A/V Episode VIII - THE LAST JEDI - Official Movie Discussion Thread

It happened to be chance that Rey woke up before him, not a testament to her being a better fighter... but I agree that a Kylo/Rey fight in IX doesn't really let anyone question who the victor will be.

 

Really? I thought they seemed pretty even. Rey won the first fight because Kylo was practically bleeding to death from a bowcaster bolt to the gut lol. Second was about as even as you can get.

Though I can see from a common sense perspective why you'd have to assume Rey would inevitably over take him. She's trained for like a week, with minimal help and is already at a similar level to Kylo who's been training from childhood with help from some very powerful masters. If Anakin Skywalker was the Chosen One then she must be the Super Chosen One

 

Kylo will have moved on to Force Lightning by 9 I'm sure.

 

Maybe 'the Supreme Chosen One'?

 

Or she was just the chosen one the whole time and Anakin was a decoy. Maybe there will be an even more powerful force user every Trilogy and each time and the Force will be like "nah guys this is the real chosen one all those others weren't actually"

 

I kind of hope this is the case, just to **** with people.

 

Kylo and Rey have only had one proper physical fight. They've had two Force fights (one mental, one physical pulling for the lightsaber). Rey handily won both confrontations on the Starkiller, no debate there.

They actually don't have a confrontation on the Supremacy and are working in tandem until the very end. When Rey tries to pull the lightsaber with the Force. Which does technically count as a confrontaiton. As for pulling the lightsaber fight, Rey initiated it (she did yank it outta Kylo's belt) but Kylo DID stop her from getting it all the way to her, then they both Force pulled and then things got Explodey (via them tearing Skywalker's saber in half and Holdo smashing through the Supremacy). HOWEVER, as stated and is established in the film, Rey not only wakes up before Kylo, she manged to retrieve both broken portions of the saber and then escape. So, yeah, I guess she won that one too.

 

You know, normally I'm a proponent of letting the villains have a couple victories so that they can prove that they're a legitimate threat. But in Kylo's case, I don't advocate that. He deserves nothing but defeat after ignominious defeat.

 

Yeah but it doesn't make a good story unless executed very, very well.

 

I'd argue that killing Han Solo and seizing the throne is a compelling couple of credentials. As is defeating Luke Skywalker.

 

Yah so far the only person who has actually gotten in his way is Rey. Otherwise, it's been a pretty fantastic few days for Kylo Ren. I mean, losing to Rey and having the Resistance escape and Luke Skywalker school him really sucked but he is kinda running the entire galaxy and cut his boss in half, that's pretty solid.

Also this was kind of an awesome way to make himself feel better



(I know I've mentioned this before but the out of focus chopped up Snoke in the background is one of my favourite little details in the movie)

 

They are impressive credentials in summary, but they wrote the specifics so he still looked like a loser despite that.

I get it, don't make the evil villains too relatable, don't glorify them and send mixed messages to kids.

But I think they went too far. Would Nute Gunray as a Sith, and focused on as THE main villain and almost protagonist, have been a good idea for the PT?

 

I feel like getting shot in the gut by Chewie keeps getting overlooked. If Chewie were a bit more ruthless then Kylo Ren's story would have ended right there and then.

 

Chewie needs to learn to aim for the head and not the chest.

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Yeah I've seen that comic a few times. It was actually what I was thinking of when making the post. Really gets you.

 

I would say, Chewie more likely missed because he was angry and upset over watching his best friend being murdered.

 

It's just a meme comic. Not supposed to be a canon depiction of exactly what happened.

 

Chewie shooting Ben was more shocking to me than Han dying.

 

I can't feel any sympathy for Ben Solo. He's had so many chances to step back into the light and keeps rejecting them. He's not even trapped in a lifesuit the way Vader was. His Master is dead. If there's good in him, he can end the war immediately. Ben isn't like Vader. He has no desire to turn away from his dark path.

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He's not a well written character. I don't know why everyone hated Anakin in the prequels but praises Kylo. Kylo is not a realistic person with realistic motivations.

Its like comparing the paper thin character of x-men villain the vanisher (if you never heard of him its because hes a poorly written rarely used character) over the deep magneto. Kylos no magneto.

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I agree, though I've never hated the Prequels. Not even Jar Jar. I grew up watching the Prequels and Clone Wars. To me, that was Star Wars. I only saw the OT once as a kid and I wasn't very impressed. Anakin Skywalker is one of my favorite characters, which is probably obvious by my choice of avatar.

 

There's definitely truth to that. Wanting to be on the Dark Side because your grandfather was? It definitely needs more explanation at the very least. Hard to compare with Anakin in the prequels because that was literally his entire story mapped out in detail. We have seen virtually nothing of Kylo's story. How did he fall dark? Why? What exactly was Snoke's involvement?

 

I love Jar Jar too and all of the PT. I think Anakin is a well written character and Hayden did an awesome job.

I just think Ben is written better, more interesting than Anakin and Adam makes that character amazing.

As an aside that Chewie short is absolutely my headcanon. He probably both hates and misses Ben.

 

Admittedly the film requires closer reading than most Star Wars films, but I thought it was pretty clear from TLJ that Kylo and Luke are both driven by the same conclusion - that the orthodoxy of Jedi and Sith is ruinous and cyclical for the galaxy and so it must be swept away