Lit From Endor to Exegol - The State of the Galaxy Discussion Thread (Tagged Victory's Price Spoilers)

Huh? Kylo's saber certainly has bits of wire showing. And I can certainly see how the unstable red energy from both it and Starkiller Base looks "angry". (Though in the case of Starkiller Base that's because it's from a star).

But I wouldn't describe ANY of the other First Order equipment besides the lightsaber as "slapdash" or "hastily-assembled".

 

Really? Their Star Destroyers are ugly bastards.

 

Oh I agree the Resurgents are ugly as sin. I hate the squashed, asymmetrical bridge and the random metal bits poking out. (though they look a lot better when seen from above, check out their Wookieepedia page).

I just don't think that necessarily means their construction was rushed or haphazard. If anything we could take it to mean they value function over aesthetics. (Like with their U-boat looking transports).

 

Looks aside, going by the weapons fit the Resurgents carry a heck of a lot more firepower than an ISD, have double the fighter capacity, and are probably much harder to kill. A fully-operational MC85 might be able to take one in a straight slugging match, but I can't really see a smaller ship like an MC80 or ISD having much of a chance - and most of the post-Concordance local defense forces of neutral or Republic worlds would presumably be frigates or corvettes rather than cruisers or Star Destroyers.

 

Heh, trust Cane to weigh in on matters of ordnance!

 

Another factor to consider is the Sacred Jedi Texts that Rey borrowed from Ahch-To.

They're what... 8 tomes in all? Have them digitized and translated into modern Basic and you could have them spread all over the HoloNet in no time. A resurgence of the Jedi religion could trigger uprisings against the First Order across the galaxy, and as we saw with Chirrut Îmwe, you don't need to be Force-sensitive for your faith in the Force to let you do amazing things. Remember, this is a setting where the supernatural force being prayed to actually does seem to take an active role.

And then there's the actual Force-sensitive people across the galaxy, like that stable-boy in Canto Bight. With access to the Sacred Texts, and given a large enough time skip between episodes VIII and IX, a completely decentralized resurgence of the Jedi Order might might aid in the overthrow of the First Order.

 

HoloJedi, as opposed to HoloSith?

 

I actually thought that the visual design was implying the First Order placed too heavy an emphasis on aesthetics, or at the very least that their stuff had been more for show than actual use up to this point. Everything is either sleek and lifeless or ridiculously brutalist. Not to sound too Jellonian, but it's one of the reasons they feel more like an invading horde than anything resembling a stable state. It's part of why TLJ indicates they're as much a symptom as 'the' problem.

 

I think the First Order built Soviet brutalist ships. They are kyber-crystal superpunchers, big, and hard.

Stalinist military ideas.

 

I'm still convinced they are more like Mongol or barbarian hordes invading Europe than Soviet's crossing over from the Warsaw Pact into NATO. Which works perfectly as they are largely coming from the Unknown Regions.

--Adm. Nick

 

The neat things about allegories is that they can sort of overlap. The Klingons from Star Trek are vikings AND Samurai. The Empire is Nazis AND Romans. There's no reason the First Order can't be a horde AND Soviets.

Though for me personally, although I can see the Mongol analogy that they are charging out in massive numbers from the unknown to attack "civilization", I wouldn't exactly call them a horde. One doesn't usually picture barbarian hordes as being organized enough to have ranks and officers.

 

I've read the new visual dictionary (interesting mystery about the Praetorians that they set-up there), and now I'm re-reading "Bloodline."

I'll post more info as I re-read it, but one thing that I think I skimmed over before is that it says Mon Mothma still unofficially led the New Republic even after she retired from being Chancellor, due to her charisma at getting everyone to work together that helped her successors, and it wasn't only until she became ill (years after retiring from Chancellor) and she stopped leading in an unofficial capacity did the hyperpartisanship really begin, according to Leia.

 

I've been meaning to re-read Bloodline now that TLJ is out, if anything pops up that is relevant to this thread let us know!

--Adm. Nick

 

The HoloJedi thing has merit, but too susceptible to outside sabotage, I would think.

I honestly always felt FO designs and even the SKB and Supremacy were already thought up by the Empire and/or already in the works and being constructed, but thanks to the Rebellion, their progress was halted till the Imperial Remnant fled to that network of labs, bases and shipyards in the unknown regions. Plus, factoring in the facilities on the Supremacy.....

The Rebellion has a lot of catching up to do.....

I also think it's possible because Snoke, like Kylo Ren thought by having immersed himself in the darkness of the past, it'd showcase a sense of strength and power, and I also agree that whatever new designs they have would opt for function over fashion. With him out of the picture now, and with Ren's 'let the past die' bit, I think he's on the way to giving the FO a major overhaul.

 

I doubt they will have the nerve to do it, but Mothma's story in FACPOV showed she was far from some fluffy-headed, airy-fairy idealist - she absolutely knew her enemy.

On that basis, while she committed the NR to demilitarisation, what contingency options did she also set up, with Leia and Ackbar? Call it the new material's homage to the Katana Fleet if you like, but this time wielded by the Rebels.

 

From the looks, there were none. Otherwise that would've been the Resistance' gambit instead of Crait, I should hope.

I'm pretty sure Mothma WAS just an airy-fairy, fluffy-headed idealist. She may have lived during the Clone Wars and when the Republic was at its peak, but she was blind to the corruption and the reason something needed to give, in that the system was coming apart at the seams and the Jedi were practically all that held it together. What she did for the NR with certain things like move the capital around was a start, but demilitarizing was taking it too far.

She could also be held responsible for Alderaan. After watching Rebels, I feel if she had aided Saw Guerrera more, they might've discovered the Death Star sooner.

 

Well, it's very much one of those 'strangely not mentioned before cards'. It would take some creativity to square it not turning up earlier given the plot of TLJ.

 

Or JJ might come up with some clever way to send a middle finger right back to RJ in regards to certain plot points he set up in TFA.

In fairness, however, in BF II Resurrection, the FO has a fleet that can conquer the galaxy, so it may be possible that the Resistance's allies were under siege. Maybe.

 

While that might give us some temporary comedy value, it'd be an absolutely awful way for a trilogy of films to have been done.

 

It also assumes a lot about Rian Johnson's intentions, to say nothing of Abrams' intentions. I mean, remember all the post-TFA interviews with Daisy Ridley and Abrams where they both said

Spoiler

Rey's parents weren't anyone in the film and/or didn't matter? Or this?

 

I agree, but I wouldn't have suggested it if I didn't think they'd actually consider it, seeing as how devising TLJ is for fans.

They're at the final stretch with Ep. IX, but they don't necessarily have to improve their movies that are already raking in the cash.

And this isn't a slight on Disney/Lucasfilm's intentions, I can acquiesce to the fact that people have to eat.

 

That just makes Abrams' work in TFA even odder then. Misdirection? Sure, but generally misdirection is used to hint at something bigger than 'yeah, they're really no one'.

Maybe there's some all too clever by half game going on here that I'm not seeing, but whatever it was, it backfired.

 

Or.....They're just making things up as they go along.

Not an impossible scenario. They wouldn't have the same passion as the guy who came up with the story in the first place, no?

TFA and TLJ don't resonate as stories where people were thinking of taking it.

Part of the reason TLJ 'didn't go the way we thought' is because RJ abruptly sliced off a bunch of JJ's mysteries and build up, not that it takes SW to new places or reveals secrets that change our view of the SW universe, just severed plot points.