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Topic:
The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue (Spoilers Allowed) (Announced!)
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QuentinGeorge
Registered:
Dec '03
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 4:42pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
- Date Edited:
11/9/07 4:43pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
QuentinGeorge
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Fact: Reboot should be considered only if everything is rebooted. From scratch, no Thrawn Trilogy, no KJA series, nothing. And then replaced with something entirely different: No Jacen, Jaina, Anakin Solo or Ben Skywalker, no Talon Karrde, no Thrawn, no Chiss...
You can't just go "oh, lets forget the NJO, let's forget the LOTF..." nope, not going to happen.
If NJO goes, what about prequel novels that reference it, such as Rogue Planet, Shatterpoint and Outbound Flight? Are they put down the memory hole too?
Various sourcebooks? If NJO goes, what does that do to the Legacy comics?
And finally, reboots should never be done to satisfy the personal vanity of fans.
Could you give some examples of canon tales stories that were made Infinities after the fact and then overwritten with new stories in their place?
There is none. Nada, nicks. Things only go from Infinities to canon, not the other way. Hell, look at all the effort they went to to keep Boba Fett's "Jaster Mereel" background in continuity.
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Lord_Riven
Registered:
Nov '01
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 4:42pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
- Date Edited:
11/9/07 4:45pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Lord_Riven
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julioangelortiz posted:
I don't get all the hate for NJO and onward. That's the stuff that got me into the EU.
Far be it for me to say, there's a lot of hate for NJO because it was different to Bantam. Yes, Bantam was getting stale but personally for me NJO was a great idea but not so very well executed by the authors. For them to then do a complete backflip in Dark Nest and LOTF well, it is sufficient to say that I was personally very disappointed.
Dark Nest also had the 'bugs' which were just plain annoying.
Then there's the whole LOTF = Prequel Trilogy complaint. In a way, it seems to look very obvious that LOTF is a sort of a rehash of the Prequel Trilogy.
For others it's that Luke has just been written increasingly badly when he should be in the prime of his Jedi life. (that's what the Save our Skywalker thread originally was on about) Instead we have had to sit through an increasingly inactive and indecisive Luke to the point where his other half, Mara doesn't really seem to trust him anymore. That was just an entirely wrong direction.
For some, it's Karen Traviss, someone who has stated that she ain't so hot about Jedi writing a story about Luke's order which was supposed to be triumphant over the problems of the Old Jedi Order from the Prequels. And her obsession with Fett and Mando's being 'good' guys. Personally, I hope that Revelation is the last we see of Fett cos' his story is sort of finished.
Then there was the kinslaying Jacen. And the anger over breaking up Luke/Mara and no siblings for Ben. There's also the whole Ben is a lonely loser with no friends complaint too.
For me personally it was the whole Vergere was a Sith retcon which in my mind was just touching something that didn't need to be fixed. It was obvious that Vergere would be affected by her experience of 50 years with the Vong in some way and for her to impart some of her 'wisdom' on Jacen without retconning her as a Sith. It just was unnecessarily ruining an enigmatic character. It would have been better had she stayed gray (as a ex-Jedi) rather than black (as a Sith)
julioangelortiz posted:
I read the Thrawn trilogy, and while it was great, I haven't found too much else in the Bantam era of interest. I liked NJO because it was dark, gritty, and things of consequence actually happened. Imagine that.
Read the X-Wing series. One of the very best set of Star Wars novels ever. And it doesn't have a lot of the Big 3 in it either. And yet it is quite popular and well-loved. I haven't met many people here who have many negative things to say about X-Wing.
You like the NJO because it was dark, gritty. A lot of people didn't like it because of that. If I wanted dark and gritty I just had to look at the world around me. Star Wars was an escape from reality.
And there will be no reboot - just messy soap-opera-style retcons
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bkbva
Registered:
Nov '05
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 5:04pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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Lord_Riven posted:
If I wanted dark and gritty I just had to look at the world around me. Star Wars was an escape from reality.
Which is why I'm not going to be reading any novels set post-LOTF. I think that my heroes have had to endure far more pain and suffering than any character should face. There's no ending they can write to LOTF that in my mind can possibly be considered uplifting, so why should I care what happens next?
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Trip
Registered:
Dec '03
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 5:19pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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Riven posted:
I haven't met many people here who have many negative things to say about X-Wing.
The X-Wing novels are poopy.
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Ulicus
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 6:30pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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Troy's getting jealous of Stackpole and Allston it seems....
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I think the whole point of KotOR II was that Kreia realised she was in a work of fiction
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ChildOfWinds
Registered:
Apr '01
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:04pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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crazythorn
If you reboot NJO, you mess with all the Vong references in Legacy...
That's fine with me. I don't like Legacy very much either. It's far too close to LotF in the timeline.
StateOfLoveAndTrust
Could you give some examples of canon tales stories that were made Infinities after the fact and then overwritten with new stories in their place?
I don't know about new stories written in their place, but, as I said, at least some of the Tales books are considered Infinities. Just as an example, I especially liked "Simple Tricks", which was a short story in Tales of the New Republic. It's about Kyp, and I was disappointed that now it's not canon.
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Havac
Title: Lit Mod of War
Registered:
Sep '05
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:06pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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First thing, Tales is a comic anthology, originally released under the Infinities label with some stories subsequently being brought into canon.
Second thing, Simple Tricks, wonderful story that it is, is still canon.
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ChildOfWinds
Registered:
Apr '01
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:11pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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Havac
Second thing, Simple Tricks, wonderful story that it is, is still canon.
It IS??? But I was told that most of the Tales BOOKS of short stories are now Infinities, and Simple Tricks is in one of those Tales books. So how can it still be canon if the rest of the book is not?
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QuentinGeorge
Registered:
Dec '03
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:14pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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You are confusing Tales (ie, the comic series released by Dark Horse) and Tales (books from Bantam). The books are full of 100% canon stories. The comics are different.
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StateOfLoveAndTrust
Registered:
Nov '01
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:19pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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ChildOfWinds posted:
But I was told that most of the Tales BOOKS of short stories are now Infinities
And I was told Pearl Harbor wasn't a terrible movie. Doesn't make it true.
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ATimson
Registered:
Nov '03
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:22pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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ChildOfWinds posted:
It IS??? But I was told that most of the Tales BOOKS of short stories are now Infinities, and Simple Tricks is in one of those Tales books. So how can it still be canon if the rest of the book is not?
The Tales of the... anthologies of short stories have been, are, and will be canon.
It's the Star Wars: Tales anthologies of comics that weren't, generally aren't, and probably won't be canon.
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Rouge77
Registered:
May '05
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 8:50pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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Several of the comic Tales have become canon and the number of the stories in them that are canon is rather likely, I guess, to increase in the future.
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Ris_jSarek
Registered:
Feb '05
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Date Posted:
11/9/07 9:30pm
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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ATimson posted:
It's the Star Wars: Tales anthologies of comics that weren't, generally aren't, and probably won't be canon.
Even most of the Tales comics are canon. Lelend Chee had this to say: "Consider everything that's not completely outrageous or intentionally comic as S-canon. If it's referenced in another non-Tales source, then elevate it to C-canon."
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SuperWatto
Registered:
Sep '00
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Date Posted:
11/10/07 1:27am
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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In other words: you can only know if a Tale is canon if you know ALL sources.
That's messed up.
This is one of my problems with current EU: it's so messed up you have to really be engrained in it to make sense of it. Another problem is the lack of visuals. To me, Star Wars is as much about cool visuals as about good stories, a facet DR completely neglects. The Bantam books didn't have that problem since they largely stuck to the characters we know.
The DR EU is a massive undertaking to bring on a new generation. But without good visuals, the new crop is never going to convincingly take the reins from the big 3. It's just one big failed experiment. And now Luke needs to save the galaxy again at 60.
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QuentinGeorge
Registered:
Dec '03
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Date Posted:
11/10/07 1:46am
Subject:
RE: The next Novel Contract - Updates from Sue
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In other words: you can only know if a Tale is canon if you know ALL sources.
No. Read it again. If it's not really wacky or intentionally comic, it's canon.
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