Author Topic: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
dizfactor  7826 posts
Registered: Aug '02
6896_Obi-Wan<br>LEGO
Date Posted: 3/2/06 2:29pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
Maybe its' a disconnect, my brother was adopted. To be blunt, the Jedi are the Jedi's family. There's no connection save at the dimmest between the Jedi and their blood relations. Its seriously overstating the ties to a nebulous figure whom frankly I think in most cases should probably be left behind.

Certainly, the Jedi would feel that a 1 foot tall green alien is more their father than they would some random DNA donater.


I agree, wholeheartedly. Maybe it's just my background, too: I was raised by my mom and my grandparents. I never knew my father; hell, I never even knew his name until a few years ago (and since then, I've forgotten it again - Richard something, I think), and I never had the teensiest shred of angst about it. I never missed having him in my life, I never thought about it unless people asked, and I certainly never pined away for the daddy I never knew. The family that raised me was my family.

I would imagine the Jedi were much the same way. Obviously, it's different for someone like Anakin, who had actually been raised by his birth mother, but for someone like Etain or really 99.999999999% of the other Jedi it just rings completely false for me. For most Jedi, the Order is their family, and their biological parents are really just DNA donors.

The best handling of the issue as far as I'm concerned was in Republic 64, where Ronhar Kim meets his biological father and really has no interest in having a father-son relationship with him.

Ties of blood are, frankly, overstated and overrated.

 

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Charlemagne19  26816 posts
Registered: Jul '00
6408_Jedi Outcast
Date Posted: 3/2/06 2:56pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
I also liked the implications of Obi Wan Kenobi and "Jedi Apprentice" where Obi Wan clearly has met his biological relatives, knows he has a brother and who his 'parents' are but its not exactly a huge deal to him. Qui Gon is his father though and Yoda to a larger more extent though.

He doesn't bear them any ill will and might even thank them for giving them up to the order but his family is amongst the Jedi.

While certainly "dead beat" 'parents' are easier to divorce yourself from, the simple fact of the ties not being very important because your emotional and mentoring needs were filled by someone else means that the family bonds will not include the biological.

 

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sabarte  3056 posts
Registered: Sep '05
13620_Solar Sailor
Date Posted: 3/2/06 3:31pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
(/have not been able to get the book yet, just commenting on spoilers)

I agree about the need for family being overdone - and I also think the need for romantic love is slightly overdone, or if not overdone at least done to the point where I find it staggeringly dull. I like monastic Jedi, even if their system is somewhat screwed up. I seem to be the only one, though.

Also, I don't see why the Kaminoans didn't disable natural reproduction in the clones. I can't see them ever intending clones to have families, or to reproduce in unauthorized ways and mess up their perfectly good genes. Maybe it was an oversight, but it just seems...well. Karen didn't start it, I know, but it bugs me. Having half of the interesting modifications the Kaminoans made also seems like it might cause some problems.

From the spoilers I've read, I'm really sketchy about the playing around with pregnancy, especially with no prior experience with doing it. Human pregnancy works pretty well at producing a kid. Screwing up your body chemistry to make your kid grow at an unnatural rate seems like it might cause...problems...later.

Kid will probably turn out okay regardless, just wish people would think about that sort of thing. Do hope he's not Force-sensitive, just because brats with Jedi powers seem to become universally dull. And with the "he's a Jedi, AND a Mandalorian! Kewlies!" factor, I consider this a real danger.

But then, I also thought it would have been amazingly cool for Luke and Mara to have to deal with a child of theirs who couldn't touch the Force.

 

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Charlemagne19  26816 posts
Registered: Jul '00
6408_Jedi Outcast
Date Posted: 3/2/06 3:44pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
I think the main problem People had was that they felt that Luke and Mara's only kid being forceless would be amazingly tragic.

 

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sabarte  3056 posts
Registered: Sep '05
13620_Solar Sailor
Date Posted: 3/2/06 5:16pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
Eh, 'if you aren't a Jedi you don't matter' is the sort of thinking that I'm uncomfortable with. I like Jedi, but I think non-Jedi have their place too, and it isn't necessarily a lesser place. Assimilating all the EU bloodlines into the Jedi Family Tree of Ultimate Speshul just seems....well, I personally don't like it.

I suppose Luke and Mara might have viewed it as tragic. I also suspect it would have lead to a lot more interesting plotlines and discussion than we'll get in the future with Yet Another Superjedi Kid.

 

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Charlemagne19  26816 posts
Registered: Jul '00
6408_Jedi Outcast
Date Posted: 3/2/06 5:26pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
sabarte posted:
Eh, 'if you aren't a Jedi you don't matter' is the sort of thinking that I'm uncomfortable with. I like Jedi, but I think non-Jedi have their place too, and it isn't necessarily a lesser place. Assimilating all the EU bloodlines into the Jedi Family Tree of Ultimate Speshul just seems....well, I personally don't like it.

I suppose Luke and Mara might have viewed it as tragic. I also suspect it would have lead to a lot more interesting plotlines and discussion than we'll get in the future with Yet Another Superjedi Kid.


Well I think that its basically like Tigris and Rillao. He's a wonderful guy who can be a scientist, pilot, or anything else but its disappointing honestly he couldn't be a Jedi Knight honestly.

On the reverse, take Uldir who works better as a nonforcesensetive.

But yes, the child of Luke Skywalker isn't a Jedi? All I can think is...

"If I were that boy, I would find the deepest and darkest hole in the universe before crawling in it."

 

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Quiet_Mandalorian  8380 posts
Registered: Apr '05
40335_Boba Fett
Date Posted: 3/2/06 6:23pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed) - Date Edited: 3/2/06 6:25pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Quiet_Mandalorian
Charlemagne19 posted:
I also liked the implications of Obi Wan Kenobi and "Jedi Apprentice" where Obi Wan clearly has met his biological relatives, knows he has a brother and who his 'parents' are but its not exactly a huge deal to him. Qui Gon is his father though and Yoda to a larger more extent though.

He doesn't bear them any ill will and might even thank them for giving them up to the order but his family is amongst the Jedi.

While certainly "dead beat" 'parents' are easier to divorce yourself from, the simple fact of the ties not being very important because your emotional and mentoring needs were filled by someone else means that the family bonds will not include the biological.
I don't think you're really looking at the whole picture, in this instance.

*edit*

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Charlemagne19  26816 posts
Registered: Jul '00
6408_Jedi Outcast
Date Posted: 3/2/06 6:32pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
Man, I wonder what you edited.

So what am I missing?

 

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Ive_Got_Two_Legs  3647 posts
Registered: Jul '05
7434_Gilad Pellaeon
Date Posted: 3/2/06 8:06pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
Pelranius posted:
There were quite a substantial number of nonclones in the Republic forces (ie, who do you think was crewing all those Dreadnaughts and Victory Star Destroyers?)


Clone Wars Vol. II has clones manning a SD pit, and if Thrawn could get clones to fly Dreadnaughts, I don't see why the Kaminoans couldn't.

Mandalorian_Crusader posted:
Charlemagne19 posted:
RC: Hard Contact and other works have disabused many fans of the notion that tghe future stormtroopers are more equivalent to orcs than people and Triple Zero continues that trend.
Interesting comparison. Good point on that.


You know what's funny? I make the point that I don't like the fact that she's trying so hard to make the future stormies into big noble heroes who had no choice but to serve the Empire, etc., when that goes against everything the stormies were supposed to be - and plenty of people, including you Charles - jump right on me and say how the clones aren't supposed to be stormtroopers.

Then you turn around and make the exact same claim, and all the Fandalorians can't wait to agree with you.

Hmm.

 

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Charlemagne19  26816 posts
Registered: Jul '00
6408_Jedi Outcast
Date Posted: 3/2/06 8:11pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed) - Date Edited: 3/2/06 8:14pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Charlemagne19
Actually, I've_Got_Two_Legs I've never argued that the Clone Troopers aren't the future Stormtroopers.

I also think that for the most part that they should be looked at as soldiers for a repressive regime.

A few might be heroic figures though.

Like TIE Fighter, its just fun to think of things from their perspective.

 

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Rohniss  3300 posts
Registered: May '05
42019_Indiana Jones
Date Posted: 3/2/06 8:16pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
I personally liked it better when the Stormies were normal humans (non-grown).. much more variety.. atleast give me a 50/50 split with the original Clones (Kaminoan) bieng phased out rapidly, due to the quick aging..

I dunno, I always have seen the Stormies as the instruments of a repressive, evil regime.. but like the real-life SA Stormtroops.. not ALL (100%) were evil butchers.. The non-clone ones most specifically.

 

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Excellence  24488 posts
Registered: Jul '02
6338_New Republic Seal
Date Posted: 3/2/06 11:04pm Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)

True. Not all stormtroopers were evil.

Some were geeks, like Felth.

 

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Charlemagne19  26816 posts
Registered: Jul '00
6408_Jedi Outcast
Date Posted: 3/3/06 12:09am Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
Excellence posted:

True. Not all stormtroopers were evil.

Some were geeks, like Felth.


Well Rebel Stormtroopers included Kyle Katarn and Crix Madine.

Of course, we'll always remember Galactic Battleground as the Stormtroopers version of Call to Duty. It even makes the assaults on the Jedi Temple and Naboo seem vaguely justified or maybe its the fact that the stormtroopers are just sent there to fight and no one gets any chance to explain themselves (or bothers really) before blaster bolts start flying both ways.

 

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razzy1319  1862 posts
Registered: Jun '04
24104_Clone Trooper
Date Posted: 3/3/06 1:19am Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
I finally finished the book... cant wait for the next one... grin ... need more clones...

even the probability that the clones might become normal people is interesting although I have a feeling its a red herring or a quest for the fountain of youth... normal people meaning non age accelerated clones.

 

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Commander5052  3504 posts
Registered: Aug '05
45237_Mando'ade
Date Posted: 3/3/06 5:31am Subject: RE: The Official Republic Commando: Triple Zero Discussion Thread (spoilers allowed)
Excellence posted:

True. Not all stormtroopers were evil.

Some were geeks, like Felth.

Davin Felth was NOT a geek! angry

 

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