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  1. In Memory of LAJ_FETT: Please share your remembrances and condolences HERE

Amph [NERRRD] Observations, rhetorical questions, comments & 55 Years of Star Trek (General Thread)

Discussion in 'Community' started by Darth Guy, Jun 10, 2009.

  1. dp4m

    dp4m Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Nov 8, 2001

    I thought that was the Kirk / Shatner novels?
     
  2. Darth Guy

    Darth Guy Chosen One star 10

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    Aug 16, 2002
    Just something vague the Queen says at some point (First Contact, I think) about how they were once like humans. That's all we need. They were a purely biological race that got carried away with improving themselves through technology. It works into their being an anti-Federation (the Dominion is also an anti-Federation).
     
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  3. Chancellor_Ewok

    Chancellor_Ewok Chosen One star 7

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    Nov 8, 2004
    That was in The Return, which partially attributed the Borg to Spock's mind meld with V'ger.
     
  4. I Are The Internets

    I Are The Internets Shelf of Shame Host star 9 VIP - Game Host

    Registered:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Oh yeah, I forgot about that line! I guess it's best to leave it at that and not make a prequel trilogy explaining their origins.
     
  5. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Chosen One star 7

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    Jan 5, 2011


    Yeah, pretty much.

    Regardless of the likelihood of success, the Borg themselves said that this was his purpose.
     
  6. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    Probably both- there are cut scene videos of the Borg Queen (I think) narrating their origins floating around which I assumed were from a game.

    The Nero comic series also uses that connection to have V'ger seek out the Narada (or was it vice versa?) because of the Borg tech the Romulans installed on the Narada.

    EDIT- Here it is, from Star Trek Legacy.:

     
  7. Biel Ductavis

    Biel Ductavis Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 17, 2015
    First Contact was a good movie, but it destroyed everything that was fascinating about the Borg for me.
     
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  8. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    "My friends- we've come home."

    [​IMG]

    (And, yes, you're ***damn right I'm going to get the camera angles right for this one :D)

    [​IMG]

    This will hold me over until the inevitable larger version is released...

    [​IMG]


    The two page spread of this shot in the first ILM book is still one of my favorites:

    [​IMG]


    EDIT- unrelated but at the end of BOBW2, Riker intends to perform a warp ramming of the Borg cube as a last resort but Data succeeds before they initiate it.

    Has this tactical option ever been revisited elsewhere? Other than Worf's "Prepare for ramming speed!" in FC and the Jem'Hadar tactics in DS9 (both of which either are, or are implied to be, subwarp speeds), it seems like an easily available suicide option that would cause a lot of damage.

    You'd think we'd have seen it brought up at least as often as a self destruct or warp core ejection. Or be given a techno babble option explaining why it couldn't be done/be effective....
     
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  9. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012
    So watching a few not so random eps to lead up to Discovery, mostly involving Klingons. TOS went with "Day of the Dove" which really pushes how nasty the Klingons can be, even though everyone is kinda overtly nasty in that episode cuz an alien entity is forcing them to be antagonists and killers for all eternity. But I do love the solve to the problem and laughing an alien out of the ship is pretty great. Voyager went with "Barge of the Dead". Dawson puts in an actually one of her best performance when Torres ends up on a barge to the afterlife Klingon hell. It was the most Klingon-centric Voyager episode I could think of, Ron Moore came up with the story (one of his few Voyager contributions) and the telepay was by Bryan Fuller (who also wrote the Discovery pilot). Also, one thing that I noticed here is that the story is about someone realizing the afterlife is "real" - that's totally Fuller's "American Gods". Mostly. But real close.

    TNG I went with "Sins of the Father", may be the best Worf / Klingon centric episode that really went a long way to establishing the culture of the Klingons, the conspiracy that unfolds is actually pretty interesting and the introduction 1st act of Kurn, Worf's long lost brother is great. Although some people quibble that the Klingons in TOS are more cuthroat than their TNG counterparts but when the conspiracy is revealed that the high council and Duras are all in on it ... that's pretty darn nasty as well. Then, after that, Parallels. Okay, kind of a cheat since it's not Klingon-centric, but it does star a Klingon and Dorn is really awesome in it too. "I think Commander Data's painting is making me nauseous" may be one of my favourite Worf lines. And I love the notion of putting the most non-sci-fi parallel universe tolerating character at the centre of it all. This also introduced the notion of a Troi / Worf pairing and, to be fair, they work really well together here as alt. Troi seems to genuinely love Worf. I can see why Roddenberry cast Sirtis as an empath because she can be really empathetic. Although something about when Troi / Worf pairing happened in the "real" universe didn't translate quite as well. But this is a good emotional hook for a wacky episode.

    Next up: DS9 - "Way of the Warrior" (more Klingons! Worf arrives on DS9!) and "Sons of Mogh" (end of the Kurn arc). Don't think I've seen either since they aired, I'm excited. Then Enterprise "Broken Bow" (Klingon First Contact!) and "Terra Prime / Demons" (the real Enterprise finale. not any Klingons in that one, though but I like it as a series ender)
     
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  10. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 10

    Registered:
    Oct 4, 1998
    BigAl6ft6, you really need to see DS9 Blood Oath with Kang, Koloth, and Kor. Those 3 together are raw antimatter, IMO. I've always thought of Kang as a quintessential Klingon, and this was his best performance.
     
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  11. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012
    dahhh, I'll try! there's only X amount of time I have to devote to Star Trek before 8:30 PM Sunday. But hopefully I can squeak that one in there too.
     
  12. Biel Ductavis

    Biel Ductavis Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Aug 17, 2015
    Don't forget "Heart of Glory". It's still an amazing episode!
     
  13. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Chosen One star 7

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    Jan 5, 2011
    I just learned that Marina Sirtis refers to DS9 as Deep Sleep Nine, and I love it.
     
  14. Sarge

    Sarge Chosen One star 10

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    Oct 4, 1998
    Considering that she starred in some of the most sleep-inducing episodes of TNG, I'll treat her opinion with all due respect.
     
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  15. CT-867-5309

    CT-867-5309 Chosen One star 7

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    Jan 5, 2011
    Really? I don't think of her episodes as sleep inducing. I'm not sure how you could fall asleep with all her hysterical yelling. PAIN! And one of her (hysterical) episodes involved the crew's inability to dream!

    But the reason she calls it Deep Sleep Nine is because every time she visited the set, it was completely silent, like a funeral, while the set of TNG was rowdy with everyone goofing off in between takes.
     
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  16. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    Maybe she stopped watching after TNG ended? If one's opinion of DS9 was based solely on the first two seasons...
     
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  17. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012
    Watched "Way of the Warrior" which is pretty great because it puts Worf as the one who can try to reach out to the angsty Klingons but he's all bummed because the Enterprise got blown up. He slides in pretty perfectly with the rest of the cast, the tension between the Bajorians and the Federation had kind of subsided by Season 4 so you need someone who is perpetually prickly. I liked how Worf referenced the Borg encounter, which still sticks with them to this day but Worf had no doubt because he believed the Enterprise was invincible which is probably why he's so frazzled that it got blown up (By freakin' Duras sisters, no less!) Also fantastic chemistry between Jazdia and Worf right off the jump, much better pairing than with Troi.

    I noticed I didn't see Jake at all in this episode, he really was mostly just a Season 1 / pilot thing and, aside from a few episodes, with The Visitor being amazing, he dropped off quite a lot later on. Good Klingon brawls in the finale and I always get a kick out of anything Chancellor Gowron is in and, hey, first apperance of Martok! also fantastic, iconic DS9 point-of-the-series scene alert: Quark and Garak discussing the Federation and root beer.

    "Sons of Mough" is a great companion piece to "Way of the Warrior" and "Sins of the Father", especially the juxtapostion between Kurn when he first appears on The Enterprise as a tip-top solider who runs house and the drunken wretch who arrives at DS9 due to having his house lost their standings on the high council when Worf refused to go along with Gowron. See, these Klingons really aren't as honourable as they say they are, they're still scheming jerks really, aside from it seems only Worf. Random aside, Kurn is shown to have bone spurts coming out of his chest (when he opens his shirt so Worf can kill him) so maybe the Klingons have lots of biological differences across the generations (which I'm still trying to wrap my head around the DSC Klingons but I think I'm getting there). But, y'know, Worf went along at first with Kurn's plea to kill him, if it HAD succeeded what the heck was Worf going to do with Kurn's body? Beam it off into space? Blow it out an airlock?! There's a hint of that Worf could have gotten away with it legally as Jazdia starts to say he was performing a "sacred Klingon ritual" but Sisko cuts him off.

    As for Kurn's mindwipe at the end, which was really all I remembered all these years later was their final exchange, I didn't like that Kurn was mindwiped then and I don't really like it now. Kurn wanted to die and was about to phaser his own head off, you think in the Federation when anyone can do whatever they want, if they aren't harming themselves, they'd let him. But complaints about that aside, their final exchange with blank Kurn is fantastic and dramatic and the reason it's stayed with me forever. "Are you my family?" "I have no family." Kinda sums up Worf. So I guess it's worth it just for those 30 seconds.

    Then I literally googled "Animated Series Klingon episodes" and came up with The Time Trap. It has Kor from "Trouble with Tribbles" and the Klingons being dastardly and double-dealing. And there's a fun moment when Spock pretends to be buddies and hugging Klingons but just so he could read their minds. And there's a secret, out of space and time collaboration of various aliens and they're led by an Orion chick in an bikini. (Please Discovery, more Orion chicks in bikinis). I haven't seen a lot of TAS but I generally enjoy them, even though the animation is really static and repetitive, but just more as a radio play with the original TOS crew. With slightly moving pictures. It's a fun way to burn 24 minutes anyway.
     
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  18. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 7

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    Apr 25, 2004
    I watched through all of DS9, and this is about the only thing I remember off the top of my head. Well, this and "Magnificent Ferengi".
     
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  19. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012
    I was reading on Memory Alpha they almost cut the scene due to length but it's really kind of the show / Federation ethos in a single bit, the angsty / distrusting aliens who learn to like root beer.
     
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  20. jabberwalkie

    jabberwalkie Jedi Master star 4

    Registered:
    Dec 2, 2014
    Dude.... You don't remember Sisko's opening monologue from "In the Pale Moonlight"? Hell, that entire episode is memorable IMO.
     
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  21. Alpha-Red

    Alpha-Red Chosen One star 7

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    Apr 25, 2004
    I remember seeing "IT'S A FAKE!!!" and wondering who put that internet meme in my Star Trek xD
     
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  22. BigAl6ft6

    BigAl6ft6 Chosen One star 8

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    Nov 12, 2012

    "Computer, erase that entire personal log." is one of my favourite ending lines from a Star Trek episode ever. Along with Kirk's "Let's get the hell out of here." from "City on the Edge of Forever" and "Mr. Worf, fire." from "Best of Both Worlds Part 1"

    edit: unrealted to awesome final lines, Worf was totally on Webster

    http://trekcore.com/blog/2015/03/tng-webster-crossover/

    [​IMG]

    Huh, apparently it was also the series finale of Webster too. going out on a high note! Can't get much better than that so had to close up shop. Apparently, it's Webster and Worf in a clip show. I started reading the Trekcore summary, which is entertainingly written, but I'm going to see if I can find the episode Internets anywhere first.

    Probably still a series finale that was more respectful to the history of the show than "These are the Voyages" Hiyoooo!!!
     
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  23. Kenneth Morgan

    Kenneth Morgan Chosen One star 5

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    May 27, 1999
    How about Bones' "Well, whatta you know. I finally got the last word!" from "Journey to Babel"?
     
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  24. The2ndQuest

    The2ndQuest Tri-Mod With a Mouth star 10 Staff Member Manager

    Registered:
    Jan 27, 2000
    To bring this full circle to your mini Klingon marathon, given the listed airing date, this actually aired a 9 days before Sins of the Father (2 days before The Offspring).
     
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  25. Cowgirl Jedi 1701

    Cowgirl Jedi 1701 Force Ghost star 5

    Registered:
    Dec 21, 2016

    Yeah, I always liked that. He sort of broke the fourth wall there, didn't he?
     
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