ST ST Complimentary Discussion Thread

I have to pick just one???

Loved several scenes for various reasons.

Loved the shared visions. It brought an intimacy to the saga that I don't think we've ever seen before. It really highlighted how personal the Force story was in this film.

I loved Holdo's sacrifice, realizing after the fact that the lone voice that stage whispered "Dude" in the silence of the theater was my own kid sitting with her friends.

I loved Yoda's appearance hammering home the theme of the whole movie: Failure is the Greatest Teacher.

And I loved the spectacle of the throne room battle.

yeah, it's definitely hard to pick just one thing that really stood out. I really liked a lot of the film.

 

Any other Minority-Report movie fans out there who enjoyed some of Phil K Dick's concepts in TLJ?

There's the Luke Skywalker darkside daze aspect which is Minority Report taken to the most extreme.

However, there's also the other. The shared vision of the future that Kylo Ren and Rey both see, which involves them working together and killing Snoke. That's the vision they seem to have and that's driving them but each then has their own different take on what happens next. Rey thinks he'll turn for her and to come back to the Resistance his mother is leading. Ben thinks she'll turn for him and his offer of wealth and power. They both proceed almost like Minority Report because its fate in a way. It seems like even a stronger vision of the future than what Luke had based on their Force bond combining and them becoming one between light and dark briefly.

Just curious if anyone else liked that?

 

I'm not sure Kylo saw a vision of the future though. He never actually claims to. Kylo says "I saw something too, and because of what I saw I know that when the moment comes you will be the one who turns. Rey, I saw who your parents are." That wording might be off slightly, but I have watched it several times now, paying close attention to the elvator scene, and he definitely doesn't explicitly claim to have seen anything other than the identify of her parents. For all we know he had a vision of the past.

 

Rey saw that when the time comes, he would join her.

Kylo saw that she would join him.

Both were correct. They joined for a while, but not in the way they expected.

 

I'm just going off their exact words, having seen it more times than I care to admit and having this as my favorite part. Rey tells Luke that "If I go to him, he will turn" and then tells Kylo "I saw your future, not in detail but solid. You will not bow to Snoke. You'll turn. I'll help you". ANd then Kylo says what I said earlier "I saw something too and because of that I know that when the time comes, you will turn. Rey, I saw who your parents are"

My interpretation is that Rey saw a vision of the future where Kylo turned against Snoke. This basically came true. He did turn on Snoke, but he didn't turn to the light, as she clearly thought he would. She never said she saw that Kylo would join her (although she did probably believe that). I think Kylo just saw Rey's parents, perhaps in a vision of her past, and believed it was his trump card that would turn her (and he played it).

It's open to interpretation of course. We didn't see what they saw or hear them explain what they thought would happen in detail. But I honestly don't think Kylo ever really claimed to have seen the future (a claim that Rey made explicitly and with conviction to two different people).

 

I think this is 100% the correct interpretation.

 

Hi 2Cleva, hows it going? This is just a postive area to post what you loved about TLJ . There are plenty of threads to debate each and every character, scene, etc cetera. This thread is simply the what you loved about it...and if you didnt love anything about it that is perfectly ok, but we wont read about why here. If we want to know we will go to the other threads and discuss that there. Im purely taking an only what you take with you approach on these threads and officially stating that neither side of these excellent viewpoints are right or wrong about TLJ.... But this thread is all about the love and thats what im taking with me in regards to this thread.

 

More....this might surprise you. But it delights me. It's deep but you are free to agree or disagree.

1) Micro in the scheme of things :

Leia to Poe: a. Smack!
b. You're demoted (ranked reduced ergo power taken away).
c. Poe: We brought down the Dreadnaught (it is a Resistance Fleetkiller and then no chance to bring down the RO)
d. Leia :There are somethings you cannot solve by jumping on an x-wing and blowing something up! I need you to understand that.
e. Leia : But at what cost? Dead heroes. No leaders.
f. Poe: Permission to get on an Xwing and blow something up?
g. Leia : Permission Granted (giving approval).

BONUS : h. Leia almost dies but actually survives.

2. Macro in the scheme of things :

a. Rey: Master Skywalker we need you to bring the Jedi order back. Kylo Ren is strong with the Dark side of the Force. Without the Jedi we can't stand a chance against him.. b. Luke to Rey : Everything you said is wrong. The Force is not a power you have. It's not about lifting rocks . c. Whack! d. Rey: Lifting rocks. e. Rey saves the day as Luke stalls the RO (changes his mind by coming back, giving Rey approval . "I will not be the last Jedi"). f. Luke dies but survives as a Force Ghost ("dead hero" so to speak) g. Poe becomes leader (*Leia :"What are you looking at me for? Follow him!").

MJ

 

For sure, this is the correct interpretation.

 

I can't do it because I'm on my phone but I'm pretty sure you could do one for Finn as well.

1. Finn tries to escape the Raddus with the homing beacons. 2. Rose catches him. 3.Finn: this fleet is doomed. I'm just trying to save my friend Rey.(who he loves) 4. Rose: You're selfish and a traitor. My sister gave her life for us to live.
5. Finn gives a speech on Crait about not giving up. 6. Finn tries to give up his life to try to stop the canon. 6. Rose stops him. And, of course, the dialogue that comes after.

 

I didn't like TLJ very much, but I like the general outline of the story and concede there are good elements in it.

My favorite aspect of TLJ, hands down, is the fact that Rey has no parents connected to the saga so far. It would be oddly deflating to have her be a Kenobi/Skywalker/Icecreammaker. It's well past time that hereditary Force-ness is relegated to the ash heap of galactic history.

 

My favorite Hux moment, I just found out, was ad libbed by Gleeson.

When Hux starts to pull out his blaster over the unconscious Kylo.

Suddenly Kylo wakes up, and Hux quietly puts his blaster back.

 

something else I loved was something they did not put in aka these things. like I didnt love the luke milking part but it was one second.

 

One of the best moments in the saga for me. The laughing and cheering in the cinema was great too.

 

For people who loved the movie, what do you think is the meaning of the long string of mirror Reys? What are they trying to imply here?

I remember that in TFA they dropped several hints that Rey was a no one. I imagine they are doing the same, but for a different reason, there.

 

One particular scene that I liked was Rey practicing with the lightsaber, It was a scene that says a lot without saying a single word, and shows that Rey still has a lot to learn, she can follow her instinct and fight decently but she doesn't know what she's doing at the end of the day.

 

I think the scene says a lot. Precisely in how it is connected with the saga and the force, I think it is a take on looking to the future, the past, but being able to focus on where you are in the moment. Many scenes in this film call back to past dialog from Yoda. This scene in particular calls to "... Never his mind on where he was, what he was doing..."

For these reasons it is also why people have a hard time buying some of it, because while the film makes direct correlations to past knowledge of the saga, it also undermines and contracts at times.

 

I think a couple of things.

Rey's arc is largely revolved around one of her character flaws in that she is waiting for people, instead of taking control of her own life, and becoming the best version of herself. In TFA she continues to wait for her parents to come back. In TLJ she's waiting for Luke to come back and save the galaxy. When Luke disappoints her, she decides that it has to be Kylo to 'turn' and help turn the tide on the battle, and as a result, save the galaxy. I think the vision, in part, reflects her arc, in the same way that Luke seeing himself on Dagobah reflected his. Luke's greatest fear, as shown by the vision, is to essentially become Vader. Rey's greatest fear seems to stem from her constant reliance on others to control what she does in life. Her desire to see and know who her parents are feeds that reliance and her fear that 'she's nobody,' just like her parents. The reflection shows her herself, revealing her greatest fear, and indicating that she needs to decide who she is to become - not anyone else.

Additionally, this is a dark side cave. She goes here after one of her most tense conversations that she has with Kylo. She's angry - she thinks he's lying about Luke. And with that anger comes the seduction of the dark side, which she feels and hears calling her. She follows it, down to the dark side cave. She continues to follow the dark side (I believe this is what the long string of Reys represents - her going deeper and deeper into the dark side.) "I knew this wouldn't last forever, and at the end it would show me what I came to see." The dark side 'promises' her answers as she follows it deeper and deeper along the string of Reys. She gets to the end desperate to get answers about her parents, and the dark side, instead, leaves her with nothing. And she's left feeling lost and alone - just as most people feel after falling to the dark side (Anakin on Mustafar, Kylo after killing Han, Kylo at the very end of TLJ.)

 

@KembaSkywalker that was a great analysis. You have some strong points here.

 

The fact that he is still referring to what he saw and that when a moment comes in the future he knows that she will turn suggests it’s still the future. It could possibly be he saw himself in the future trying to turn her, including their conversation.

This is what I mean though. I love all of the implications of all of these things the characters with Force powers experience related to the mind. Future visions. Shared thoughts. Sensing and not killing. Stealing info from the mind.

 

Unrelated to that reply...

I’m a big fan of the Canto Bight police look and their Speeders.






Anyone else like how they look visually?

 

Controversial, but I’m going to say Leia saving herself in space is my favorite scene in a SW film since 1983. I love it that much.

 

Yeah. I liked how she was trying to transfer the control and her instincts with her staff to the saber in that scene but still had that tendency to go right through like her staff and cut right through the large stone.

Is that shot of Rey practicing with the saber the longest we’ve seen any developing Force user on screen training with a saber by themselves on screen before? I imagine she practiced with her staff like that as well as a younger person.

 

Probably the best rendition of Leia’s Theme too.