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Author	Topic: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
Edgeorge Registered: Aug '08	Date Posted: 12/9/08 11:51am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	Love it? Hate it? Fav part? Post here! -----signature----- Believe it or not, my IQ is 145, so, despite the fact that I'm 13, DON'T TRIFLE WITH ME! Just kiddin'. NJO ruleZ! G CANON INFO: Onimi looks like this; http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/33/Kueller_NEGTC.jpg
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Master_Starwalker Title: Manager Emeritus Registered: Sep '03	Date Posted: 12/9/08 12:29pm Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I like it, but I can see why others don't (especially in light of the Prequels.) -----signature----- "Imaginary is the future. Always now, even eternity will be." - Yoda "We can never obtain peace in the outer world until we make peace with ourselves." - The 14th Dalai Lama
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Palp_Faction Registered: Feb '02	Date Posted: 12/9/08 1:46pm Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I like it apart from EE. V weak 3rd part unfortunately. I think DE is what ROTJ should have been in terms of tone. -----signature----- ROTS, ESB, ANH, AOTC, TPM, ROTJ
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marmkid Registered: Apr '01	Date Posted: 12/9/08 1:53pm Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	i thought DE1 was good, 2 was ok and EE was just eh so are you going to tell us your thoughts, or was that profound topic title and post question supposed to be it? if all you want is a poll, i am sure there is probably a review thread for DE somewhere if you search
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Edgeorge Registered: Aug '08	Date Posted: 12/9/08 2:23pm Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I've searched before. My 1st Dark Empire fan story! http://boards.theforce.net/beyond_the_saga/b10477/29563480/p1/ -----signature----- Believe it or not, my IQ is 145, so, despite the fact that I'm 13, DON'T TRIFLE WITH ME! Just kiddin'. NJO ruleZ! G CANON INFO: Onimi looks like this; http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/33/Kueller_NEGTC.jpg
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Manisphere Registered: Aug '07	Date Posted: 12/9/08 2:43pm Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I had some problems with DE II. Not too many but the Dark Siders didn't work for me but I actually liked EE. I liked the much derided art and that it didn't go on for 6 issues. DE was good. I just wish Leia had followed the Jedi path Veitch set for her instead of waiting another 25 years. -----signature----- "Head of State, a Sith is just a Jedi who's gone off his meds."-Natasi Daala
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Zorrixor Registered: Sep '04	Date Posted: 12/9/08 2:47pm Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I still want a remake of DE without all the psychedelic green. I dislike EE for a lot of reasons, chiefly that it was clearly just rushed. I often wonder if the plan was to have a full DE3 that was the same length as the first two parts, and if falling sales figures (no big surprise there given the decline in quality from DE1) just cut that plan short? I have mixed feelings toward DE2. The basic premise of Luke and Leia being the ones to finally defeat Palpatine in DE1 was brilliant. To undo that is a brave thing--no different to how brave DE1 itself was in undoing part of ROTJ-- but unfortunately I feel due to EE, bringing Palpatine back again in DE2, ultimately, did not pay off. Sedriss? Never really liked him. Palpatine had no apprentice before Luke arrived on Byss, so I didn't quite understand why he'd suddenly needed to replace Luke with a random chump so quickly (if Shadows of Mindor happens to make Shadowspawn, who was "defeated" by Luke, as the apprentice pre-Luke, then my feelings toward Sedriss may improve). Galaxy Gun? Nice idea... poor implementation. It was okay, but then, due to all the problems with EE, it was just done away with too fast. I had no problems with it, but I felt it should have been far more fear inspiring, and not just a background plot to Palpatine's summer jolly to the sunny beaches of Korriban. My biggest complaint though was always with Brand and Han defeating Palpatine. I never had a problem with DE1 "undoing" the ending of ROTJ, in fact I felt it improved it, but my feelings toward DE2 because of EE have always left a sour taste in my mouth about what it did to DE1 that is probably the same as the sour taste DE1 gives to the people who dislike how DE1 changed ROTJ. After the noble sacrifice of Anakin Skywalker, and the heroic union of Luke and Leia... shot in the back by Han and permanently ended by a random Jedi guy? Uh... no. Now, had DE3 (and I suppose DE2 too really) featured Carnor Jax and Lumiya... then we may have had a good story. Having a DE3 that saw Palpatine finally betrayed by his own, and his death due to Lumiya could have been able to stand up there with the defeats to Anakin, Luke & Leia. Its just a shame everything with Jax and Lumiya exists only in the world of retcon. DE2 is a case where if they pulled a PoD or Clone Wars continuity switcharoo I would welcome it with open arms; if nothing else, I can promise I would not shed a tear to see EE confined to the trash and a new DE3 volume featuring Jax and Lumiya (and maybe even Shadowspawn) replace it.
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Edgeorge Registered: Aug '08	Date Posted: 12/10/08 1:59am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash? - Date Edited: 12/10/08 5:45am (1 edits total) Edited By: Master_Keralys
	Zorrixor posted: My biggest complaint though was always with Brand and Han defeating Palpatine. I never had a problem with DE1 "undoing" the ending of ROTJ, in fact I felt it improved it, but my feelings toward DE2 because of EE have always left a sour taste in my mouth about what it did to DE1 that is probably the same as the sour taste DE1 gives to the people who dislike how DE1 changed ROTJ. After the noble sacrifice of Anakin Skywalker, and the heroic union of Luke and Leia... shot in the back by Han and permanently ended by a random Jedi guy? Uh... no. Disagreement need not imply problems with other people. Let's not insinuate as much, please. Thanks! It wasn't Han who killed Palp; it was all of them. If Leia, Rayf, Brand or Luke weren't there, Sid would be victorious. Leia weakened him, then Rayf weakened him, then so did Luke and so did Brand. Han Solo did Palp a favor; he wanted to get out of his physical form and take the child. Brand stopped him and he wasn't any Jedi; he was greater than Luke. -----signature----- Believe it or not, my IQ is 145, so, despite the fact that I'm 13, DON'T TRIFLE WITH ME! Just kiddin'. NJO ruleZ! G CANON INFO: Onimi looks like this; http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/33/Kueller_NEGTC.jpg
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Excellence Registered: Jul '02	Date Posted: 12/10/08 2:08am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	Chances are slim to nil no one's going to say this, so might as well tee the golf ball in: Dark Empire, the wacky, three-inked comic where Palpatine fights Luke naked. -----signature----- Rock-a-by baby, on the treetop, Beaming with pride, the filth they hold, But when the wind blows, my temper implodes, High above a pit, filled with sharkticons, Down will come hardcover addicts, beaming no more. ©
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Edgeorge Registered: Aug '08	Date Posted: 12/10/08 2:13am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	Ha! That's a good one! DE is truly 3 inked. And Palp fights Luke naked. But the storyline is amazing, you gotta admit... -----signature----- Believe it or not, my IQ is 145, so, despite the fact that I'm 13, DON'T TRIFLE WITH ME! Just kiddin'. NJO ruleZ! G CANON INFO: Onimi looks like this; http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/starwars/images/3/33/Kueller_NEGTC.jpg
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Darth_SHOT Registered: Sep '04	Date Posted: 12/10/08 5:42am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	i gotta say the one of my personal wishes is that they get Dustin Weaver to redo the art of DE and have Chris Trevas do the covers i still have to finish DEII but DE was very good and it is also very good novel material... something that Stover would turn into a masterpiece. -----signature----- There is a faction of meatbags called the Sith. They want what any rational meatbag would want - the power to assassinate anyone
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Master_Keralys Title: Manager Emeritus Registered: Oct '03	Date Posted: 12/10/08 5:48am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	Hey, this thread has a lot of potential. Let's make sure it fulfills the good part of that potential instead of the bad. Let's turn this into a constructive discussion of the strengths and weaknesses of the DE trilogy. What this thread will not become is a free-for-all one why people HATE or LOVE Dark Empire; we're not going to rehash every discussion people have ever had. Coherent reasoned argument is very welcome. Drive-by bashing or gushing will get edited as soon as I see it. You know who you are. You're welcome in this thread. Just post something of substance if you do, not just a quick "It ruins the OT!" and then leave. -----signature----- God made man. Man rejected God. God became the man Jesus Christ, died and rose again to life, saving man from himself. The craziest story ever told. The truest.
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Ulicus Registered: Jul '05	Date Posted: 12/10/08 6:06am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	Dark Empire I is wonderful and, perhaps, one of my favourite works in all the EU. It's surprising how well little scenes seem to echo back to the Prequels, too. "Do you know how many supposed 'Jedi Masters' I've killed boy?", Palpatine says as he reaches towards three lightsabers hanging up on the wall. Though I can appreciate the argument that DE undermines both Anakin's sacrifice and Luke's refusal of the dark side in RotJ I... just don't care. Though, funnily enough, I used to be one of its biggest detractors before I'd actually read it. As I said before, I'd love to see the story reborn (and the DEII and EE portions, uh, tastefully redone, somewhat) as a new The Force Unleashed game. -----signature----- This is an imaginary story... aren't they all supposed to fit together, though? An animated cartoon about Obi-Wan and Padawan Anakin would have made more sense. Recipient of Golden Ewok™ and Golden EwokTrooper™
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beccatoria Title: Host: 181st Imperial Discussion Group Registered: Dec '06	Date Posted: 12/10/08 6:22am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I think that DEI is actually a pretty good story if you can handle the idea of Palpatine coming back at all. It's an idea I personally have some issues with because for me it crosses that indefinable boundry of suspension of disbelief (yeah, I know, I can handle a mystical energy field that grants powers of telekinesis but I can't handle a couple of clones, go figure...) which kind of undermines my overall enjoyment of the piece. As does the artwork which just isn't my cup of tea, although it doesn't trash the experience for me either. I think that DE in general has a lot of great concepts, like a Palpatine-class threat (which I have learned to enjoy through a fan-suggested retcon that the clones were Joruus C'baoth style crazy and only believed they were Palpatine, which, again for me, makes the whole thing awesome instead of lame), like Luke being moved to try and work out what happened to his father, feeling helpless to stop the Emperor and trying to be the undercover-cop, getting corrupted slowly by the constant barrage of Hobson's choices and instances where he must decide whether to put his cover before his morality; the very fact that to even go undercover as a dark sider one must allow some of the dark into oneself or the lie will be obvious to other Force-sensitives, and, of course, Leia's skills as a Jedi. I echo the sentiment that it would have been great if she'd been allowed to explore that part of her personality more thoroughly earlier. That said, I feel it lacks in execution and ends up coming across as...sillier and smaller than it should given its scope and themes. I've come to really appreciate its place in the EU and its contributions, but in a way I feel that much like my appreciation for Episode III, that comes from the way the wider EU has absorbed it, referenced it and retconned it rather than the work itself. Which I don't think is either quality literature or galactic trash. Just a story with potential that was never quite realised. -----signature----- legatus imperatoris britanniæ superior REMEMBER: X-WING: WEDGE'S GAMBLE DISCUSSION STARTS IN DECEMBER! Han's a girl, so I got a Golden Ewok.
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Jedi Ben Registered: Jul '99	Date Posted: 12/10/08 8:56am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	Thanks Keralys, be nice to not go where we've all been before! As to DE, DE1 was, for me a masterpiece that made Luke a far more interesting character as he undertakes to infiltrate nothing less than the dark side itself to save the galaxy, even if that be at the cost of his soul. There does seem to be an endemic lack of comprehension of the concept of an inside job, that it's somehow unheroic to lie to evil incarnate and then try to do it over. But maybe that's just me. Leia gets a smart arc, though her dismissal of Han grates - married or not, that sort of comment is going to get answered - it may not be on the page but no way is Han going to take that. Her corruption by the Emperor was very subtly done, as he goads her into throwing him off the bed, much in the way he did Luke on the Death Star 2. It may well be he was assessing her as a replacement for Luke, much as he intended Luke to replace Vader. As for the sequels of DE2 and EE: The latter was horibly truncated and the art change did not help, but I did like the visit to Korriban. DE2 wasn't bad but the Alliance was outright foolish in their attack on Byss - and rightly had their backsides handed to them. As to the art: People tend to forget the standard of 4-colour art in 1991, it was nowhere near what you get today in Legacy / KOTOR. As such the notion of watercolour splashes and single colours to invoke mood and atmosphere works well, I trust there isn't anyone who literally read DE as saying everyone was green, blue, pink - is there? -----signature----- Excellence: "You are the forum's Quick Ben." SW EU fans: John Ostrander needs your help! http://www.comix4sight.com
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manmiles Registered: Nov '08	Date Posted: 12/10/08 9:19am Subject: Dark Empire Trilogy: Quality Literature or Galactic Trash?
	I enjoy Dark Empire (I need to dig out my old TPB of it somewhere) but I can honestly see how Cam Kennedy's art style can turn people off. Having read other comics that Cam has drawn for (most of them are from the British comic 2000AD including a collection of art stints on Judge Dredd), his art is definately more in the European Sci-fi comics style alongside the original Metal Hurlant and Moebius than the more dynamic super-hero styles of a large majority of American comic artists. But, strange usage of colour aside, I think that art-wise, CK draws fantastic alien planets and creatures.
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