Jedi Ben posted: * Because they were failures.
Jedi Ben posted: * Ah but is? He's been off-screen for a long time in Legacy, which wouldn't be the case if he were what you assert him to be. Even if he does occupy a higher position than Wolf is that a reflection of true ability or of skill at Jedi politics? There's always those who rise higher despite lacking skill because they know how to play games.
ChildOfWinds posted: Lord_Riven Jon answered that one in another thread when I posed the question, indirectly. He's basically said flat out that they don't want to step on DR's toes by using Lowie, Ben or Allana. So are you saying that they may then be alive? But what about the children and grandchildren of Ben? Certainly Cade would know of them if they were still alive. That, plus the fact that Cade is referred to as the "Last Skywalker" leads me to believe that all of Luke's descendants, at least, are dead except for Cade. And even if they didn't want to "step on DR's toes (which they already have just by making Legacy so close to LotF), they still could have used a less central Jedi of Luke's era or a child of one of them (a child of Kam and Tionne, for example) instead of a prequel Jedi for the leader of the Jedi in the Legacy era. Rigil_Kent : Whew. I was afraid I was the only one who loathed Veitch's take on Skywalker. Nope! You're definitely NOT the only one! You can ask JB! I've been ranting about DE for YEARS. I agree that DE was a "nightmare" and that it made NO sense after TLC. Luke was certainly not the cold, unfeeling character at the end of TLC that he was at the beginning of DE, and DE was supposed to take place just DAYS after TLC. Not only did the return of Palpatine render Vader's self-sacrifice at the end of Endor irrelevant, it made the whole "balance of the Force" unbalanced again just a few years later. Plus, it made Luke into a liar too, as he said at the end of RotJ that he would never join the Emperor, yet in DE, he does just that. Now I know Luke only pretended to join the Emperor, but he took an awful risk, one he nearly lost. It was a really stupid decision on Luke's part. Dawud786 It's not until later that Luke thinks of this being the very reason that Anakin Skywalker turned into Darth Vader: to conquer the dark side and the Sith from within. Of course, this is both Luke rationalizing his own gradual descent into darkness and rationalizing Anakin's fall. I'm one who doesn't believe that Luke actually fell to the darkside in DE, though he was certainly foolish to think he could defeat the darkside from within, and he didn't act like himself. Luke was like an undercover agent in DE, doing his best to defeat the Emperor and his Forces, even sabotaging Imperial vehicles and sending the Alliance Imperial codes. While he did use the darkside power of Doppleganger, Luke didn't really do evil deeds. I don't feel that Leia "redeemed" Luke, because I don't think Luke needed redemption. I think it was more that Leia "rescued" Luke in that she gave him hope again. Luke seemed to despair that he would ever be able to defeat Palpatine or get away from him, but by telling him that she had foreseen that Luke would train her children, it renewed Luke's hope and confidence. That was all it took to get him to duel and defeat the Emperor. Then Luke and Leia beat the Emperor and his Force storm with the Light. As for TLC... you've got to bear in mind that DE and TTT were being written concurrently with each other and supposedly Zahn hated the idea of DE and didn't want to have to reference it in his story. I'm aware of that, and I'm with Zahn. DE never should have been referenced in the novels. Until very recently, the events of the Marvel comics were never referenced in the novels. I don't understand why DE was either. DE negates much of RotJ, and no EU work should do that, in my opinion. DE should be an Infinities story. I was just flipping through both the DE and DEII/EE TPBs.... I have to say, I think that whole Luke went because he wondered what attracted Vader to the dark side thing is complete and total fanon. Maybe KJA or someone else wrote that in a novel after DE, but it's not in DE. Well, it IS in my copy of DE. When Luke is talking to Leia, he says, "But I had to do it, Leia. I had to know my father... I had to know why he chose the dark side." [/i]
Jedi Ben posted: Nice one Dawud. Thing is, on the one hand, Luke being afraid of the dark side makes perfect sense because of what he knows of it, but being afraid to the point of paralysis doesn't and the only way to square that circle is your solution: It was forgotten. Whenever anyone goes off at Luke on the: What do you know of the dark side? All Luke needs to do is but look at them before dropping the proverbial nuke on them: You ever meet the Emperor? Everything I know of the dark side I learnt from him, now your point is? Yet, as you say, it's all forgotten. I find the thread that talks of Luke's ability to look into the future and how it is done in Invincible amusing, for Luke had the ability established by DE!
Jedi Ben posted:Yet, as you say, it's all forgotten. I find the thread that talks of Luke's ability to look into the future and how it is done in Invincible amusing, for Luke had the ability established by DE!
