Author Topic: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #?)
masterskywalker  6085 posts
Registered: Nov '01
23685_Anakin
Date Posted: 4/9/06 12:12pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
Hey hey hey! Let's not forget who first raised the issue of including that sheild into canon! tongue mischief

 

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Halagad_Ventor  1278 posts
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Date Posted: 4/9/06 1:13pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
TalonCard posted:
The author of that particular interpretive exercise has been known to write articles making what was previously conjecture official. From time to time. tongue
Touche.

Remember the overriding theme of that essay is the "character" and attractiveness of ambiguity. Put another way, suggesting that the Mimban-Vader was a doppleganger would be just about the last thing on a long retcon list. And even then, it would never be more than a mere suggestion of the possibility that its a doppleganger. So in other words, that interpretive possibility already exists, and I've already made a case for it as strongly as I could. To make the suggestion of the possibility in an official text would merely highlight that such an interpretive possibility exists, but never make it definitive. (That would be the job of more literal-minded misinterpretationists).

CeiranHarmony posted:
it seems Insider is out and spoilers are hitting the net already: go here www.njoe.com
Insider #87?

 

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Rogue_Follower  8549 posts
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Date Posted: 4/9/06 1:15pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
Yes, 87.

I got it early this time, too. Seems that karma is making up for the fact that I got 86 three weeks late...

:P

 

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Leto II  11842 posts
Registered: Jan '00
42114_Jones Attacked
Date Posted: 4/9/06 2:01pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
Halagad_Ventor posted:
Rouge77 posted:
One would think that Naboo is one of those places that Darth Vader spends as little time as possible - if he avoids Tatooine to avoid "waking" Anakin Skywalker, surely the same goes with Naboo? Maybe Palpatine can use this to his advantage, keep Lord Vader on Naboo on extended times now and then and so make his apprentice face his past and become less sure of himself as he has to fight with and bury his past again, and so he would be less a threat to his master´s current well being? After all, Sidious needs to keep Vader strong enough to serve him well, but not strong enough to overthrow and kill him...
These days, I'm not so sure, at least not early in their Sith relationship. I think Karen Traviss did a terrific job of portraying Palpatine as twistedly paternal; you get the sense he *wants* Vader to be able to kill him. Of course, maybe Palp saw that as a challenge to motivate himself to make sure he figured out the secret of immortality. One of my favorite quotes about Palpatine is that "wheels within wheels within wheels was his way."

There's a bit on this subject in the latest Last of the Jedi book (#4, Death on Naboo), if memory serves me correctly...it's not the least among many other painful "prods" Sidious maintains over and periodically inflicts upon Vader's psyche, per Karen's two "Lekauf" tales.


masterskywalker posted:
Hey hey hey! Let's not forget who first raised the issue of including that sheild into canon! tongue mischief

 

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Halagad_Ventor  1278 posts
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Date Posted: 4/9/06 4:29pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
I've missed you, Leto.

 

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Leto II  11842 posts
Registered: Jan '00
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Date Posted: 4/9/06 4:57pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
devil mischief

...I'm back, baby.

 

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Mavrick889  4566 posts
Registered: Feb '99
19926_Obi-Wan Kenobi
Date Posted: 4/13/06 9:13am Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
I'd love to see something on the ISD Garrett - the ISD Vader tools around in in Tie Fighter. Perhaps it's the same ISD we see him using in several recent issues of Empire?

 

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FTeik  4072 posts
Registered: Nov '00
39843_Palpatine
Date Posted: 4/13/06 9:28am Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
Probably to late to add, but we don't know if the way Luke "rebuild" Vader's retreat in "Before the Storm" mirrors the original lay-out and make-up of the castle.

I'll have to read Splinter and its comic-adaption again, but i would suggest to not use a darkside-doppelganger, but either another darkside-adept masking as Vader or a human replicoid droid as place-holders for the real Vader since the poor guy has a busy shedule and can only be at so many places at once.

 

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Rogue_Follower  8549 posts
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Date Posted: 4/13/06 11:04am Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88) - Date Edited: 4/13/06 12:04pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Rogue_Follower
[i]>>>Probably to late to add, but we don't know if the way Luke "rebuild" Vader's retreat in "Before the Storm" mirrors the original lay-out and make-up of the castle.

 

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Halagad_Ventor  1278 posts
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Date Posted: 4/13/06 12:54pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
Super_Battle_Droid posted:



Padme: "Whose motorcycle is this?"
Vader: "It's a chopper, baby."
Padme: "Whose chopper is this?"
Vader: "Zev."
Padme: "Who's Zev?"
Vader: "Zev's dead, baby. Zev's dead."

Rogue_Follower posted:
Indeed. happy

Nomad was such a good comic; 'tis a shame that Tales went belly up. sad
Ain't it the truth.

Badeaux[?] has a beautifully creative style. I love the new creatures and designs he comes up with. His work feels fresh.

WhillJedi posted:
Halagad_Ventor posted:
Hey folks!

Quick update. Currently pounding through Dark Nest and Betrayal (yes, that Betrayal) in order to get Vader's Legacy as up to date as possible.


shock Betrayal! drooling Why you lucky little... this makes me very jealous
Mission accomplished!

Kidding... sort of. I was very happy with this book.

WhillJedi posted:
Anyway, I can live with a Grievous endnotes delay for now. I did, by the way, read through your Droids + the Force endnotes and I thought they were very well-written and thorough -- I'm sure I won't be dissapointed with Grievous' batch.
What do you think? So far, the Grievous endnotes have been tame, for lack of a better word. The continuity has mostly been constrained to the stuff immediately related to the character. The Lord of War coverage should be more similar in style to Droids and the Force... though I'm not sure I've ever pulled that many unrelated sources together before or will ever again.

WhillJedi posted:
As for Vader's Legacy, I really am looking forward to this one happy .
Me too. happy

Pelranius posted:
Or a deal he did to promote the Biscuit Baron after losing a bet with Baron Tagge (thus explaining why he has it in for the Tagges)
Heh heh.

The Baron does make a cameo.

Take care,
Abel

 

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WhillJedi 
Registered: Feb '06
40699_Boba Fett
Date Posted: 4/17/06 8:57pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
I'm glad that in your opinion Betrayal was a good read. Makes me even more anxious to get my hands on it... By the way, I know the article hasn't even been released yet, not to mention the web supplement, but are you by any chance planning a Vader's Legacy installment of endnotes? All your other ones have gotten positive feedback. And one more thing - are you planning to only touch on the similarities between Lumiya and Vader as cyborgs, or will you offer more insight into the nature of their Sith relationship (if you can tell us)? Thanks! happy thinking

 

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BobaMatt  14573 posts
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Date Posted: 4/18/06 4:34am Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88) - Date Edited: 4/18/06 4:39am (1 edits total) Edited By: BobaMatt
It's a page late, but I was thinking about the Darth Vader as Force Doppleganger thing, and I've got to say I prefer the explanation that Obi-Wan literally took over Luke for the duration. Two reasons:

1) As Luke is leaving Dagobah in The Empire Strikes Back, Obi-Wan makes a big to do about not being able to help Luke if he fights Vader. He says, "If you choose to face Vader, you will do it alone. I cannot interfere." Interfere how? Do what? Luke seems to understand him. Ask most people and they'll tell you Obi-Wan was telling Luke he couldn't guid him or make him stronger. Thus, the implied addendum to Obi-Wan's line is: "It was a very different situation on Mimban." And of course it was, as here Luke is rushing off to fight Vader, whereas on Mimban he had no choice.
2) Ben's last word's to Vader were, "Strike me down and I will become more powerful than you could possibly imagine." Of course, becoming a vague blue glowy thing capable of giving Luke advice isn't particularly powerful as far as a Sith is concerned. The look of horror that must have passed across Vader's face at realizing he was beaten once again by his master, the master he had killed not too long ago, beaten by his old master in the body of the boy that is probably his son wielding Anakin's lightsaber...I think it's a pretty good moment.

Ah well. That's my $0.02.

 

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Queengodess  4359 posts
Registered: Jul '00
24215_Anakin
Date Posted: 4/18/06 7:54am Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
Halagad_Ventor posted:

rhonderoo posted:
I don't know if I'm going to like Legacy if it's all about Vader's legacy and nothing about you know? Anakin Skywalker's. We had years of post-ROTJ Bantam era Vader hating by the galaxy and Luke managed to survive that. Now I know, DN tore that to hell and sunder but I was actually having a little hope for Legacy...
With a name like rhonderoo, could I dream of letting you down my dear?

Sit tight, and you might very well get your wish.


Ooooh! dancing love About time, too. Considering how well-known Anakin Skywalker was during the Clone Wars, it always confused/annoyed me that that was never really reflected in the EU (right, so the EU written before AOTC and ROTJ can't really be blamed for this, but, like rhonderoo said, DN was...argh... *pauses* *takes a deep breath* ...DN was less than satisfying. Yeah. Let's leave it at that.).

It's a pity getting hold of Insider is so hard here in Sweden. Still haven't managed to get my hands on the #85 and that short story, but I guess I will have to make an extra effort for this article.

 

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Halagad_Ventor  1278 posts
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Date Posted: 4/18/06 2:04pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
WhillJedi posted:
I'm glad that in your opinion Betrayal was a good read. Makes me even more anxious to get my hands on it... By the way, I know the article hasn't even been released yet, not to mention the web supplement, but are you by any chance planning a Vader's Legacy installment of endnotes? All your other ones have gotten positive feedback.
Time allowing, I'd love to.

WhillJedi posted:
And one more thing - are you planning to only touch on the similarities between Lumiya and Vader as cyborgs, or will you offer more insight into the nature of their Sith relationship (if you can tell us)? Thanks! happy thinking
Oh yeah, it definitely goes into their relationship, building on themes hinted at in the Emperor's Pawns.

 

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Kwenn  9850 posts
Registered: Mar '01
8059_Qui-Gon Jinn
Date Posted: 4/18/06 2:33pm Subject: RE: "Vader's Legacy": by Abel & Joe (SWI #88)
BobaMatt posted:
It's a page late, but I was thinking about the Darth Vader as Force Doppleganger thing, and I've got to say I prefer the explanation that Obi-Wan literally took over Luke for the duration. Two reasons:

1) As Luke is leaving Dagobah in The Empire Strikes Back, Obi-Wan makes a big to do about not being able to help Luke if he fights Vader. He says, "If you choose to face Vader, you will do it alone. I cannot interfere." Interfere how? Do what? Luke seems to understand him. Ask most people and they'll tell you Obi-Wan was telling Luke he couldn't guid him or make him stronger. Thus, the implied addendum to Obi-Wan's line is: "It was a very different situation on Mimban." And of course it was, as here Luke is rushing off to fight Vader, whereas on Mimban he had no choice.
2) Ben's last word's to Vader were, "Strike me down and I will become more powerful than you could possibly imagine." Of course, becoming a vague blue glowy thing capable of giving Luke advice isn't particularly powerful as far as a Sith is concerned. The look of horror that must have passed across Vader's face at realizing he was beaten once again by his master, the master he had killed not too long ago, beaten by his old master in the body of the boy that is probably his son wielding Anakin's lightsaber...I think it's a pretty good moment.

Ah well. That's my $0.02.



Sounds good, but does anyone else think that Obi-Wan basically possessing Luke's body to settle an old score with Anakin is a little....Sithly? The whole immortality thing is supposed to highlight the difference between Jedi and Sith (Jedi become one with the Force to gain power, the Sith want power during their lifetime) but a Force ghost taking over someone's body seems like a step in the wrong direction.

 

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