Full Series Retcons and fitting in TCW into the broader EU

Cancelling TCW and 1313, and if the rumors are true, gutting LucasArts and the animation division could be considered extreme. Not proof, but evidence that Disney will definitely be doing things differently.

 

>Fails to see anything correlating to TCW's placement in continuity being changed
Stop Grasping at straws

 

Huh? The point is Disney is radically changing things. If they didn't care about jettisoning TCW, why would they care about novels and comics, which reach a much smaller audience?

I say this with all sincerity, I'm only trying to convince you because you're going to be horribly disappointed.

 

We don't even know why TCW got discontinued. And they were releasing stuff anyways

 

LucasArts killed itself.

 

Did their games start to suck? Haven't played a SW game since the PS2 days.

 

The last great game they developed and published was in 2005 and 2006 respectively. TFU wasn't all the hype it was made out to be. I had faith LA would of made a crazy comeback...

 

Anyone know how the Nelvaan storyline from the Tartakovsky CW shorts were retconned to fit in with "Labyrinth of Evil"?

 

They weren't. They took place before it happened

 

Thanks for the clarification.

 

I'm not pointing fingers, but it seems to me that it's the same folks making the same complaints in most threads - I can almost tell who wrote what post by what the post states.

I've got a the original Burger King glasses, comics, other mags, some figures (OT and PT), and a fair amount of the EU books so I've got a fair bit invested myself in Star Wars, so I do have a bit of my finger in the same pot but you know what - if some if it turns out to be non-canon, guess what - I don't care, *I* can still enjoy it. Even Obsession, if it's now decanonized.

 

For the record, I've been experimenting with a comprehensive timeline over in Lit this past week now that we know the rough majority of the material we're receiving from the show. Of course, it may change based on how material in those last arcs play out, but I actually doubt much will need to change, as the final s6 arcs could easily branch into the 19BBY period.

I know some of you will be hesitant to accept new and old CW related material merging 'at all', but even so, this is the rough chronological order I thought might work and still make sense.

Do note that current sources on the actual timeline of the war have been conflicting these past few years. All we know is that Leland Chee says "months" occur before Christophsis, which contradicts with some sources attempting to say only weeks. If we are not to decanonize all the old stories (which is kind of the goal of this timeline), it could go something like this. Also note that my chosen episode order follows the one released in the Chronology thread on this board, which will match the entries Chee is doing on the SW Blog. I'm pretty much set on this being the (near) final order of stories unless there are really 'major' errors somewhere in this. I will also not change official series episode orders at this point, save anything in the bonus content that compels me to do so.

Month 1-? (6 to 9) ABG (After the Battle of Geonosis)
Boba Fett#1: The Fight to Survive (chapters 1-21)
(Scholastic)Death in the Catacombs
(Insider #79: Wizards of the Coast)
Elusion Illusion: A Tale of the Clone Wars(Insider #66: Wizards of the Coast; Hyperspace)
Clone Wars Adventures Volume 8: One of a Kind(Dark Horse)
Galactic Battlegrounds: Clone Campaigns(Lucasarts home video game)
Sev'Rance Tan Campaign: Missions 7.2–7.7
Echuu Shen-Jon Campaign: Missions 8.2–8.6
The Clone Wars(Lucasarts home video game)
Rhen Var: Mission 4
Raxus Prime: Mission 5
Boba Fett #2: Crossfire(chapters 1–8)
The Clone Wars(Raxus Prime: Missions 6–7) (Lucasarts home video game)
Boba Fett#1: The Fight to Survive(chapters 22–end) (Scholastic)
Boba Fett #2: Crossfire(chapters 9–18)
Republic #49: Sacrifice
The Clone Wars (Lucasarts home video game)
Alaris Prime: Missions 8–10
Rhen Var: Missions 11–12
Thule Moon: Mission 13
Thule: Missions 14–16
Clone Wars: Volume I: Episodes 6–7
Republic #50: The Defense of Kamino (Dark Horse)
Brothers in Arms
Jango's Legacy
No End in Sight
Republic #51–52: The New Face of War
Republic Commando: Hard Contact(Chapter 2–end) (Del Rey)
Jedi: Mace Windu: Schism
Clone Wars Adventures: Volume 8: Old Scores(Dark Horse)
Clone Wars Adventures: Volume 10: Graduation Day (Dark Horse)
Tales #14: Tides of Terror(Dark Horse: collected in Tales Volume 4)
Republic#53: Blast Radius
Storm Fleet Warnings (Hasbro Short Story Collection: Paizo Publishing)
Duel(Hasbro Short Story Collection: Paizo Publishing)
Clone Wars: Volume I: Episodes 1–5
Clone Wars Adventures: Volume 1: Fierce Currents(Dark Horse)
Clone Wars: Volume I: Episodes 12–16(Cartoon Network series: Season Two)
Clone Wars: Volume I: Episodes 8–10 (Cartoon Network series: Season One)
[adapted in Clone Wars Photocomic, pages 60: 2nd half of page–end; Dark Horse]
Clone Wars: Volume I(Cartoon Network series: Season Two)
Episode 11
Episodes 17–20
Clone Wars: Volume II: Episode 21 (first segment)
Jedi: Shaak Ti: Catspaw(Dark Horse: collected in Clone Wars Volume 2: Victories and Sacrifices)
Clone Wars Adventures(Dark Horse)
Volume 3:
Rogue's Gallery
Volume1:
Blind Force
Heavy Metal Jedi
Volume 2:
Hide in Plain Sight(reprints Clone Wars Adventures: Free Comic Book Day)
Run Mace Run
Skywalkers(flashback)
Volume 3:
The Package
A Stranger in Town
One Battle
Volume 7:
Spy Girl
This Precious Shining
Volume 8:
Versus
Pathways
Volume 9:
Salvaged
Appetite for Adventure
Life Below
No Way Out
Volume 10:
Chain of Command
Waiting
Clone Wars AdventuresVolume 7: Impregnable
Republic #54: Double Blind
Jedi: Aayla Secura
Shatterpoint(chapters 1–23)(Del Rey)
Legacy of the Jedi(pages 145–end) (Scholastic)
Jedi: Count Dooku(Dark Horse: collected in Clone Wars Volume 4: Light and Dark)
The New Droid Army(Lucasarts home video game)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 14:2:12(Insider #65)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 14:2:14(Insider #65)
The Clone Wars: Hero of Cartao (Wizards of the Coast)
Episode I: Hero's Call (Insider #68)
Episode II: Hero's Rise (Insider #69)
Episode III: Hero's End (Insider #70)
Tales #19: Rather Darkness Visible (Dark Horse: collected in Tales Volume 5)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 14:3:10 Edition(Insider #66)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 14:3:22 (Insider #66)
Tales #22: Honor Bound (Dark Horse)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 14:4:12 Edition(Insider #67)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 14:4:14(Insider #67)
Clone Wars Adventures (Dark Horse)
Volume 5: Bailed Out
Volume 6
It Takes a Thief
Means and Ends
The Cestus Deception(Del Rey)
Republic HoloNet News Core Edition 14:7:02 (Insider #68)
Republic
#55: Rainmakers
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 14:9:01(Insider #69)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 14:9:04(Insider #70)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 14:9:08 Edition(Insider #69)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 14:9:15 Edition(Insider #70)
#56: Stormchasers
#57: Lightning Rods(retitled Thunder and Lightning in trade paperback)
#58: Floodgates(retitled Thunder and Lightning in trade paperback)
#59: Enemy Lines(retitled The Storm after the Storm in trade paperback)
#61: Dead Ends(Dark Horse)
#63: Striking from the Shadows
#64: Bloodlines
#60: Hate and Fear
#62: No Man's Land
Jedi: Yoda(Dark Horse: collected in Clone Wars Volume 5: The Best Blades)
Republic (Dark Horse)
#65-66: Show of Force
#67: Forever Young
General Grievous #1–4(Dark Horse)
Republic #68: Armor
Jedi Trial(Del Rey)
Clone Wars: Volume II: Episode 21 (remainder of the episode)
Republic#69–71: Dreadnaughts of Rendili
Clone Wars Adventures (Dark Horse)
Volume 4: Another Fine Mess
Volume 4: The Brink
Volume 7: Creature Comforts
Volume 10: Thunder Road

Month ?(6 to 9)-30 ABG
-GAME: Jedi Alliance (Sedawan, Coruscant, Rodia, Christophsis)
-WEB/116: Shadowed (page 1)
2.16: Cat and Mouse
-WEB/116: Shadowed (rest)
1.16: The Hidden Enemy
-RPG: WotC Miniatures/RPG: 25 to Rescue
-NOVEL1: The Clone Wars (film novelization)
The Clone Wars (Film)
Boba Fett #2: Crossfire(chapters 19-end)**
-JRNOVEL: Decide Your Destiny: Tethan Battle Adventure
-JRNOVEL: Decide Your Destiny: The Way of the Jedi
-GAME: Jedi Alliance (Battle of the Devastation)
-SHORT: Outfoxed
-COMVOL4: Colossus of Destiny
-COMVOL5: The Deadly Hands of Shon-Ju
-JRNOVEL: Journey Through Hyperspace (UK)
-JRNOVEL: Decide Your Destiny: Crisis on Coruscant
3.01: Clone Cadets
-WEB/118: Covetous
3.03: Supply Lines
-WEB/101: Prelude
1.01: Ambush
-WEB/103: Procedure
-COMVOL1: Shipyards of Doom
-WEB/102: Shakedown
-PODCAST1: HoloNet News 1 - A Galaxy Divided
1.02: Rising Malevolence
1.03: Shadow of Malevolence
-WEB/104: Agenda
1.04: Destroy Malevolence
-JRNOVEL: Secret Missions #1: Breakout Squad
-JRNOVEL: Secret Missions #2: Black Hole Pirates
-JRNOVEL: Secret Missions #3: Duel at the Shattered Rock
-JRNOVEL: Secret Missions #4: Guardians of the Chiss Key
-WEB/105: Mouse Hunt
1.05: Rookies
-JRNOVEL: Decide Your Destiny: Crisis on Coruscant
-NOVEL2: Wild Space
-WEB/106: The Fall of Falleen
1.06: Downfall of a Droid
-WEB/107: Discount
1.07: Duel of the Droids
-NOVEL3: No Prisoners
-COMVOL2: Crash Course
-COMVOL3: The Wind Raiders of Taloraan
-PODCAST2: HoloNet News 2 - Rodia Supply Lanes Attacked by Pirates!
-WEB/108: Departure
1.08: Bombad Jedi
-WEB/109: Transfer
1.09: Cloak of Darkness
-WEB/110: The Dreams of General Grievous
1.10: Lair of Grievous
-GAME: Lightsaber Duels (Separatist Droid Lab)
-PODCAST3: HoloNet News 3 - Chancellor Palpatine's Approval Ratings Fall
-WEB/111: Bait
1.11: Dooku Captured
-WEB/112: Switch
1.12: The Gungan General
-WEB/113: Headgames
1.13: Jedi Crash
-WEB/114: Neighbors
1.14: Defenders of Peace
-WEB/115: Cold Snap
1.15: Trespass
-WEB/117: The Valley
1.17: Blue Shadow Virus
1.18: Mystery of a Thousand Moons
-WEB/119: Curfew
1.19: Storm Over Ryloth
1.20: Innocents of Ryloth
-WEB/120: The Ballad of Cham Syndulla
1.21: Liberty on Ryloth
-SWTCW: In the Service of the Republic
-GAME: Republic Heroes
2.01: Holocron Heist
2.02: Cargo of Doom
-WEB/201: Act On Instinct, Part 1
-WEB/202: Act On Instinct, Part 2
-WEB/203: Act On Instinct, Part 3
2.03: Children of the Force
-WEB/204-215: Act On Instinct, Part 4-End
-WEB/3: The Valsedian Operation
2.17: Bounty Hunters
2.18: The Zillo Beast
2.19: The Zillo Beast Strikes Back
2.04: Senate Spy
2.05: Landing at Point Rain
2.06: Weapons Factory
2.07: Legacy of Terror
2.08: Brain Invaders
-SWTCW: Hero of the Confederacy
2.09: Grievous Intrigue
2.10: The Deserter
2.11: Lightsaber Lost
Boba Fett#3:Maze of Deception(Scholastic)**
2.20: Death Trap
2.21: R2 Come Home
2.22: Lethal Trackdown
3.04: Sphere of Influence
3.02: ARC Troopers
2.12: The Mandalore Plot
2.13: Voyage of Temptation
2.14: Duchess of Mandalore
-FCBD2009: The Gauntlet of Death
-NOVEL4: Clone Wars Gambit: Stealth
-NOVEL5: Clone Wars Gambit: Siege
3.05: Corruption
3.06: The Academy
3.07: Assassin
3.08: Evil Plans
-WEB/121: Invitation Only
1.22: Hostage Crisis
-WEB/122: Hunting the Hunters, Part I
-WEB/XX1: Gunship Over Florrum
-GAME: Gunship Over Florrum
-PODCAST5: HoloNet News - A Galaxy Divided (part 2)
-PODCAST6: HoloNet News - A Galaxy Divided (part 3)
-PODCAST7: HoloNet News - A Galaxy Divided (part 4)
-PODCAST8: HoloNet News - A Galaxy Divided (part 5)
3.09: Hunt for Ziro
-WEB/123: Hunting the Hunters, Part II
-GAME: Swamp Station Sweep
-WEB/XX2: Swamp Station Sweep
-WEB/124: Hunting the Hunters, Part III
-WEB/XX3: Droids Over Iego
-GAME: Droids Over Iego
-COMVOL 6: The Starcrusher Trap
3.10: Heroes on Both Sides
3.11: Pursuit of Peace
2.15: Senate Murders
3.12: Nightsisters
3.13: Monster
3.14: Witches of the Mist
-COMVOL 7: Strange Allies
-SWTCW: Opress Unleashed
3.15: Overlords
3.16: Altar of Mortis
3.17: Ghosts of Mortis
3.18: The Citadel
3.19: Counterattack
3.20: Citadel Rescue
-COMVOL 8: The Enemy Within
3.21: Padawan Lost
3.22: Wookiee Hunt
4.01: Water War
4.02: Gungan Attack
4.03: Prisoners
4.04: Shadow Warrior
4.05: Mercy Mission
4.06: Nomad Droids
4.07: Darkness on Umbara
4.08: The General
4.09: Plan of Dissent
4.10: Carnage of Krell
4.11: Kidnapped
4.12: Slaves of the Republic
4.13: Escape from Kadavo
4.14: A Friend in Need
4.15: Deception
4.16: Friends and Enemies
4.17: The Box
4.18: Crisis on Naboo
Obsession #1–5(Dark Horse: collected in Clone Wars Volume 7: When They Were Brothers)*
Boba Fett #4: Hunted(Scholastic)**
4.19: Massacre
4.20: Bounty
-The Wrath of Darth Maul
4.21: Brothers
4.22: Revenge
-COMVOL 9: The Sith Hunters
-Darth Maul: Death Sentence
(Note: Death Sentence is said to occur in the "3rd year" of the war, likely putting the events of at least season 5 no earlier than 25ABG).
-COMVOL 10: Defenders of the Lost Temple
5.02: A War on Two Fronts
5.03: Front Runners
5.04: The Soft War
5.05: Tipping Points
5.06: The Gathering
5.07: A Test of Strength
5.08: Bound for Rescue
5.09: A Necessary Bond
5.10: Secret Weapons
5.11: A Sunny Day in the Void
5.12: Missing in Action
5.13: Point of No Return
5.01: Revival
5.14: Eminence
5.15: Shades of Reason
5.16: The Lawless
5.17: Sabatoge
5.18: The Jedi Who Knew Too Much
5.19: To Catch a Jedi
5.20: The Wrong Jedi
Bonus.01 - An Old Friend
Bonus.02 - The Rise of Clovis
Bonus.03 - Crisis at the Heart (I suspect we'll see these with the upcoming material, though their timeline placement will remain ambiguous, I will assume the plan was to put them later since Ashoka does NOT appear in this arc.)

(Old EU Material with only Approximate order/placement during TCW time period)
Clone Wars: Volume II: Episode 22 (likely spread throughout TCW)
Republic Commando: The Chaykin Cluster (Campaign 2; Lucasarts home video game)
Republic Commando: Triple Zero(Del Rey)
Star Wars #24: Silent Drifting(flashback)(Marvel: reprinted by Dark Horse in A Long Time Ago...Volume 2: Dark Encounters)
Republic Commando: True Colors
Visionaries: Deep Forest(Dark Horse)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 15:2:29 Edition(Insider #74)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 15:3:02(Insider #75) (Both must occur before Farr's death, so likely earlier than their original placement. Probably late 21BBY.)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch Year's Start Fete Day Edition (Insider #72) (clearly starts in 20BBY)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 15:01:03(Insider #72)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 15:01:13(Insider #73)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 15:01:15 Edition(Insider #73)
Changing Seasons (Wizards of the Coast)
Part I: Guardian of the People (Insider #76: Hyperspace)
Part II: People of the Guardian (Insider #77; Hyperspace)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 15:2:22 (Insider #74)
CIS Shadowfeed Dispatch 15:3:21 Edition(Insider #76)
Republic Holonet News Core Edition 15:3:29(Insider #76)
Yoda: Dark Rendezvous(Del Rey) (Probably early S3, before the Nightsisters arc.)
Medstar I: Battle Surgeons(Del Rey)
Medstar: Intermezzo(Insider #83; IDG Entertainment; Hyperspace)
Medstar II: Jedi Healer(Del Rey) (I+II are likely before Season 4)
Secrets of the Jedi(Part Two: chapters 21 to 33) (Scholastic)
Routine Valor (Dark Horse: Free Comic Book Day) (Sometime before S5 droid arc.)


Month 31-35 ABG
Future TCW "Bonus Material" (Likely to be spread through the final months of the war, if not shortly after s5. At least one arc aside from Clovis confirmed, possibly 2.)
Republic #72–73: Trackdown
Clone Wars Adventures Volume 6: The Drop (Dark Horse)
Visionaries: The Artist of Naboo(Dark Horse)
Boba Fett (Scholastic)
#5: A New Threat
#6: PursuitFree Comic Book Day (2005)
Clone Wars Adventures Volume 5(Dark Horse)
What Goes Up...
Heroes on Both Sides
Visionaries (Dark Horse)
Wat Tambor and Quest for the Sacred Eye of the Albino Cyclops
Sithisis
Republic Commando: Kashyyyk (Mission 3) (Lucasarts home video game)
Clone Wars Adventures Volume 6: To the Vanishing Point(Dark Horse)
Evasive Action: Reversal of Fortune
Republic#74–77: Siege of Saleucami(Dark Horse: collected in Clone Wars Volume 8: The Last Siege, The Final Truth)
Clone Wars Volume II - Chapters 23-25
Labyrinth of Evil (Del Rey)

*Obsession is perhaps the single toughest issue to tackle in the entire new timeline, due to it being the original ending story for both Ventress and Adi Gallia, both of whom have seemingly had their fates changed by TCW. Officially, Chee said that it is not Adi's final canon death nor the canon end of Ventress' story. After debating what to do about this story for 3 years, I have stumbled upon what I believe to be the best possible solution. Obsession occurs between seasons 3 and 4, after Ventress leaves Dooku, but before she begins bounty hunting. Dooku secretly recaptures her and brainwashes her. Anakin assumed her dead because of the chaos in their last fight in Witches of the Mist. Adi is wounded by Grievous, but survives this fight. After faking her death, Ventress escapes and eventually returns to the Nightsisters. Because she never works with Dooku again after Obsession, the original intent of the story (her escape from the war, and from Dooku) is preserved, while the story can still happen before Adi dies. This also leaves open the possibility that she may yet die in the upcoming TCW "bonus content".

**Originally, I was going to have Boba Fett books 2-3 occur before TCW, but it turns out there is a source which claims Boba's escape from Bespin is roughly the same time as the TCW film. As a result, I am moving his escape ahead while keeping the rest of the book 2's events earlier. Book 3 now occurs shortly before the events of the first Boba arc. Putting aside their differences, Boba Fett decided to work together with Aura Sing after book #3, sometime after recovering Slave I, leading to the first Boba Fett s2 arc. The helmet that was destroyed in this arc was one of many. He remains in prison for quite some until the Rako Hardeen Arc. Shortly after escaping, he resumes his hunt for Jabba the Hutt. He becomes a full time bounty hunter by the time we get to the s4 finale arc. Books 5-6 can occur in 19BBY as they were originally intended, sometime after the events of Season 5. As long as the bonus content does not explicitly show how Fett got his green armor, the last 2 books can remain intact.

 

Have the TCW materials released since 2008, from the film on down, referenced much of the material from AOTC to Labyrinth of Evil that was chronicled in the original Clone Wars timeline?

 

Sorry if this has been mentioned, but did the fight between the Mon Calamari and the Quarren in Season 4 ever get reconciled with the one from the first Clone Wars animated series?

 

Not really. Like the Kamino battles, we just have to presume they're unrelated conflicts.

 

Since Quinlan Vos seems to be once again serving the Republic, Republic 71 needs to take place before the episode in which he hunts down Ziro.
Although that creates some problems regarding Asajj Ventress' duel with Anakin. That means Anakin only got his scar after The Hunt for Ziro.

Another possibility is we let the TCW episode take place far when Vos was still serving the Republic and had not yet become a double agent.
However, that creates even more problems.

 

Dreadnaughts of Rendili has pretty much been assumed to take place before much of TCW's material for a long time. It works perfectly fine, because Vos joins the Republic again after this issue in the original timeline, perfectly explaining his appearance during the TCW period (even if he still has attachments to Dooku late in the war). The Wook ordered these stories this way with good reason.

 

Also just made a very slight tweak on my timeline in lit. Needed to move Boba Fett book 4 back to before his first arc since Slave I and Durge both appear in it. An easy fix and something I overlooked. No reason he can't recruit Sing after meeting Jabba.

 

I think the simplest answer for the new Disney series and the EU would be for a major retcon in order to accept it all with no contradictions. In the new Star Trek movies, J.J.Abrams created an alternative timeline with time travel, allowing him freedom to create a new story taking place the same time as the the original series, without contradicting anything. Maybe he will do something similar for Star Wars? That way we can still enjoy the EU without it contradicting the new material. Simply, it would be an alternative timeline, and a win-win for everyone. Maybe if not in the movies, it could be presented in a future book.
What do you all think?

 

The problem with this is that while your proposal makes some sense, many EU fans would not like this idea of an alternate universe either. Reason being that the Expanded Universe was marketed as a means of expanding upon the many stories and characters in the films in a single comprehensive, coherent continuity spanning thousands and thousands of years, separated into multiple distinct time periods.

I liken the entire Star Wars universe to an iceberg; you have the six films (and upcoming ST) along with TCW (arguable, but as GL had direct involvement I will include it here) as the tip of the iceberg, and the rest of the iceberg, submerged below the surface, is composed of the novels, comics, videogames, and other animation (microseries, Holiday Special, Ewoks, and Droids). As you can imagine, if the tip of the iceberg is comprised of G-canon and T-canon, the rest of it is C-canon, which makes up the vast majority of the SW universe since it has been so expansive and still growing strong for the past three decades. Imagine if they decided it best to separate the EU from the rest of the films as a sort of alternate reality, that would be like breaking up the iceberg. The surface would only be sheets of ice separated from a greater whole, and we start to wonder whether all that background information on the film characters not shown or mentioned onscreen (basically the majority of the info in the Wook) is any longer relevant to the story at hand. Running a completely new and separate EU will only complicate matters and can potentially alienate fans of the current EU.

I know this analogy might not be the best, but my point is that it isn't so clear cut and that you can't really assume that it is a win-win situation, at least not for the die-hard fans who engross themselves in the EU's vast library of stories. While I personally wouldn't be put-off by the idea of an alternate universe, as it wouldn't ruin my enjoyment of the present, existing EU, I can understand why others would object to the very idea.

 

I wish it could be worked out, but if I went through ALL of it again, I'd be too stumped as to why General Greivous had to kill Adi Gallia twice. Haha

 

If you watch it, it's canon. If you read it, it's non-canon.

Bite that.

 

That's debatable. Looking at the franchises as a whole as well as cultural impact, I'd say Star Wars is bigger, IMO.