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Topic:
Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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Lord_Hydronium
Registered:
Jun '02
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Date Posted:
6/8 8:32pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
- Date Edited:
6/8 8:34pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Lord_Hydronium
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SithStarSlayer posted:
"I had a specific origin in mind... and he was intended as the Exile’s other half..."
Again, it's in a figurative sense. Taking snippets out of context doesn't tell you anything; look at the rest of the quote.
"Nihilus’ exact identity is never specified in K2 - I had a specific origin in mind, but not a name, if that makes sense..."
He didn't have a name in mind. Not, "Nihilus didn't have a name because he was literally a chunk of the Exile." Avellone had an origin in mind, but didn't have any particular name in mind. Nihilus clearly had a name in-universe.
"As much as Nihilus embraced the Dark Side’s Force talent of consuming force sensitives (and other life, such as the mass Mandalorian slaughter), the Exile took the higher ground and cut himself off from the pull of such power."
Nihilus went one way, the Exile went another. Notice how it doesn't say Nihilus went that way because the Exile went another. They're independent people, going different directions. Here it is again, in that "other half" part:
"...and he was intended as the Exile’s other half, one that took a more self-destructive path rather than denying the Force during that battle that ended the Mandalorian Wars."
Again, it is phrased that Nihilus made a choice to go that way. He took a different path, and that's what makes him the "other half" to the Exile: rather than forsake the Force and stay in the light, he submitted utterly to the dark side and used his wound to feed.
And this isn't including what the game says about who he used to be.
"He... if he can truly be called a man any longer... is one of the dark lords that pursues you."
After unmasking the dead Nihilus: "A man, nothing more."
There's really nothing in that quote, or the game, or anywhere that suggests that the Exile was somehow literally ripped in two to make Nihilus.
SithStarSlayer posted:
Except Avelone did mean Nihilus was the result of the Exhile's separation from the Force. Nihilus was the walking void, a literal wound in the Force... the Exhile's wound.
Wait, what? The Exile was her wound in the Force. It was why she gained power from her journeys and her companions.
ARC-77 posted:
What I'm getting is that Avelone meant the same thing that happened to the Exile happened to Nihilus. Nihilus went the other direction of the Exile, though, and tried insatiably to fill that wound. The Exile was closed of from the Force instead.
Absolutely.
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And so ad infinitum.
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sithreaper
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
6/9 2:26am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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My Perfectly Plausible Theory
Haazens plot is foiled by the jedi covenant, he flees and eventual begins training at the Sith academy on Korriban.
Zayne eventually succeeds in exposing the Covenant, with either Lucien Draay or Q'Anilia confessing all.
Krynda flees, eventually she encounters Darth Revan and becomes Darth Traya head of the sith academy of Malachor V.
Zayne is involved in the battle of Malachor V, an event that turns him into the destroyer of worlds Darth Nihilus.
Haazen now known as Darth Sion survives the civil war on Korriban and makes his way to Malachor V
Nihilus and Sion (who are never truly in alliance they just arrive with the same intention) then have a little chat with the woman who ruined both of their lives.
Traya flees, changes her name to Kreia and begins manipulating the Jedi Exile.
Also it wouldn’t surprise me if the exile is Jarael. Perhaps during the course of her adventures she begins training in the ways of the force, then abandons her training to join Alek and Zayne at Malachor V. This would also work brilliantly with her been Zaynes (Nihilus) polar opposite.
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SithStarSlayer
Registered:
Oct '03
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Date Posted:
6/9 3:30am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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Also it wouldn’t surprise me if the exile is Jarael. Perhaps during the course of her adventures she begins training in the ways of the force, then abandons her training to join Alek and Zayne at Malachor V. This would also work brilliantly with her been Zaynes (Nihilus) polar opposite.
I could live with that.
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Foolish men mistake transitory semblance for eternal fact
Practice makes perfect, so be careful what you practice
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cs47
Registered:
Nov '07
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Date Posted:
6/9 4:47am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
- Date Edited:
6/9 4:54am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
cs47
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I disagree. In my opinion you´ve left out a very good candidate to become Sion: Lucien. And a good one to become Nihilus: Haazen. By the way, if you´re giving weight to some prophecies to guess who´s going to become Darth Nihilus....well, right now the prophecies aren´t working quite well (or are being misinterpreted)...  The fact that Sion has suffered similar wounds to that of Haazen makes the thing (if Lucien becomes him, that is) appropiate in a way, he´ll end up more or less the same way that person he despises.
And, on a side note, the Exile is Human...not an Arkanian offshot. And to be in Malachor V as a Jedi knight (and being important there) and already having an apprentice, she should be already in the order and well established within, i think.
What do i think about how the whole Covenant thing will end? Well, i imagine that there are some probabilites that Zayne gets his name cleared. Afterwards, probably he´ll be knighted and perhaps Jarael wil be his apprentice (and of course, there will be more to them, but it´s just not pertinent here). On the other hand, i wouldn´t feel particularly surprised if most of the credit of revealing the Covenant´s actions would go to Alek, and the Revanchists might well use all the fuss to further their ends by boosting Alek´s reputation among the ranks of the Order. All while Jarael and Zayne disappear discretly from the public light and start some other mission.
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goraq
Registered:
May '08
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Date Posted:
6/9 6:07am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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I think Sion is possibly Uthar
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Uthar
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Sion
Sion was at Korriban,when the Sith turned on each other.
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Oissan
Title: FanForce CR
GSFF North
Registered:
Mar '01
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Date Posted:
6/9 6:59am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
- Date Edited:
6/9 7:06am (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Oissan
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sithreaper posted:
Haazen now known as Darth Sion survives the civil war on Korriban and makes his way to Malachor V
Haazen doesn't look like Sion, Sion has a real shoulder and an eye that is damaged, Haazen does not have a real shoulder nor is his right eye human. And that's disregardings the legs, which appear to be real for Sion and robotic for Haazen.
Apart from that, Haazen is way too old to be Sion.
Jarael can't be the Exile either. They went out of their way to hide what Revan looks like, because everyone has his/her own Revan. They wouldn't change that for the Exile and turn another character into him/her.
Besides, the Exile was an average Jedi who was about to take on an apprentice, Jarael has no force-training at all. How could someone who is way too old to start regular Jedi-training suddenly turn into a Jedi Knight from one moment to the other?
Jarael is supposed to be something special, both Alek and Rohlan say that, plus her genetics are not like they are expected to be, that doesn't fit to a Jedi who was as average as it gets (see the dialog between Vandar and Vrook in TSL).
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KnightDawg
Registered:
Nov '07
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Date Posted:
6/9 7:00am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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sithreaper posted:
Haazen now known as Darth Sion survives the civil war on Korriban and makes his way to Malachor V
Darth Sion was NOT a cyborg though.....therefore Haazen is a "red herring". End of discussion. 
Jedi Master Lu(Sion) becoming Darth Sion makes the most logical sense as long as he ends up on Korriban when the Sith turn on each other.
Let's finally bury this whole "Haazen is Darth Sion" silly rumor once and for all. Darth Sion is obvisouly somebody else.
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QuinineVos
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
6/9 9:27am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
- Date Edited:
6/9 9:31am (2 edits total)
Edited By:
QuinineVos
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Zorrixor posted:
The one thing I don't get... what's up with the cow's skull? 
See page 15 of the most recent issue, # 29. Perhaps it's "The Helm of Dathka Grausch," although it looks slightly different in the nose. The droid says that the helm amplifies "the wearer's abilities on scales six and eight." Seems to be a sith relic that amplifies the force powers of its wielder.
P.S: I'm blatantly trying to re-hijack this thread back from the gamers!
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Zorrixor
Registered:
Sep '04
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Date Posted:
6/9 9:42am
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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QuinineVos posted:
Zorrixor posted:
The one thing I don't get... what's up with the cow's skull?
See page 15 of the most recent issue, # 29. Perhaps it's "The Helm of Dathka Grausch," although it looks slightly different in the nose. The droid says that the helm amplifies "the wearer's abilities on scales six and eight." Seems to be a sith relic that amplifies the force powers of its wielder.
P.S: I'm blatantly trying to re-hijack this thread back from the gamers!
Yeah, I suggested that back on the second page of this thread, it strikes me as possible. They droid mentioned it amplified the power of the sword they were keeping on Coruscant, so it seems feasible the helm may be sent back to Coruscant to investigate whether it does indeed amplify the power of the sword.
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
6/9 4:22pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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goraq posted:
I think Sion is possibly Uthar
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Uthar
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Sion
Sion was at Korriban,when the Sith turned on each other.
Uthar was killed in KOTOR 1, Sion is in KOTOR 2.
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"I'm a dude playing a dude disguised as another dude." - Kirk Lazarus
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QuinineVos
Registered:
Jun '05
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Date Posted:
6/9 8:56pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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Zorrixor posted:
QuinineVos posted:
Zorrixor posted:
The one thing I don't get... what's up with the cow's skull?
See page 15 of the most recent issue, # 29. Perhaps it's "The Helm of Dathka Grausch," although it looks slightly different in the nose. The droid says that the helm amplifies "the wearer's abilities on scales six and eight." Seems to be a sith relic that amplifies the force powers of its wielder.
P.S: I'm blatantly trying to re-hijack this thread back from the gamers!
Yeah, I suggested that back on the second page of this thread, it strikes me as possible. They droid mentioned it amplified the power of the sword they were keeping on Coruscant, so it seems feasible the helm may be sent back to Coruscant to investigate whether it does indeed amplify the power of the sword.
Ah, sorry, I missed your follow-up in my wading through this mass of identity speculation! 
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Charlemagne19
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
6/9 11:27pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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Arawn_Fenn posted:
goraq posted:
I think Sion is possibly Uthar
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Uthar
http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Darth_Sion
Sion was at Korriban,when the Sith turned on each other.
Uthar was killed in KOTOR 1, Sion is in KOTOR 2.
Isn't, unlike with any other character in KOTOR, death not really a problem with Sion?
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
6/11 7:29pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
- Date Edited:
6/11 7:29pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Arawn_Fenn
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Yes, but death was certainly a problem for Uthar. Revan killed him good.
-----signature-----
The world will look up and shout, "Save us." And I'll whisper: "No". - Rorschach
"I'm a dude playing a dude disguised as another dude." - Kirk Lazarus
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Lord_Hydronium
Registered:
Jun '02
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Date Posted:
6/11 8:39pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
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Not necessarily. As far as I know, there's no canonical fate for Uthar.
-----signature-----
Great midis have little midis
Swimming round inside 'em
And little midis have lesser midis
And so ad infinitum.
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cbagmjg
Registered:
Jul '06
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Date Posted:
6/12 1:41pm
Subject:
RE: Knights of the Old Republic 33: Vindication Part 2
- Date Edited:
6/12 1:46pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
cbagmjg
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Uthar's a weak candidate for Sion. I think with a female Exile you almost feel sorry for him, like for instance, having a mother who cared more about seers than her own flesh and blood.
And here's a theory a lot of people would hate, but here it goes...Haazen is not only a precursor to Lucien being Sion, but Zayne being Nihilus. Both are considered failed padawans, so there's a link. Zayne is considered a mediocre Jedi(at best), like the Exile. They both have the ability to inspire others, but since the Exile is female that rules Zayne out. They both were at Serroco, not to mention wherever Zayne goes, destuction follows whether he's to blame or not. And I could see a Vader/Obi-Wan connection(not exact) with Zayne and Lucien as Sith...
"The circle is now complete. When I left you I was but the learner-Now I am the Master!"
But yes, I feel Haazen is very much a precursor to at least Lucien/Sion and very much a comic book villain, not a game villain. I feel the darkhorse team is smart enough to realize the Lord of Pain isn't half cyborg. That totally defeats the purpose of Sion being able to hold his body together, especially since we've seen him with an organic shoulder post KOTOR comics.
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