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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

ST New Canon Material (novels, TV shows, comics, games) and TFA

Discussion in 'Sequel Trilogy' started by EHT, Feb 24, 2014.

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  1. DANNASUK

    DANNASUK Force Ghost star 7

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    Nov 1, 2012
    No way will the main antagonist be killed off. Maybe at the end of season two we'll get a "must I do everything myself?" moment from Vader.
     
  2. stellarmagic01

    stellarmagic01 Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Nov 1, 2012

    One thing that has struck me over and over again about Rebels is just how small scale it is. We're always on Lothal... only leaving the system to steal something or rescue somebody. Those people that were mad about this changing the start of the rebellion are missing the point of the series. This is about a rebel cell not the the rebellion as a whole. Kallus is reporting 'a rebel cell' and so forth. I like that.

    Another thing is that as evil as the Imps are depicted, there's still a hint of humanity to them. The whole sequence in the last episode where the stormtrooper and Ezra are fighting, and suddenly the thing pauses...

    The stormtrooper says something along the line of: "Wait a minute, this is about fruit?" almost like he's a bit disgusted with himself for keeping someone from getting food.

    One thing I wished they'd explained a bit more is the apparent nationalization program going on. We see the Imps buying out farmland and destroying the farms of those that aren't willing to sell. Who is getting this land? Are we going to be introduced to some plutocrats later on who are getting it, or what.
     
  3. stellarmagic01

    stellarmagic01 Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 1, 2012

    I wish that the Rebels success would make Palpatine send a little redheaded teen to infiltrate the group and find out why the heck can't the Inquisitor catch this band of misfits - but that's me wanting them to use an EU character. Still a 13 year old Mara Jade would be a weird twist... especially if used as an infiltrator.
     
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  4. DANNASUK

    DANNASUK Force Ghost star 7

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    Nov 1, 2012
    We might get an Emperor's Hand or a Vader apprentice, but I think its safe to assume these will be new characters.
     
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  5. Abadacus

    Abadacus Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    May 4, 2014

    Mara would be a great crush/antagonist for Ezra and friend/rival to Sabine. If they use her to flesh out the post-RotJ period (as I deeply hope they will) it would be a great introduction to her for new fans and add some wonderful depth for those of us who were disappointed by the "hero in all but name" treatment in Zahn's more recent Emperor's Hand era books.
    I'm imagining it now - if handled well, her being presented with a choice between two 'families', and ultimately being too damaged and untrusting to make the right choice could make for a very frustrating yet sympathetic villain indeed.
     
  6. stellarmagic01

    stellarmagic01 Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 1, 2012
    The funniest bit is there's a bit of a convention for cartoons with young adults fighting adults, that the adults are incompetent... You throw in Mara Jade as a character that's even younger then Ezra and you can play the reverse part of that angle (younger characters are more competent) for hilarious results. Other things they could do would be for Jade to be a part of the crew for a season as an infiltrator (under another name of course) where essentially Kanan ends up teaching someone who is going to be an agent for his own destruction or capture.


    Then you have the whole reveal... probably with a scene that echoes of The Empire Strike's Back where a door hisses open and there's Vader or the Inquisitor waiting for them, with stormtroopers and the whole shebang.
     
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  7. Dra---

    Dra--- Force Ghost star 6

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    Dec 30, 2012
    Watched E2 Fighter Flight last night, and I know some thought this the weakest episode, but that's only if you think each episode must advance the external plot (Empire investigating the Rebels; Jedi training; taking down the Empire). Instead, this episode focused on character (internal plot), specifically the relationship between Ezra and Zeb, but it even began to show how the other characters spend their time when they're not rebelling, which reminded me of what I loved about X-Men, how they took the time to provide down time and family connections. For example, Sabine paints when she has down time. Hera and Kanan chill out together, playing Dejarik.

    But what I really enjoyed in this episode the most was the whole TIE fighter sequence. That was just fun and tense at times, and I think any TIE fans must have enjoyed the extra time devoted to it.

    I also have to agree that the portrayal of the Imperials as space Nazis is important. It's never a good idea, imo, to portray totalitarians in a grey space -- unless, of course, you're showing that non-totalitarians are being forced to serve. But totalitarians themselves should never be treated fairly. What's the point of that, unless you want to suggest totalitarianism itself is valid in some way as a humanism?

    Rise of the Old Masters -- great title. I can't wait to see what the reference is to -- just Luminara, or more?
     
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  8. Abadacus

    Abadacus Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    May 4, 2014

    I must say I disagree. As awful as totalitarianism in any form surely is, one must be wary of dehumanizing any side in a conflict. No matter how black and white the top-level ideological struggle, the people fighting it are, well... people. I think showing how ordinary, otherwise good people can end up as ardent supporters of monstrous regimes goes a lot further towards fighting totalitarian ideology than oversimplifying things to "good guys" vs "bad guys" all the way down.
     
  9. Dra---

    Dra--- Force Ghost star 6

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    Dec 30, 2012
    I think that's what I was referring to when I said above "unless, of course, you're showing that non-totalitarians are being forced to serve."

    I said pretty clearly real totalitarians should never be portrayed in a grey space. I agree some of them have been produced by ideology, and I also don't mind showing that -- but that's one of the aspects I was referring to as "forced to serve."

    Still, I think we have to maintain some culpability when it comes to social production. For example, a teenager in Nazi Germany would have had their minds shaped quite a bit by Nazi ideology. However, there are always forms of resistance that can provide one ideological options. Ultimately, I think most people have a choice at some point. Ezra, for example, is able to resist Imperial ideology rather than wanting to join in -- why?
     
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  10. themuzikman

    themuzikman Jedi Knight star 2

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    Dec 20, 2013

    Haha good point, I forgot. Except with R2 it was implied that he was cussing, with Chopper you can actually hear what he's saying... It literally just sounds like some guy is going "**** **** ****" (just repeating the f word, for those who can't read the stars).
     
  11. ifleninwasawizard

    ifleninwasawizard Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 2, 2014
    [​IMG]
     
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  12. Force Smuggler

    Force Smuggler Force Ghost star 7

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    Sep 2, 2012
    I am looking forward to seeing the whole season all in a row with no weekly breaks.
    I like the small scaleness of the season as well. Give the Rebels crew time to shine and gel. Go all out later on.
     
  13. Jcuk

    Jcuk Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Mar 16, 2013
    Not up to date with this thread so apologies. But I'd just like to say I'm literally ****in' bursting with excitement at seeing the extra scene with a JEJ voiced Vader in the revised Rebels pilot. Cannot wait! :)
     
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  14. Dra---

    Dra--- Force Ghost star 6

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    Dec 30, 2012
    I'm open to the inclusion of Mara Jade -- not pro or against. Slightly leaning against. I think it's interesting that stellarmagic01 describes her as "a little redheaded teen" infiltrator. On the one hand, that does help explain the generic quality of her appearance, as I've mentioned elsewhere, and justifies it based on her ability to blend in. Still, that this is the first way SM can think of describing her sort of gets to the main point of my problem with her: her red hair is really her most outstanding quality.

    If they were to introduce MJ, I'd be hoping for more work done explaining her personality and motivations other than she's just this way.

    I can see her fitting in on a SW show for kids, however. I'm shocked there's no redhead yet. :D
     
  15. ifleninwasawizard

    ifleninwasawizard Jedi Master star 4

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    Jun 2, 2014
    The small scale is great, but they are also doing a very good job at slowly building towards the future. They give us a bit of Bail in order to show us what's on the horizons. Then the very next episode they give us the smallest scale (and most charming) episode yet. They are doing a great job at balancing the present and the future.
     
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  16. Royale w/ Codeine

    Royale w/ Codeine Jedi Master star 4

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    May 19, 2014
    How old is she compared to Luke? Luke's only 13 or 14 in the present Rebels timeline.
     
  17. stellarmagic01

    stellarmagic01 Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 1, 2012

    In the EU she's two years younger then Luke.
     
  18. Jcuk

    Jcuk Jedi Grand Master star 5

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    Mar 16, 2013
    I must say, I have all fingers, toes, arms and legs crossed we DONT get to see a young Han Solo at some point in Rebels. Please please please..NO.
     
  19. LunarMoth

    LunarMoth Jedi Master star 4

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    Nov 27, 2012
    I'm open to whatever they do, but it kinda urks me that they have this huge canon shift, but they tell us that the now non-canon material is open season for cherry picking and inspiration. To me, this just says that as time goes on, the lines of canon are just going to become blurred again.

    If Mara Jade is non-canon now, she should stay that way IMO.
     
  20. starocean90

    starocean90 Chosen One star 8

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    Feb 19, 2014
  21. TheBBP

    TheBBP Force Ghost star 6

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    Nov 6, 2012
  22. Abadacus

    Abadacus Jedi Grand Master star 4

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    May 4, 2014
    I could describe ANH Luke as a "blond young man" but that hardly means his hair color is his most outstanding quality.

    ??
    Maybe I can help - going by Legends of course; they may change as much or as little as they want if she's used in the new canon. She's been raised since toddlerhood by an abusive psychopath (the Emperor) who's trained her to blend into both aristocratic high society and the underbelly of the galaxy - but also to never feel like she belongs. She's been molded to view others as targets, tools, or threats and nothing more. Like most relationships with abusive parental figures, there's a perverse mixture of fear, loathing, and a desperate desire to please. Her sense of identity has been broken down to view herself as an instrument of the Emperor's will and to believe she could never be anything more. He's given her basic force instruction - enough to be an effective assassin and spy, to hear his orders or feel his wrath from anywhere in the galaxy, but not enough to gain any real independence from him.

    In her main era, post-RotJ, she's been freed from the Emperor's influence by his death, but also scarred by it; the only life she knew is gone forever, and she's smart enough to know that it was hardly spent in the service of a good cause. She makes a living putting her skills to use as a smuggler and agent for Talon Karrde's organization, finally finding a real home and people who trust her (or at least respect her as an equal untrustworthy scoundrel), and she starts to gain a sense of independent identity for the first time. She was never a "true believer" in the New Order, just a tool of it, but she also carries an immense guilt as she never defected of her own free will; some part of her feels she doesn't deserve to be free. She's still cynical and emotionally closed off until a certain Jedi crosses paths with her and starts breaking those walls down (and annoys her to the point of violence in the process), but it still takes many years before she can come to terms with her past and begin believing that she can choose her own future.
    The strength it takes to move on from an abusive childhood is immense, and I identified so much with her character because becoming a hero was such an active struggle for her, not a destiny or an idealistic dream of adventure. Doing the right thing never came naturally or easily, but she found the strength to make the right choice anyways. She's deeply flawed, complicated, and anything but nice - and I love her for it. In many ways her growth is an inverse of Anakin Skywalker's fall.

    In the Rebels era, she'd still be a tool of Palpatine, but too young to be irreversibly set upon that path yet. Kanan and Hera would represent a contrast to the "family" she's known - people who put their trust in her out of faith, and want nothing in return. Maybe in the time before she betrays them she can almost glimpse what it would be like to be a healthy person, with real relationships built on openness and mutual assistance rather than manipulation and punishment - but however cold and merciless her facade, she's still a frightened young girl who's not ready to break away from her abusive father-surrogate. Her shocking but inevitable betrayal of the Spectres could be an incredible and painful dramatic moment, both for her and for her would-be friends, and foreshadow her later success in redefining herself.
    Let's not make this another Mara debate, but I hope that's gone some way to clarify what her fans see in the character. I'm usually against too much angst and negativity in Star Wars, but she managed to speak to me in a way few fictional characters have - it's a cliche to say, but when stories featuring Mara were brand new, her overcoming her past was an inspiration to me when I needed one, and that's the most any fictional character can be to a person.
    The fact that her hair is red is pretty much irrelevant. Rant over.
     
  23. kanan katarn

    kanan katarn Jedi Padawan star 1

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    Oct 4, 2014
    [​IMG]
    Red hair? Hmmm
     
  24. TheBBP

    TheBBP Force Ghost star 6

    Registered:
    Nov 6, 2012

    It's Sabine. Same model number, just painted different. You can even see her name on the box.





    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
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  25. Han Drolo

    Han Drolo Jedi Grand Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 9, 2014
    Ezra's Lightsaber doe...

    Saber-Blaster baby.
     
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