The internet went crazy, 500+ users active at one time near-killed the forum and the Apocalypse of Daiman is upon us!

Outside of that, nothing much!