A&A The Official Jason Fry Discussion Thread

You'd have to ask Dan -- I have no idea. Maybe hit him up on Twitter?

 

Thanks anyway.

 

If I had a wish list of minor things to fix, I'd go for a canon identity of Red 2 at the Battle of Endor. You know, the guy who shot down THREE Tie Interceptors with a Y-Wing. I mean, that's equal onscreen kills with Wedge and the guy doesn't even have a name.

Early candidates would include Keyan Farlander or Kyle Katarn.

 

If there's a single thing I'm grateful for from decanonization, it's that it took the wind out of the sails of the inexplicable Kyle Katarn cult...

 

Agreed. I cannot stand Revan fanboys half the time.

 

Actually it didn't. People like him because he's space Chuck Norris.

Or it could be a lot of the game characters are well written, with a lot of thought put into them. But sure, let's ride that, "if I don't like it, it's a Sue" train some more.

 

Chuck NORRIS isn't Chuck Norris at this point...

I actually feel about Chuck Norris the same way I feel about Kyle Katarn: a host of awesome things are said about the man, but when I look at the actual man, my impression is "meh..."

"Kyle Katarn once shot down a TIE fighter just by pointing at it and saying 'BANG...'" (scoffs)

 

Are you similarly blasé about Paul Bunyan and Pecos Bill?

 

Oh, Paul Bunyan, don't get me STARTED on Bunyan...

 

Hey, Mr. Fry,

I had a chance to read the Rebel Dossier book you wrote for Rogue One. I liked it overall. For a shorter book, I thought a nice job of having useful reference information for the movie, but still keeping the feel that you were reading old Rebel files and getting some new tidbits (which is part of the fun of "in-universe" reference books). I really liked the reports on Krennic and Tarkin, the Voren Na'al report (were you the first guy to bring him back into canon?), and the two letters debating where Jyn Erso should've been involved in the mission.

I did have a couple of questions:

- Since the book consolidates a lot of info from other sources (Catalyst, the Rogue One novelization, etc.), I was curious if there were any "facts," essays, ideas, etc. that you invented specifically for the Dossier?

- On Jyn Erso's rap sheet, forgery was listed twice. Was there a reason for that?

- On the pages concerning Tarkin, there's a report where the Rebel officer expresses concern over the possibility that Tarkin might get drunk with power and betray the Empire. Was that intended to be a nod to the deleted Tarkin bio from you Essential Guide to Warfare book, which had him hoping to use the Death Star to conquer the Empire?

Overall, good book, can't wait for your next Star Wars project (and I still need to make time to find and read those Jupiter Pirates books of your's).

 

Howdy. Call me Jason. Or Jace. Or most anything.

-- Re stuff invented, a thing to note is that Catalyst, the novelization, the Visual Dictionary and the Rebel Dossier were all written in parallel. So SG and the authors were passing ideas back and forth during that process, to the point that it can be hard to recall where they originated. The most important thing is that it all feels "of a piece" to readers, which I think it does.

That said, some things I do recall as being unique to RORD: Cassian's path to Kafrane, some of Jyn's crimes, Arhul Nemo, some of Jyn's aliases, using Voren and Arhul Hextrophon, Cassian's secondary mission objectives, how the Alliance confirmed Galen's background, the fate of the B'ankora, bits of Bodhi's background, Terrabe Sector, bits about Jedha pilgrims and the Guardians' interactions with them, the rebel debate about planet-killing superlasers (and weapons able to fire through hyperspace), guesses about Cluster Prism, the reference to Mirrorbright, the Death Star recon report. But those are bits -- I think the more important parts are the depiction of the Alliance as weakened by divisions, and Mon Mothma's take on the galactic struggle and the soldiers she oversees. I hope you get a sense of Mothma through the memos that we haven't seen elsewhere.

-- Jyn's double forgery: I guess it really annoyed Cracken? Ha ha. Just a mistake. Didn't notice it until you pointed it out, in fact. Sigh. Every book has an Amish stitch or two, I suppose.

-- I wasn't really thinking about Warfare in writing about Tarkin's ambitions and the dangers they posed -- it's more consistency in how I've seen the character from the beginning. I think that goes beyond declarations of canon to a pretty straightforward interpretation of the original film. It's clear as far back as the photo insert in the ANH novelization that Tarkin wants to be Emperor, and the meeting aboard the Death Star comes very close to being a gathering of coup plotters. I've written about that for Warfare, for the Insider, for the Rebel Dossier, and probably for other things I've forgotten. I think it's critical to understanding Tarkin, and a sometimes obscured subplot in the original trilogy that I just love. So I jump at the chance wherever it fits.

-- Thanks for the questions. Read Jupiter Pirates! Curse of the Iris is the best book I've ever written. You'll like it!

 

"He was quite a man."



"Man! I always thought Revan was a woman."

(Now that's how you mix in RPG elements ;p)

 

Jyn: Forgery, larceny, treason and forgery..
K-2S0: You said forgery twice...
Jyn: I like forgery


So...Jason....if you get an opportunity can you work and manufacturer and ship class into something official for the Hammerhead Corvette??
Maybe a Lantillian ShipWrights, Byblos Drive Yards or Loronar Corp?? I think CEC has just been done to death.

 

Yeah, did a great job showing Mon Mothma's motivations & POV. Plus, you get extra points for having an entry from her aide that appears in Aftermath & Life Debt. I'm drawing a blank on his name at the moment, but you wrote him perfectly and in a manner that clearly evolves to what Chuck Wendig portrayed. Bravo!

--Adm. Nick

 

I'm glad you spoke to that, Jason, because I've long had a question about this scenario that I would rejoice to see you clear up. Also, any chance for you to expound further on the concept, I'm more than happy to provide.

The sole stumbling block I've had regarding the "gathering of coup plotters" concept is the other people at that gathering: I'll grant at the start that the use of the words "comers very close to" can allow a LOT of this to be swept under the rug. But just how many of the other people in that conference room would have been game for a move against Palpatine?

Let's look first at the officers who'd totally have been up for it:

Wilhuff Tarkin: Let's begin by totally embracing your premise and putting Tarkin at the top of the list of up-for-its. The ANH Radio Drama implied a character that needed to be talked around to the idea, and even then it's uncertain if he was ready to take the plunge before events overtook him at Yavin; but Rogue One makes it crystal clear what we're supposed to go do with the Radio Drama, so that entire thought may be out the door. So let's say yes, he was in. But of course the removal of the Radio Drama as a source of info revives the question: in your mind, HOW in was he, and WHEN did he decide he was in? Was it something he had in mind early on, or did he come to it gradually? By himself, or did others have to kinda nudge him?

Darth Vader: You also proposed that Vader would be up for it as a means of eliminating Sidious without his having to get his own hands dirty or put himself at too much risk. I can even envision him subtly maneuvering Tarkin and Motti and the rest for his own reasons. One stroke, done: no more Sidious, and he gets to be the Sith Master. What'll it cost him, Coruscant? I'm sure he couldn't care less about the place. Padme doesn't live there any more, so zero sheevs given. And then he just eliminates Tarkin and the gang and rules his Empire.

Antonio Motti: We sure as sheev know this guy is up for it; GOD, we know he's up for it. He was BORN up for it. But that was something largely sold to us by the Radio Drama, was it not? And we've already discussed that. But really I suppose it can be something you read right in the actor's performance; you can tell by LOOKING at him that he'd be up for it. (Aside: I met Richard LeParmentier in September 2001; the man signed me a picture of himself superimposed over an image of the Death Star; but in addition to writing his signature, he marked with an arrow in silver Sharpie which one of the many little lights on the station was Motti's office. That's just awesome.)

Then there's the officers who'd probably be up for it:

Siward Cass: Way I see it, Colonel/Chief/Whateveritis Cass has been Tarkin's personal lieutenant for years; you yourself, if I remember correctly, set him in that role as early as the Rebels period. If Tarkin's up for it, Cass is likely to go where he goes just out of sheer career inertia. We don't know a heap about this man, but we can assume that much.

Hurst Romodi: You wrote the book on this man your own self, and that's pretty much been moved intact into the new canon (Rogue One doesn't give us a good look at his eardrums, but there's no reason they COULDN'T still be cybernetic implants; we don't get the sense that his eyes are artificial in the film, but there's no reason he couldn't have gotten NORMAL-looking cybernetic eyes). What that narrative describes is a man bound to Tarkin by personal loyalty because Tarkin was personally loyal to HIM. Tarkin's worked with him at a person-to-person level for decades, personally offered him the job as Battle Station Operations chief, and the actor's performance in the film Rogue One certainly illustrates a guy who hops to for Tarkin's sake, so that suggests Romodi would side with Tarkin, if Tarkin made the move.

Now let's discuss the officers we're just unsure about:

Cassio Tagge: I've just never got the sense that this cat would EVER have been up for it. Even if we ignore what Legends has had to say about the guy, the current canon doesn't make him appear any more pro-coup. I can't imagine that Palpatine would have promoted Tagge to grand general after Yavin if he had doubts about his loyalties, and I can't imagine Tagge keeping up a mask Palpatine can't see through.

Moradmin Bast: My understanding was that General/Chief/Notsureatall Bast was Tagge's aide, but that comes from the Michael Reaves novel Death Star, which is Legends now, so that may be toast. What's left is a near blank slate, so maybe Bast COULD be up for it, but we just don't have a sense one way or another.

Trech Molock: We know precisely NOTHING about this character, from Legends or from the current canon. He's a total blank slate. We can imagine ANY possible way he'd jump.

And finally, that leaves one officer who'd probably not be up for it:

Wullf Yularen: The man we got to know on TCW had a stick up his exhaust port, so I can hardly imagine him being on board for a coup - particularly when we're saying that Yularen has spent a bunch of his life as an intelligence officer charged with enforcing loyalty and is a man personally interested in people's loyalties to the Emperor personally. He just might be the only one in the room who might act against Tarkin if he were to go coup-happy - or, as an ISB officer, would even be in a position to do so.

So we've got three definitelys, two maybes, three unsures, and a maybe not.

Therein lies my basic question: can it be a coup plotters' meeting if we're uncertain about the sentiments of about half the guys in the room? They certainly can't plot in the room openly if that's the case, and we don't SEE them plot openly in the scene, but of course we can read between the lines, and we could expect that they themselves can too, communicating via "in-depth language," as it was called in Stalin's Russia.

For that matter, ARE we uncertain about the sentiments of half the guys in the room? Maybe my impressions as listed above are way off! I mean, it's entirely possible you could have access to data we don't have...

I'd love to hear ANY elaborations you may care to make on ANY aspect of the concept, of course - because, my question aside, I really LOVE the idea at its core, and do believe a REALLY interesting story could be fashioned from the idea; but if nothing else, how do YOU see the uncertain people in that room acting if Tarkin and the definitelys should make a move? Do they just go along? Do they oppose it? Do they freak out? Do they jump in with both feet? SO many possibilities come to mind, but to me, authorial intent does count for something.

 

If Vader's in on it, then it doesn't matter how many people oppose Tarkin. They'll be slaughtered.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

It's sort of interesting that over 40 years since ANH, with all of the sometimes-mocked expansion of what are essentially extras, there's still someone in a roomful of Imperial VIPs who's a complete cipher.

 

In the unrevised fourth draft screenplay, Tarkin tells Vader, "This operation will secure my place on the Emperor's council. With the right maneuvering, I could be Emperor."

 

If there is a coup meeting, maybe that is the reason Tagge leaves.

 

Someone was talking about approaching questions the Watsonian way or the Doyleist way -- in-universe vs. out-of-universe. I'd never heard of the concept before and loved it. A lot of what I do is by necessity Watsonian, but the farther it gets from Doyleist the more tangled and less convincing it gets. Another way to put it would be that a convoluted explanation can hold water in terms of continuity but fail to read correctly for a reasonably smart viewer who isn't steeped in the lore. To me, such an explanation is a failure. One thing I love about how SG has handled the new canon is that they've been really smart about keeping the Doyleist and Watsonian readings from getting too far removed.

So: the Doyleist reading of the ANH meeting. Remember we're talking 1976 here. The Emperor's not Darth Sidious, but a Nixonian bureaucrat isolated from the people. Darth Vader is feared and dangerous but also a faintly pathetic relic. Arrogant young technocrats such as Motti openly sass him, and he's been reduced to serving as henchman for Tarkin, a more politically savvy but equally vicious technocrat who bosses him around. With the Death Star complete, the Emperor dissolves the Senate (or more likely it's done in his name), making governors such as Tarkin much more powerful. Tarkin -- who even a 1976 photo caption says lusts to be Emperor -- now commands the ultimate power in the universe. First thing he does is blow up a major planet. Next thing he does ... well, we never get to find out, because a moisture farmer makes a one-in-a-million shot. It's 1976, so Yularen's not Yularen but a random costume. The other guys are extras or flunkies.

Obviously a Doyleist reading isn't the end of the matter, because our Emperor IS Darth Sidious, and Darth Vader's a relic but pretty far from pathetic. But the farther we get from the original intent, the more I think a really worthy political subplot gets blurry. So let's keep 1976 as the baseline, and go new-canon Watsonian without taking our eye off the Doyleist.

You're right, Motti's the fire-breather. Recall that Tarkin arrives in the middle of the conversation. Motti and Tagge have been fighting. Motti wants to unleash the superweapon, and doesn't care about sorcerers or the Senate or any other old stuff. We all know Motti. He's the guy who has three beers after work and starts foaming at the mouth about workplace revolutions. He's smart but he doesn't have any sense, and everyone knows it will be the death of him.

Tagge doesn't seem opposed, exactly, so much as cautious. He's not saying BY GOD MAN YOU SPEAK TREASON ... just that the Alliance is more dangerous than Motti realizes. This is going way too fast for him, not because of loyalty but because he's nervous and thinks -- correctly -- that Motti is blind to everything except his new toy. Tagge doesn't want Motti to get him killed but he also doesn't want this thing to work and Motti to displace him so he's throwing sand in the gears until he can see what's what.

Tarkin, in my Careful Watsonian reading, fully intends to use the Death Star to make himself Emperor, but unlike Motti he's not in a hurry. He can make his move in a month, a year, or a decade. Whatever he decides, annihilating the rebel base will help his cause. He probably rolls his eyes when he walks in and finds Motti sticking his neck in the noose AGAIN -- we get a pretty clear sense that this isn't the first time Motti's gone off the rails. Tarkin's happy to use Motti to sound out the others, though -- If they're enthusiastic he can speed up, and if Motti goes too far he can yank him back with stern words about loyalty or feed him to the goons. Tarkin's a seasoned killer in the political arena as well as on the battlefield, and Motti is his useful idiot.

I don't think Vader was the Emperor's emissary in 1976, but he is now. So never mind Doyleism there. But is he keeping an eye or Tarkin, or has he been co-opted by him? In a weird way, it doesn't really matter. He's a Sith, after all. It's his job to challenge his master and vice versa. Mutual suspicion has worked for the Sith for a thousand years. No need to stop now. Besides, he betrays Sidious in the other 2/3 of the OT. Why should this one be different?

Yularen's the most problematic character as we flip the switch from Doyleist to Watsonian, since he goes from Guy in the White Suit to, well, Yularen. Watsonian Yularen owes Palpatine plenty. But hey, Yularen's also old-line Republic/Empire. He always struck me as a guy who's more about order than jackboots. Perhaps he feels that things have gone too far and is amenable to a new Emperor. Or perhaps he's playing possum and this meeting will lead to the report that earns Motti a date with the executioner.

In the EU Romodi was Tarkin's guy. In new canon we're not sure what he is but from our brief look at him in RO he seems to be Tarkin's guy. Same either way.

As you say, who the heck knows anything about Molock. When he and Romodi got names in the EU he was the guy who was Not Romodi. Let's not worry about him.

The other two guys are coffee fetchers from either POV.

The Watsonian perspective makes one important character a lot more fun, though -- it's the guy who's not in the room. The Doyleist Emperor is a bureaucrat shut-in eclipsed by his handlers and generals; the Watsonian Emperor is a mastermind playing with a galaxy of puppets, and a lover of creative destruction. So keep all of the above, but now the Emperor has rigged snares everywhere. The Death Star is simultaneously a proof of concept for eternal Sith rule and an excellent way of drawing out his enemies. If Tarkin destroys Yavin 4, the Rebellion's eliminated as a threat and the Emperor can deal with Tarkin without distractions. ("The weapons system has suddenly failed after your hasty declaration? How unfortunate that your rule will be curtailed, Emperor Tarkin.") And if by chance the Death Star is destroyed? You never know, Sidious might be building another one around some random moon in the hinterlands. Just in case.