Author Topic: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
DarthStymi  468 posts
Registered: Jan '02
49037_Imperial Commando (80409)
Date Posted: 10/7/08 6:03am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
THRAWN007 posted:


Wasn't the "passing of the torch" supposed to be the theme of both NJO and LotF? This is made difficult that the next generation is now down to....well, just Ben at this point.




Ben, Jaina, Zekk, Tenel Ka, and Tahiri also spring to mind (and I'm sure there are more I'm forgetting).

Plus there are other younger Jedi that have been mentioned who have yet to be developed, such as Valin Horn and Saba's son (forgot his name).

 

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Jeff_Ferguson  1761 posts
Registered: May '06
8056_C-3PO and R2-D2
Date Posted: 10/7/08 8:39am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Earthknight posted:
Who thinks the villain for this series will be another Caedite? I do.


Oh yeah... I haven't even considered who the villain will be yet. Uh... the threat to the Force that's discovered in Millennium Falcon? Of course, my first choice would be the terrors in the Unknown Regions, with Baron Fel and the Empire of the Hand leading the fight, but if I were writing the EU, Malinza Thanas would be one of the main characters too... whistling As it is, I'm not one of those fans who gets mad when the EU doesn't go exactly the way they want it to. But I do hope that there's an actual enemy, rather than just Han, Leia, & Co. having internal strife with Daala.

 

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DarthStymi  468 posts
Registered: Jan '02
49037_Imperial Commando (80409)
Date Posted: 10/7/08 8:46am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Earthknight posted:
As it is, I'm not one of those fans who gets mad when the EU doesn't go exactly the way they want it to.


At least you admit it peace

It would be cool to see a return of the Empire of the Hand.

Also...I predict they will pull a Dallas, and Leia will wake up and the whole Caedus thing will have been a bad dream worried

 

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DocRevan  160 posts
Registered: May '08
40336_Luke Skywalker
Date Posted: 10/7/08 9:21am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread - Date Edited: 10/7/08 9:21am (1 edits total) Edited By: DocRevan
Error post. Move along.

 

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fanboyskywalker  1437 posts
Registered: Apr '08
51667_Anakin Skywalker (130102)
Date Posted: 10/7/08 9:43am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
NelanisGhost posted:
THRAWN007 posted:
I wonder if Ben Skywalker will become a Jedi Master and take on an apprentice in FOTJ or at the end of FOTJ. And will Ben get a girl in FOTJ? The future Mrs.Ben Skywalker?? And I still do hope that Luke and Ben will go to the Unknown Regions perhaps to learn not only what made Jacen dark but encouter a lost group of Jedis from the Old Jedi Order hiding from Palapatine's Order 66.


A 16 YO Jedi master? talk_hand raised_brow rolling_eyes

I think not. Ben isn't really a Jedi in my eyes, but of course Luke will nepotize him to death. I hate that.

Ben hasn't even ever gone to SCHOOL, that I can see, and has never trained as a Jedi. He trained as a thug with Jacen. He's never spent a New York minute at the Academy learning anything. I don't think he's all wise because he is stoic. Silence doesn't equal genius. That doesn't cut it for me. He didn't even use the force until he was eight. Only six years, so far. And he was a bratty 8 YO, not serious like the Solo kids, or other Jedi, he was a video game playing child. A child. I don't find his development believable. Just because your parent dies it doesn't make a you a sage overnight.

Just, PLEASE! I do hope Ben gets to live a full life, and he has much to learn out from under his dad's wings. HGe really should go off by himself for a year and just do nothing but learn the academics and lessons of the force and find a girl when he's 25 and that he hasn't known since kindergarten. He should have some normalcy. I can't relate to the character very well, because he's had such weird progression.


And yet Ben rose above to be a Jedi like his father before him at the end of Invincible. School can't teach you everything. Ben's got street smarts.

Also, Luke's path to Jedi master also took an unusual route. And let's not forget the most important thing... Skywalker blood.

 

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fanboyskywalker  1437 posts
Registered: Apr '08
51667_Anakin Skywalker (130102)
Date Posted: 10/7/08 9:47am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Psychological warfare doesn't last 9 books.

I saw enough psychological warfare in LOTF.

Don't forget about Daala's super weapons.

 

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Earthknight  3654 posts
Registered: Oct '02
46344_Rex (CC-7567) (3161)
Date Posted: 10/8/08 7:02pm Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread - Date Edited: 10/8/08 7:04pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Earthknight
You know what would be funny. If Luke and Ben went on this quest, found a bearded hermit who looked like Moses, and he turned out to be the real Jacen Solo. Yes, I wouldn't mind if it was retconned that the Jacen that came back from the five year journey was actually Jaacen. It would also explain the madness since a side effect from certain cloning methods is madness.

 

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marmkid  2667 posts
Registered: Apr '01
Date Posted: 10/9/08 7:08am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Earthknight posted:
You know what would be funny. If Luke and Ben went on this quest, found a bearded hermit who looked like Moses, and he turned out to be the real Jacen Solo. Yes, I wouldn't mind if it was retconned that the Jacen that came back from the five year journey was actually Jaacen. It would also explain the madness since a side effect from certain cloning methods is madness.


i wouldnt have minded if this happened in LotF
like if Lumiya had attempted to recruit Jacen while he was on his force journey, but he refused and then she overpowered him and held him captive while her clone of him went back and tried to take over the galaxy

we got too much POV from Jacen though for this to happen now
plus, the whole DN would need to be thrown away

its a shame, it seems there are so many other story possibilities that are just as interesting, if not more so, that could have come from Jacen going off on his force journey and coming back with ambiguous morals

 

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Master-Chief-Kenobi  596 posts
Registered: Jun '07
44403_Cade Skywalker
Date Posted: 10/9/08 9:35am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
marmkid posted:
Earthknight posted:
You know what would be funny. If Luke and Ben went on this quest, found a bearded hermit who looked like Moses, and he turned out to be the real Jacen Solo. Yes, I wouldn't mind if it was retconned that the Jacen that came back from the five year journey was actually Jaacen. It would also explain the madness since a side effect from certain cloning methods is madness.


i wouldnt have minded if this happened in LotF
like if Lumiya had attempted to recruit Jacen while he was on his force journey, but he refused and then she overpowered him and held him captive while her clone of him went back and tried to take over the galaxy

we got too much POV from Jacen though for this to happen now
plus, the whole DN would need to be thrown away


Not nessarilly...what if Clone Jacen...didn't know he was a a clone? Side effect of the same clone maddness Joruus C'baoth suffered from in Heir to the empire?

 

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fanboyskywalker  1437 posts
Registered: Apr '08
51667_Anakin Skywalker (130102)
Date Posted: 10/9/08 9:41am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Master-Chief-Kenobi posted:
marmkid posted:
Earthknight posted:
You know what would be funny. If Luke and Ben went on this quest, found a bearded hermit who looked like Moses, and he turned out to be the real Jacen Solo. Yes, I wouldn't mind if it was retconned that the Jacen that came back from the five year journey was actually Jaacen. It would also explain the madness since a side effect from certain cloning methods is madness.


i wouldnt have minded if this happened in LotF
like if Lumiya had attempted to recruit Jacen while he was on his force journey, but he refused and then she overpowered him and held him captive while her clone of him went back and tried to take over the galaxy

we got too much POV from Jacen though for this to happen now
plus, the whole DN would need to be thrown away


Not nessarilly...what if Clone Jacen...didn't know he was a a clone? Side effect of the same clone maddness Joruus C'baoth suffered from in Heir to the empire?


As much as I hate that Jacen is dead and want him back... the villain Jacen that Denning gave us in Invincible was so badass that even that Jacen would be better than no Jacen... this idea of a clone Jacen would ruin SW EU, IMO. Also, been there, done that with C'Baoth.

But, yeah, 9 books of an introspective, find the Force again plot... no way. There will be a major conflict... and expect it to deal with the unknown regions. It won't be the whole galaxy at war like in LOTF, but more like the known galaxy dealing with this crisis, with radical leadership with Daala and the Jedi and Jag caught up in it with moral questions and Daala turning against them.

 

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marmkid  2667 posts
Registered: Apr '01
Date Posted: 10/9/08 9:51am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Master-Chief-Kenobi posted:

Not nessarilly...what if Clone Jacen...didn't know he was a a clone? Side effect of the same clone maddness Joruus C'baoth suffered from in Heir to the empire?


i can see the clone Jacen not knowing he was a clone, though it would be too similar to C'baoth i think

my problem with it is that if this Jacen was a clone, Luke and Jaina especially would have felt something different about him
sure, they felt him sliding into darkness, but no indication about anything else

again
if they did that during LotF, it might have worked out
but to do it later, it is just too obviously a retcon, and one that doesnt necessarily make anything better


also
that would mean Allana is a clone Jacen daughter?
that just gets weird

If DN didnt happen, maybe it could be fit together

 

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Earthknight  3654 posts
Registered: Oct '02
46344_Rex (CC-7567) (3161)
Date Posted: 10/9/08 10:07am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
They kind of did feel something different and noticed he changed a little. And in characterization the change is pretty stunning. It's like a whole different person which is where the clone Jacen idea comes into play. He may look like Jacen, may think he's Jacen, but he is totally different. While the POV suggest that it's Jacen, it also suggest that it could also be clone madness. I mean if we had got the same style of POV with C Baoth we would probably think it's the real C'Baoth.

 

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marmkid  2667 posts
Registered: Apr '01
Date Posted: 10/9/08 10:41am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Earthknight posted:
They kind of did feel something different and noticed he changed a little. And in characterization the change is pretty stunning. It's like a whole different person which is where the clone Jacen idea comes into play. He may look like Jacen, may think he's Jacen, but he is totally different. While the POV suggest that it's Jacen, it also suggest that it could also be clone madness. I mean if we had got the same style of POV with C Baoth we would probably think it's the real C'Baoth.



if done very carefully, i suppose you are right, it could all fit
i dont know if i trust the current group to do this without making it look and feel like a completely obvious retcon though

and to be honest
i dont mind Jacen turning into a Sith Lord
it fits his charactor perfectly to me, even him coming back after his trip and seeming different
so i am not sure this is something that is even needed

 

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Earthknight  3654 posts
Registered: Oct '02
46344_Rex (CC-7567) (3161)
Date Posted: 10/9/08 11:32am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Actually it doesn't fit. His personality diffrences in NJO and LotF are like night and day. Caedus didn't even act like Post Traitor Jacen. It was like a totally different person entirely. And I think it was. A psychotic mass murdering clone who thought he was the real thing and did everything to save his daughter except that the clone madness just totally took over. Caedus and his lust to control identically mirrors C'Baoth's control lust. If written right, Caedus could easily be retconned into being a clone. And I'd believe it. It would be the one retcon that would be very believable and still make Caedus come out looking like a good villain( especially since he corrupted everyone in the galaxy).

 

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marmkid  2667 posts
Registered: Apr '01
Date Posted: 10/9/08 11:44am Subject: RE: Fate of the Jedi (9 Hardcover Series) General Discussion Thread
Earthknight posted:
Actually it doesn't fit. His personality diffrences in NJO and LotF are like night and day. Caedus didn't even act like Post Traitor Jacen. It was like a totally different person entirely. And I think it was. A psychotic mass murdering clone who thought he was the real thing and did everything to save his daughter except that the clone madness just totally took over. Caedus and his lust to control identically mirrors C'Baoth's control lust. If written right, Caedus could easily be retconned into being a clone. And I'd believe it. It would be the one retcon that would be very believable and still make Caedus come out looking like a good villain( especially since he corrupted everyone in the galaxy).


to you it doesnt fit
to me it does
its a difference of opinion, thats all
i'm entitled to mine, you are entitled to yours
to you it was a totally different person entirely
he also was pushing 30 years old
you are different at that age than you were at 18


Jacen in the NJO was incredibly arrogant, especially post Traitor
he changed his beliefs of the force and the jedi pretty easily in Traitor
its not unbelievable to me for him to change them again in Betrayal, it actually fits better for him than any other jedi out there

he was so arrogant at the end of the NJO that after the galaxy had just been through a devestating war, which ended with the galaxy needing a major rebuilding effort by everyone, he goes off on his own "personal force journey"
even then he put his own "needs" ahead of others

and why do we want a mirror charactor of C'baoth so bad?
Caedus at least was an attempt at an original bad guy
i think we need to move forward with the story, and not worry about retconning every little thing

 

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