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Topic:
The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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PaducahRebel
Registered:
Feb '06
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Date Posted:
10/10 9:06am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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MercenaryAce posted:
All of the boys with girls get married, oh happy day.
Except for the guy who's girl died....
Just nitpicking.
No, they did get married, via text message. And he was happy. Sure, the aftermath wasn't happy, but that has nothing to do with the marriage. I think two of the "weddings" could have been left out. Obviously Dar and Etain needed that extra bit to break your heart, and I think Fi and Parja's commitment helped him take that last step back into being a whole person, but the other two seemed tacked on.
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Dash_Magnum
Registered:
Sep '08
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Date Posted:
10/10 9:08am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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MercenaryAce posted:
Revan is the exception to the incompetence rule and all Jedi are uncaring bastarves.
Bizarrely, that might work.
Considering they did all go to the darkside and even before that they were quite ruthless in the Mando Wars..yeah..it would work...though I wonder how she would portray the Mandos frequent and willful genocides.
"We had to glass the surface of the planet in order to save it's inhabitants...save them from themselves" 
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PaducahRebel
Registered:
Feb '06
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Date Posted:
10/10 9:10am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Master_Keralys posted:
I'd argue it was plenty tragic... just not in the right way. Tragic in the sense that it showed the character as finally becoming utterly subsumed under Kal's brainwashing, and little else.
I disagree. If she was barinwashed into being Kal's little puppet (or puppy), I think she would have, you know, obeyed his orders and stayed where she was to wait for a pickup. Conversely, if she was a free-thinking, independent, skilled Jedi, she would have avoided that crossing, or asked one of Obrim's men for a ride, or anything else than what she did.
Only two possible explanations - the previously mentioned mental illness, or bad writing.
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Charlemagne19
Registered:
Jul '00
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Date Posted:
10/10 2:36pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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For me, I tend to assume this is one of those bizarre situatiosn where an author attempts to avoid the obvious solution.
Etain gets killed by Clone Troopers.
Kal and company break with the Republic as it becomes the Empire.
....
I think the obvious solution would have worked much better.
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Senator_Cilghal
Registered:
Jul '03
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Date Posted:
10/11 6:58am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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obviously, Karen is fooling u all by setting up the stage for a mass soap opera full of separations, divorces, and marital feuds
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MistrX
Registered:
Jun '06
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Date Posted:
10/11 11:00am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Don't forget the evil twin brothers. All 3 million of them.
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TheRedBlade
Registered:
Mar '07
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Date Posted:
10/11 4:22pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Except that the good, virtuous, Mando Kamino-born clones are largely innocent. It's those mass-produced, blank-faced Centax clones who are the real badguys. As someone mentioned earlier, this book took many of the negative stereotypes assigned to clones (amoral, expendable meat droids) and passes them on to another group of clones.
Also, it would have been FAR more poignant to have Etain killed by one of the clones she was trying to protect. The second her hand sprouted a lightsaber, the clones would have opened up on her the same as anyone else. Could there be a better image of Order 66 than Etain, tireless defender of the clones, getting shot in the back as she stands in front of trooper to protect him?
Apparently, the Jedi are the real badguys in the series, and it's better that Etain gets killed by a scared child with a lightsaber.
Also, anyone else find it silly that Kal was able to beat a Jedi in a lightsaber fight after Etain died?
Also, was Jusik teaching Fi how to use his lightsaber because it's easier to use than a blaster?
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nitflegal
Registered:
Oct '02
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Date Posted:
10/11 4:42pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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TheRedBlade posted:
Except that the good, virtuous, Mando Kamino-born clones are largely innocent. It's those mass-produced, blank-faced Centax clones who are the real badguys. As someone mentioned earlier, this book took many of the negative stereotypes assigned to clones (amoral, expendable meat droids) and passes them on to another group of clones.
That's not how I read the book. The Kamino-born clones are bigoted, self-superior, amoral men. Heck, Zey actually cared about Maze and was trying to look out for him and he still got slotted because the Chancellor said so. No "Maybe we can get you to safety", no "run for it and I'll pretend I never saw you", nada. Just "Sorry, orders, how about if I just take you in so they can execute you?". I find it telling that we see the clones finding true love with people who are frankly damaged and hurt.
I know they're the protaganists in the stories but I'm not seeing them as heroic and there's enough in the text to make me think that's on purpose. They care about their brothers, their teachers, and a very small circle of loved ones and everyone else is disposable and inferior. That sounds fairly monstrous to me. They're somewhat sympathetic because we saw the trauma and abuse that made them that way but it doesn't make them any nicer as men. Put it this way, take the nulls or commandos as they're portrayed in the book, think any of them would hesitate to save a wounded clone from a grenade by chucking it into a crowd of civilians?
I frankly expect things to get unpleasant for the kamino clones in the Empire, too much free thought and individuality. The Centax clones are dimmer and more poorly trained (nice touch about their crap aim in light of what we see in the movies, it's a very tidy explanation for why we see clones leaping onto moving droids in RotS and then see stormtroopers that can't hit a guy 20 feet away) so that they are much less of a threat to Palpatine. The Kamino clones are battle hardened and dangerous. And no longer needed when Palpatine has vast numbers of true cannon-fodder.
Matt
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Ashandarei
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
10/11 6:39pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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TheRedBlade posted:
Also, anyone else find it silly that Kal was able to beat a Jedi in a lightsaber fight after Etain died?
Well, you know how it is. Preternatural reflexes and the ability to see your enemy's future moves are no match for a regular, fairly old human in Mandalorian armor. 
Nearly the same thing that happened with Jaina and Boba Fett ...
nitflegal posted:
The Centax clones are dimmer and more poorly trained (nice touch about their crap aim in light of what we see in the movies, it's a very tidy explanation for why we see clones leaping onto moving droids in RotS and then see stormtroopers that can't hit a guy 20 feet away) so that they are much less of a threat to Palpatine.
It's a fairly unnecessary one, though, considering that Stormies pretty much decimate anyone who they're not ordered to let escape. I'll write that one off as the original Centax ones being faulty.
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Quiet_Mandalorian
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
10/11 7:58pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Ashandarei posted:
Well, you know how it is. Preternatural reflexes and the ability to see your enemy's future moves are no match for a regular, fairly old human in Mandalorian armor.
Nearly the same thing that happened with Jaina and Boba Fett ...
Fett is Fett, and as such, outclasses a purely EU character like Jaina. 
Ashandarei posted:
It's a fairly unnecessary one, though, considering that Stormies pretty much decimate anyone who they're not ordered to let escape.
I'd have to agree.
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MistrX
Registered:
Jun '06
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Date Posted:
10/11 9:23pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Wasn't it Beviin who kicked Jaina's sorry little behind?
And yeah, I tend to think that the first five minutes of ANH is closer to what one would expect of the stormtroopers' typical abilities. At least it would justify Ben's later line about them being "so precise".
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Trip
Registered:
Dec '03
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Date Posted:
10/11 9:29pm
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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MistrX posted:
Wasn't it Beviin who kicked Jaina's sorry little behind?
Yep. Beat her into the fetal position with a willow wand.
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MistrX
Registered:
Jun '06
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Date Posted:
10/12 12:10am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Ah. Just as I thought I had purged it from my memory.
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Sinrebirth
Title: SWC Galactic Senate Host
Registered:
Nov '04
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Date Posted:
10/12 1:53am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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MistrX posted:
And yeah, I tend to think that the first five minutes of ANH is closer to what one would expect of the stormtroopers' typical abilities. At least it would justify Ben's later line about them being "so precise".
I personally consider those clones to simply be the original Jango clones. Being from the 501st and all, clearly they're Jango clones, as they were active pre-Coruscant.
I'm actually incredibly for the retcon that a second, albeit not as good, clone army was grown on Centax II. This is simply because, in RotS, I had huge issue with how thinly spread the Grand Army was, and then the sudden deployment of troops to many systems in the Republic with these governors - there was an incredible logical problem with that, generally the question of where those clones came from.
And now we know - Centax II.
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patchworkz7
Registered:
Mar '04
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Date Posted:
10/12 10:36am
Subject:
RE: The Official Republic Commando: Order 66 Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
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Sinrebirth posted:
I'm actually incredibly for the retcon that a second, albeit not as good, clone army was grown on Centax II. This is simply because, in RotS, I had huge issue with how thinly spread the Grand Army was, and then the sudden deployment of troops to many systems in the Republic with these governors - there was an incredible logical problem with that, generally the question of where those clones came from.
And now we know - Centax II.
We also know that the Centax clones were not used for long due to their instability. The Spaarti chambers were used on Centax II, but the Corsucant batches of Jango clones such as those that made up the 501st were either Spaarti with a LOT better training, or they were taken from other cloning processes.
Palpatine slipped ringers in throughout the war, and there's a strong suggestion that the Nulls were fed disinfo from the beginning, and the Order of Battle never squared because not even the Nulls knew of the 14th, which seemed to be the training battalion many of these troops came from. Considering just how brainwashed the Centax II clones were, no one would have known who they were unless they talked about the weather on Kaminoa, and the regular clones were simply so trusting they didn't seem to think or talk too much about Kaminoa.
The intelligence services were completely compromised by Palpatine, who was also (obviously) Sideous, so anything the Nulls got out of there could be near worthless, and Palpatine seems aware someone is looking into his schemes early on, and if so he'd have planted all sorts of disinfo, which is why Kal is so painfully wrong about Palps' motivations with the Corsucant attack.
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