PT The "What-If?" Depository - ALL conceptual/hypothetical conversation goes here

I'd like to point out this key on your keyboard:

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I like that explanation. Thinking about hundreds of potential lives lost really diminishes Obi-Wan's joke otherwise.

The Clone Wars cartoon was actually pretty brutal when it showed Separatist war machines attacking civilians on Coruscant. You got a better idea of the kind of war that was being fought (and it showed that the Republic wasn't always in control of the situation).

 

17.4

 

Ever wonder why we don't see Elan Sleazebaggano in the OT? Yeah. That.

 

How would the Saga be affected, if Anakin would had been gay?

 

We'd need some explanation for the RoTJ novel's mention of Anakin's wife- the fact that Luke and Leia were conceived in marriage, not a one-off relationship.

Still, it would lend an extra frisson to Obi-Wan's "Luke, I don't want to lose you to the Emperor the way I lost Vader."

 

Fabulous fashion accessories for the Chosen One!

 

^^ Plus, why waste their time looking for relatives? There's a second Sith revealed and an entire battle is taking place, marking the beginning of years and years of war. A child is of no worry.

 

Fun thread idea to think about.

Yoda has too much heart. All the jedi were like his children. Even though I'm sure he knew Anakin had skewered and gutted a lot of the younglings at the temple.
I'm imagining he would have just force pulled the lightsaber from Anakin's hands with the force (like he did to Ventress' twin sabers. Sidious easily force puppeting Darth Maul around on Mandalor) and then reluctantly tossed Anakin into the lava to become the same old limbless Vader.

In fact I wish Anakin had fallen into the lava in Ep.III. It would have been more horrific but congruous. . Just looked too easy for Anakin to let Obi-Won slice off his legs in the flip. A force user should be able to block with his saber even in a flip. It just so stupid he couldn't just have hopped onto the "shore". Or at least force pushed Obi-Won backward before leaping onto the ground.

That said, sure, Anakin would could have put more of a fight to Yoda if he had like 10 more years of training/experience in the force under Sidious/or not. and with his 3 limbs still intact.

Obi-won vs. Sidious? would have been over right away, just like Dooku force chocked-lifted him in mid-air then slung him. (Obi-wan failed his resistance roll badly like under KOTOR rules)

And to summarize, the force also works in many other mysterious ways. At the time of Ep. III, clearly the Force was on the dark side's favor. Which leads me to hypothesize Bane's rule of two was also designed not just to cut down the anarchy of betraying Sith, but also to "build up" and consolidate dark side imbalance of the Force for future years.(meaning with so much light side force users outweighing the dual Sith, eventually the Force would tip over to the dark side in one sudden turn)

Kind of agree Obi-wan was meant to join the voice in his appointed time on the Death Star facing Vader to leave it to Luke. All his luck in the past would lead up to that event in a karmic way.

And a lot of things escape Yoda. Him not being able to sense through Palaptine's darkside cloud. Always falling to traps like with Dooku's falling column, or Sidious sudden lightning. Yoda is neither a hunter or a dominator, more of a teacher not to mention his size. Anakin would probably have a decent chance of escaping Yoda if he realized he was outmatched and tried to retreat.

 

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i prefer these lines they should have been in the film

 

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i prefer these lines they should have been in the film

 

The book does have good lines. And a few extra scenes, compared to the movie.

 

How about this for a wild idea?
Without any of Anakin's wild and ridiculous emotions during the Mustufar duel, the combined wisdom of Padme and Yoda serves to douse his rage, and they save him from the Dark Side, 20 some odd years 'early. Meanwhile, Obi-Wan is facing the Sith Master, the one who was indirectly responsible for his beloved Master dying, unleashing a hellish 3 year war on the galaxy, and destroying his brother. Yes folks, Obi-Wan, who used the Dark Side briefly to beat Maul, falls headlong into it against Sidious.

The OT is now Sidious/Obi vs Yoda/Anakin.

 

Mind blown.

 

The novelization of ROTS is really brilliant, though, it shows Yoda having the epiphany of all epiphanies in his duel with Sidious, which would've never happened if he'd gone up against Anakin. I think that whole section of Yoda realizing where he'd absolutely screwed up... the entire Order, the entire PT era, leads to dispersing the twins in families, and enviroments of love that never would've been accepted by the old order (see Anakin in TPM).

The scenes on Dagobah in ESB are Yoda toying/testing Luke, he had zero intention of NOT training Luke. I'm of the opinion Yoda was hoping love, Luke's love for his father, could save Anakin, since it was love that doomed him.

 

What epiphany did he have. I haven't read that novel yet.

 

There came a turning point in the clash of the light against the dark.
It did not come from a flash of lightning or slash of energy blade,
though there were these in plenty; it did not come from a flying kick or a
surgically precise punch, though these were traded, too.
It came as the battle shifted from the holding office to the great
Chancellor's Podium; it came as the hydraulic lift beneath the Podium
raised
it on its tower of durasteel a hundred meters and more, so that it became a
laserpoint of battle flaring at the focus of the vast emptiness of the
Senate Arena; it came as the Force and the podium's controls ripped
delegation pods free of the curving walls and made of them hammers,
battering rams, catapult stones crashing and crushing against each other
in
a rolling thunder-roar that echoed the Senate's cheers for the galaxy's new
Emperor.
It came when the avatar of light resolved into the lineage of the Jedi;
when the lineage of the Jedi refined into one single Jedi.
It came when Yoda found himself alone against the dark.
In that lightning-speared tornado of feet and fists and blades and
bashing machines, his vision finally pierced the darkness that had clouded
the Force.
Finally, he saw the truth.
This truth: that he, the avatar of light, Supreme Master of the Jedi
Order, the fiercest, most implacable, most devastatingly powerful foe the
darkness had ever known . . .
justdidn'thave
it.
He'd never had it. He had lost before he started.
He had lost before he was born.
The Sith had changed. The Sith had grown, had adapted, had invested a
thousand years' intensive study into every aspect of not only the Force but
Jedi lore itself, in preparation for exactly this day. The Sith had remade
themselves.
They had become new.
While the Jedi-
The Jedi had spent that same millennium training to refight the last
war.
The new Sith could not be destroyed with a lightsaber; they could not
be burned away by any torch of the Force. The brighter his light, the darker
their shadow. How could one win a war against the dark, when war itself
had
become the dark's own weapon?
He knew, at that instant, that this insight held the hope of the
galaxy. But if he fell here, that hope would die with him. Hmmm, Yoda
thought. A problem this is . . .

~Matthew Stover, "Revenge of the Sith" novelization

 

Back to the OP, "What if Yoda confronted Anakin and Obi-Wan confronted Palpatine?"

Clearly, everyone agrees that Obi-Wan dies against Sidious, and as Yoda said, very painfully. After all, Sidious, Dooku, Mace, and Yoda are the most powerful beings in the galaxy (here's some cool looking pics I found of them ):









These four are the strongest in the galaxy
Except for one being: the Chosen One. As I said in the other thread about the most powerful Jedi/Sith: Anakin is the only one who can surpass these four. His victory over Dooku, where he opened himself to the Dark Side, showed that he had finally reached a level that only he could, of unrivaled power. Fighting in the Clone Wars continuously strengthened Anakin, allowing him to fulfill his potential. When he finally turns to the Dark Side, he had reached a point where he was undeniably the most powerful being alive.

The ROTS book continuously points out just how powerful Anakin has become. Anakin kills Dooku; Mace acknowledges Anakin to be the strongest Jedi alive; after turning to the Dark Side, Anakin evens begin planning to kill Darth Sidious.

But it's at DRush76 said, with Obi-Wan, Anakin's emotions, particularly his overconfidence, got the best with him. Probably as a result of knowing how powerful he was and how easily he could kill Obi-Wan, Anakin's overconfidence blinded him, making him execute a foolish move that cost him the duel and all his power. But what also allowed Obi-Wan to survive that long was their familiarity with each other's moves, having fought together for so long. Without this, Obi-Wan would have been dead a short while into the duel.

Anakin would have killed Yoda. I think that Anakin would have been thrilled at the chance of killing the most respected Jedi alive, and this thrill would have allowed him to focus on just killing Yoda and reveling in his unrivaled power. Unlike Obi-Wan, Yoda does not have a long standing history or familiarity with Anakin; the duel would have gone just like Anakin vs Dooku, where Yoda slowly begins to realize just how powerful the boy has become. Yoda would eventually begin to weaken, but Anakin would just continue to become stronger and stronger until he decided to end it and kill the Jedi Master.

We already saw how Anakin had surpassed Dooku,

which means that he had also surpassed Yoda, Mace, and Sidious, reaching a level which only he can stand on. Although, the movie did not get to show us Anakin killing the other three, the ROTS video game did to show what would have happened if Anakin fought Mace Windu and Darth Sidious:



Anakin killing Mace Windu.



Anakin killing Darth Sidious(which is what he would shortly set out to do.)

It's too bad that we never got to see just how powerful he had become because he only held that power for such a short time. But by the time of ROTS, Anakin had become the most powerful being alive.

 

Sidious does say during his duel with Yoda that "Darth Vader will become more powerful than both of us."

 

Was Nute Gunray a Perv?


Well, I came across this YouTube Video titled "Nute Gunray is a Perv" that gave an, um, interesting take, on Gunray:



Gunray, you sly dog, you...

What do you guys make out of it? Did we overlook a highly important detail about Gunray?

 

That's the point. Anakin had become so angry, so arrogant in his abilities that he let himself be compromised. He thought that he could jump over Obi-wan and not be hit by him, because of his abilities and because Obi-wan kept hesitating to kill him. He acted foolishly and paid the price for it. That's why he says that he is no longer the learner when next they meet.

 

Always laughed at that little gesture as a kid.

Not sure why the uploader thought it was "pervy," Gunray's just enjoying the show (seeing one of his old adversaries being executed).

Also, to go against that idea, I think it was in the Phantom Menace where it's mentioned that Nute heard that Amidala was beautiful by human standards, but didn't quite feel the same because of the species difference.

 

I'm just not certain how long that would have taken. I doubt it would have fit the timeframe permitted by the ROTS alternate ending.

 

Mind my saying that I feel a bit uncomfortable, if not offended by the gay jokes? You know, not all of us are like that <_<