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Author Topic: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
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7740_Tahiri and Anakin
Crox 
Date Posted: 8/26/07 3:40pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Err, Tricky, you're history's a bit off. Desert Storm was over long before 1998.

And anyway, I'm pretty sure that the US isn't currently at war with New Zealand, India, or any Hispanic countries, so I'm really not sure why you're talking about "these times of wars we've been in".

 
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43253_Boba Fett
Tricky 
Date Posted: 8/26/07 6:11pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Eh? Then which one of those "Operation Desert (something)" were my Army reserve peoples trying to send me to the Middle East in 1998 that I was barely saved from by the end of my military career coming up in the next 6 months?

I know the US isn't currently at war with NZ, India or other hispanic countries. Here's what I said about that. I was talking about American patriotism/nationalism & propaganda to villify the enemy by villifying any peoples that look like them like for example the harrassment that illigal immigrant Mexicans are facing right now is a another unconscious byproduct of that system of mindgames. Of course most people will rebel against that line of thinking saying to themselves that we Americans are beyond those kind of petty things now cause of the PC movement or whatever, but some of you will be able to read between the lines & see the hypocrisy for what it is.

Still, Shatterpoint? Bloody good book!

 

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Date Posted: 8/26/07 6:55pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Tricky posted:
I was talking about American patriotism/nationalism & propaganda to villify the enemy by villifying any peoples that look like them like for example the harrassment that illigal immigrant Mexicans are facing right now is a another unconscious byproduct of that system of mindgames. Of course most people will rebel against that line of thinking saying to themselves that we Americans are beyond those kind of petty things now cause of the PC movement or whatever, but some of you will be able to read between the lines & see the hypocrisy for what it is.


I won't get into the politics of the crackdown on illegals being right/wrong (not the place for it), but the reason it seems like the Mexicans/Latinos are getting the worst of it is because they make up, by far, the greatest population of illegals, especially in the boarder states, and accusations of racism is something the media loves (you won't see many reports of illegal Europeans being deported because there's no La Raza or anyone screaming racism).

 

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23735_Obi-Wan Kenobi
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 Date Posted: 8/26/07 7:26pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Tricky posted:
Eh? Then which one of those "Operation Desert (something)" were my Army reserve peoples trying to send me to the Middle East in 1998 that I was barely saved from by the end of my military career coming up in the next 6 months?

I know the US isn't currently at war with NZ, India or other hispanic countries. Here's what I said about that. I was talking about American patriotism/nationalism & propaganda to villify the enemy by villifying any peoples that look like them like for example the harrassment that illigal immigrant Mexicans are facing right now is a another unconscious byproduct of that system of mindgames. Of course most people will rebel against that line of thinking saying to themselves that we Americans are beyond those kind of petty things now cause of the PC movement or whatever, but some of you will be able to read between the lines & see the hypocrisy for what it is.

Still, Shatterpoint? Bloody good book!

I'm sorry, but that reeks of the petty, race-baiting logic that says if anything bad happens to a minority, no matter how many other reasonable explanations are available, it happened because they're a minority. Mace's Padawan fell to the dark side? It's because she's brown. Mace Windu died in ROTS? It's because he's brown. Michael Vick is prosecuted for dog-fighting? It's because he's brown. OJ Simpson is accused of murder? It's because he's brown. If anyone says it's not so, they're failing to recognize the "invisible racism" that makes all white people racists at heart. Please, give me a break.

 

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 Date Posted: 8/26/07 7:50pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
What's all this? I'm sick and tired of people playing the race card on these boards, must it leak into lit as well?

I bet if you asked Stover these questions he'd eithe rlaugh or wonder what the hell you were talking about.

 

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Date Posted: 8/26/07 11:50pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Tem Morrison has absolutely no "Latino" blood, and he'd probably be surprised that you think he does.

As a side note, outside the Americas, "Hispanic" people are generally considered "white". It is in Australia, I know that. For example, Rebecca Jackson Mendoza, the lass who plays Breha Organa, is sometimes called "Asian" ir "white" or "Eurasian", but never "Hispanic", which is what she'd most likely be identified as in the US.

Additionally, the identification of people with any trace of African ancestry as "black" is a legacy of the "one drop rule" and outside of the United States, rarely followed. In Brazil, for instance, it would be highly unlikely for someone of say Halle Berry's colour to be called "black".

 

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 Date Posted: 8/27/07 12:09am Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Tem Morrison has absolutely no "Latino" blood, and he'd probably be surprised that you think he does.

Tem's a Maori, as is Jay and Daniel Logan. People would more likely confuse them to be Aussies because of their accents than Hispanics.

This thread's gone out of hand.

 

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Date Posted: 8/27/07 5:49am Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Getting back to Shatterpoint...

Most people describe this book as Apocalypse Now with lightsabers, and I love this book for that. But am I the only one here who would like to see a book that's Apocalypse Now with DC-15s? So far as I'm concerned, the standard troopers never really got their due in the various Clone Wars material published: the ARCs had Alpha and Nate, the commandos got Omega and Delta Squads, and the clone commanders got Bly and Cody (yes, I know others exist, but those were the ones who were expanded upon the most). But for the standard troopers, all I can think of is CT-6/774 from Equipment, an e-book which came with Shatterpoint's paperback edition.

Thoughts?

 

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 Date Posted: 8/27/07 9:05am Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Please return back on topic and drop the racism and immigrant discussions- that's a subject probably better suited for the Senate or Community forums.

 

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248 posts
7740_Tahiri and Anakin
Crox 
Date Posted: 8/27/07 11:01am Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
If I may just make one factual correction...

Tricky posted:
Eh? Then which one of those "Operation Desert (something)" were my Army reserve peoples trying to send me to the Middle East in 1998 that I was barely saved from by the end of my military career coming up in the next 6 months?


I don't know, but Desert Storm happened during the first George Bush's term.

 
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43253_Boba Fett
Tricky 
Date Posted: 8/27/07 1:09pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
I said that Temrera Morrison is from NZ, I knows he's not hispanic.

Anyways I apoligive about my nationalism thing, I was replying to why I thought that Depa Billiba was left in a coma & forgotten. I made some very clear points that dealt with patriotism & I never even mentioned racism at all, but the other posters in this thread just sorta went off the handle. Believe me, I know that talking about racism or pulling a race card are taboo subjects here & I won't bring those things up cause they belong in the social forums. I wish that Matt Stover would read the things that I posted about Depa & then prove me wrong by writing her into Shadows of Mindor!

 

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Date Posted: 8/27/07 1:26pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
The Hispanic thing in regards to Temuera originates from AOTC, in which a clone in one scene is played by an actor who is definitely not Temuera, and who looks Hispanic.

 

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Date Posted: 8/27/07 1:35pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
I thought Shatterpoint was one of the best books from the Clone Era

I've always liked Stover's writing and consider Traitor and ROTS brilliantly written as well.

What I really like about Shatterpoint is it takes Master Windu and turns him into a character that we can better understand. By the time I finished reading the book I felt I knew him. His Korun heritage and relationship with his former padawan all come out. The book was also much more intense than the standard swg book and I believe out of all the books in the clone era was geared more full adults then children.

How Stover gets away with writing his bloody scenes when others don't is a mystery.

There were also a great supporting cast of characters.

Overall; just a very well written book.

 

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 Date Posted: 8/27/07 3:36pm Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
I agree, Milteck, which was why I was disappointed that Traitor m,ade the list in the JC 100 books and Shatterpoint didn't.

You could describe it as existentalist, and Stover gives the EU a quite high bar to jump against. Since when would we have an actually good quality novel in the EU which is a good work in it's own right? It's almost unthinkable given what they're pumping out these days.

 

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Date Posted: 8/28/07 3:29am Subject: RE: Shatterpoint: Good lord...
Arawn_Fenn posted:
The Hispanic thing in regards to Temuera originates from AOTC, in which a clone in one scene is played by an actor who is definitely not Temuera, and who looks Hispanic.

Bodie Taylor, the guy you're thinking of, is also from New Zealand.

 

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