main
side
curve
  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

PT The "What-If?" Depository - ALL conceptual/hypothetical conversation goes here

Discussion in 'Prequel Trilogy' started by SithStarSlayer, Feb 27, 2013.

  1. Sitara

    Sitara Jedi Grand Master star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 8, 2001
    While I agree Sidious would most likely wipe the floor with Kenobi, I do think people severely underestimate Jedi MASTER Obi Wan.

    Look how he dealt with the Magnaguard and Grievous. Look at his fight with Maul. Also recall how easily Obi Wan absorbed Tyrannu's lightning.

    I do believe Sidious's overconfidence might have ended up being his weakness. Might, is the key word here.

    Yoda OTOH would have utterly crushed Anakin. No question there at all.
     
  2. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    I'm neutral about this.
     
  3. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2003
    If young Anakin gets in, then I'm fine with that.
     
  4. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2003
    My Vader crushed Yoda in Soul Calibur. Once.
     
  5. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    -The Magnaguards are droids...if any Jedi had trouble dealing with them, let alone a Jedi Master I would be extremely disappointed.

    -It pretty much took everything Obi-Wan had to finish Greivous, and he only survived because of luckily being near a dropped blaster.

    -It seems that lightsabers absorb Force lightning, and Dooku also seemed to be toying with him at that point. Not to mention Dooku dispatches Obi-Wan very easily.

    I think Obi-Wan is a great Jedi but the examples you used there are pretty weak.
     
  6. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    Jake Lloyd? :p
     
  7. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    They were supposed to be specialist, anti-Jedi droids, "worse than droidekas" for a Jedi to face, in the novel.
     
    -Jedi Joe- and Jedi Merkurian like this.
  8. Sitara

    Sitara Jedi Grand Master star 3

    Registered:
    Oct 8, 2001
    -Droidekas are droids as well. All Jedi had trouble dealing with them. In fact, we did not see any Jedi, Master, Knight or Padawan destroy a droideka using their lightsabers and the Force.

    -Obi Wan was crushing Grievous easily. He was even enjoying it. He really didn't need to get into a saber fight at all, he could have force pushed him from the get go. I guess he wanted to humiliate Grievous a bit and show him why only Jedi and Sith use Lightsabers. But then, Obi Wan DROPPED his lightsaber. That is why he had problems later.

    -Obi Wan used the Force to channel the lightning into the Lightsaber. And yes, Dooku dispatched him rather easily. A pity, but then again, we never see Sidious fight with Dooku. Also, Dooku held off Yoda quite well. (but yes, he would have died eventually had he not run)
     
    -Jedi Joe- and Chewbacca89 like this.
  9. Jedi Gunny

    Jedi Gunny Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    May 20, 2008
    Obi-Wan would have been kept alive due to the fact that he was a main character.

    Yoda would have been alive because he was a main character.

    You get the point. :p
     
    Sitara and benknobi1 like this.
  10. Rachel Gentry

    Rachel Gentry Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    May 9, 2013
    Okay, so after Dooku resigned from the Jedi Order and turned to the dark side, Sifo-Dyas requested the Kaminoans to create a clone army for the Republic so that he could prepare for anything Dooku might have up his sleeve..
    So when Sidious and Dooku learned of his plan to create the army, Dooku had to kill him as part of his final "test"...
    and it wasn't until then that Dooku gained control of the Clone Project.

    And it is to my understanding that the Clone Army had to obey orders without question...

    MY question is, who wrote the Contingency Orders for the Clone Army?
    There were 150 Orders.
    And we all know what Order 66 stated...
    Had that been the only Order, I could believe that Sidious or Dooku wrote them...

    But what about Order 65?
    Order 65: "In the event of either a majority in the Senate declaring the Supreme Commander(Chancellor) to be unfit to issue orders, or the Security Council declaring him or her to be unfit to issue orders, and an authenticated order being received by the GAR, Commanders shall be authorized to detain the Supreme Commander, with lethal force if necessary, and command of the GAR shall fall to the acting Chancellor until a successor is appointed or alternative authority identified as outlined in Section 6."

    Having an Order like that available... That makes me think that Sidious didn't write them.
    Why would he write an Order for his own detainment/execution?

    My friend suggested that maybe the Orders were written when the senate was founded...

    But that wouldn't make any sense because,
    1) The Orders were ONLY for the Clone Army.
    2) By the time they even knew there WAS a Clone Army, there's no way they could have written them all in that amount of time.

    The Jedi probably didn't know about the Orders...
    Had they known, everything could have been avoided.
    I mean, they were suspicious of Palpatine for a while, and when Anakin told Windu about Palpatine being the Sith Lord, they could have executed Order 65.
    But they didn't. They went to arrest him by themselves.
    And by doing THAT, that gave Palpatine the right to excute Order 66...

    They couldn't have known about the Orders...

    So...
    Who else could have written the Orders?
     
  11. Master Jedi Macen Arren

    Master Jedi Macen Arren Jedi Master star 2

    Registered:
    Apr 16, 2013
    They where probably written by very high up members of the senate and the chancellors' office (purely guess work though). Sidious may have come up with most of them (Order 66) for sure, Order 65 as well (Just to draw attention away from 66 in case the Jedi got suspicious). As for the Jedi choosing to arrest him themselves and not call for Order 65, Maybe they didn't know the orders in the first place?. As I said before orders especially contingency one's are normally a need to know basis that only the very top guys know about. Plus if you look at the wording of Order 65 it makes it clear that a vote is needed to implement the order. Don't forget that a) Most senators wouldn't know what a Sith was, and B) The security council was also under the control of Sidious, and again most of them wouldn't know what a Sith was.
     
    Lady_Misty likes this.
  12. Rachel Gentry

    Rachel Gentry Jedi Youngling

    Registered:
    May 9, 2013
    Maybe you're right..
    But if the Jedi didn't know the Orders in the first place, why would he have to make an Order purely to draw attention away from 66?
    He did a pretty great job keeping them all a secret.

    And why would the senate agree to make Orders involving something they know very little about?
    I guess they would just trust in whatever Palpatine said..
    That doesn't seem like a very good, efficient way to make decisions.
     
    GGrievous likes this.
  13. Lady_Misty

    Lady_Misty Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Mar 21, 2007
    The Orders had to be known to some extent because Mace almost panics when Anakin says that Palpatine is the Sith Lord that they have been looking for.
     
  14. Darth Dominikkus

    Darth Dominikkus Jedi Knight star 3

    Registered:
    Apr 5, 2013
    I think the orders were established by the cloners and they had input from the council. I mean, I have no clue to be honest, but with an order like Order 65 that would trow the Chancellor out of power had to have some type of Jedi involvement seeing as they rarely trusted him or his power.
     
  15. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Shelf of Shame Host star 9 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    What were the other order? I've already seen the Robot Chicken scene.
     
  16. SithStarSlayer

    SithStarSlayer Manager Emeritus star 6 VIP - Former Mod/RSA

    Registered:
    Oct 23, 2003
    GGrievous likes this.
  17. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Droidekas have shields that protect them from direct attacks. Magnaguards are droids programmed to melee fight.
     
  18. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Mace Windu was a main character too.
     
  19. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    Where does it say that.
     
  20. Jedi Gunny

    Jedi Gunny Chosen One star 9

    Registered:
    May 20, 2008
    I meant more that they show up in the OT. ;)
     
    Sitara likes this.
  21. The Supreme Chancellor

    The Supreme Chancellor Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Sep 4, 2012
    lol true, by that fact alone they would both have to survive.
     
  22. DRush76

    DRush76 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Jan 25, 2008

    Obi-Wan would have been a dead duck. The guy had faced Dooku on two separate occasions and was defeated each time. As for Anakin, it's possible he would have faced defeat in a duel with Yoda, considering his emotional state at the time. If he had fought Yoda with controlled anger, the Jedi Master might have faced a more formidable foe.
     
    kainee likes this.
  23. GGrievous

    GGrievous Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2005
    A Jake Lloyd Force ghost smiles at Luke.
     
  24. Robimus

    Robimus Jedi Grand Master star 5

    Registered:
    Jul 6, 2007
    They missed Ahsoka.

    Or maybe it is because she isn't dead...............[face_plain]
     
    SithStarSlayer likes this.
  25. Iron_lord

    Iron_lord Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Sep 2, 2012
    Obi-Wan and Anakin's first reaction on seeing them, in the RoTS book:

    "You know what Master Yoda says: Patience you must have until the mud settles and the water becomes clear. So let's wait."

    Obi-Wan looked skeptical. "Wait."

    "For the security patrol. A couple of droids will be along in a moment or two; they'll have to drop the ray shield to take us into custody."

    "And then?"

    Anakin shrugged cheerfully. "And then we'll wipe them out."

    "Brilliant as usual," Obi-Wan said dryly. "What if they turn out to be destroyer droids? Or something worse?"

    "Oh, come on, Master. Worse than destroyers? Besides, security patrols are always those skinny useless little battle droids."

    At that moment, four of those skinny useless battle droids came marching toward them, one along each corridor, clanking along with blaster rifles leveled. One of them triggered one of its preprogrammed security commands: "Hand over your weapons!" The other three chimed in with enthusiastic barks of "Roger, roger!"and a round of spastic head-bobbing. "See?" Anakin said. "No problem."

    Before Obi-Wan could reply, concealed doors in the corridor walls zipped suddenly aside. Through them rolled the massive bronzium wheels of destroyer droids, two into each corridor. The eight destroyers unrolled themselves behind the battle droids, haloed by sparkling energy shields, twin blaster cannons targeting the two Jedi's chests.

    Obi-Wan sighed. "You were saying?"

    "Okay, fine. It's the dark side. Or something." Anakin rolled his eyes. "I guess you're off the hook for the ray shield trap." Through those same doorways marched sixteen super battle droids to back up the destroyers, their arm cannons raised to fire over the destroyers' shields.

    Behind the super battle droids came two droids of a type Anakin had never seen. He had an idea what they were, though. And he was not happy about it.

    Obi-Wan scowled at them as they approached. "You're the expert, Anakin. What are those things?"

    "Remember what you were saying about worse than destroyers?" Anakin said grimly. "I think we're looking at them."

    They walked side by side, their gait easy and straightforward, almost as smooth as a human's. In fact, they could have been human—humans who were two meters tall and made out of metal. They wore long swirling cloaks that had once been white, but now were stained with smoke and what Anakin strongly suspected was blood. They walked with the cloaks thrown back over one shoulder, to clear their left arms, where they held some unfamiliar staff-like weapon about two meters long—something like the force-pike of a Senate Guard, but shorter, and with an odd-looking discharge blade at each end.

    They walked like they were made to fight, and they had clearly seen some battle. The chest plate of one bore a round shallow crater surrounded by a corona of scorch, a direct blaster hit that hadn't come close to penetrating; the other bore a scar from its cranial dome down through one dead photoreceptor—a scar that looked like it might have come from a lightsaber. This droid looked like it had fought a Jedi, and survived. The Jedi, he guessed, hadn't.
     
    kainee likes this.