Jedi Council Forums - Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?

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Author	Topic: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
Excellence Registered: Jul '02	Date Posted: 5/4 3:51am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	I was just wondering . . . why hasn't a star wars book won a single award in 18yrs? Or is it franchise-type books that don't win awards? -----signature----- Rock-a-by baby, on the treetop, Beaming with pride, the filth they hold, But when the wind blows, my temper implodes, High above a pit, filled with sharkticons, Down will come hardcover addicts, beaming no more. ©
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ATimson Registered: Nov '03	Date Posted: 5/4 5:39am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Excellence posted: Or is it franchise-type books that don't win awards? This. That said... awards are generally given to books with some amount of literary depth, something missing from most Star Wars books. They're fun reads, but if you're looking for something intellectually engaging you're probably better off looking elsewhere. -----signature----- "Actually, VIPs are more important [than other users]." --The2ndQuest It's nice to know that those who make the board possible matter. If someone other than me edited this, please don't attribute anything in it to me in quotes. It's not mine anymore.
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Zorrixor Registered: Sep '04	Date Posted: 5/4 6:01am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards? - Date Edited: 5/4 6:12am (3 edits total) Edited By: Zorrixor
	ATimson posted: Excellence posted: Or is it franchise-type books that don't win awards? This. That said... awards are generally given to books with some amount of literary depth, something missing from most Star Wars books. They're fun reads, but if you're looking for something intellectually engaging you're probably better off looking elsewhere. I'll echo that comment. You don't really see mainstream stuff winning awards much, usually unless it's got some real "literary" value. But this is true of most things in life. Look at the Oscars and other film awards. Mass market filler doesn't really win many awards as it's not really seen as creative, but just filling a niche that happens to sell. Unless you're one of the few one-off things that somehow break the trend like LOTR, please stand outside and wait in line. Alas, that's the way the art world is. Admittedly these days things are becoming more controversial, with some academics starting to say creativity isn't just about being poncy but that the sheer fact something sells means it must be ticking the right boxes. For the moment though, the old fashioned and/or snobby qualities prevail as more important. That said, I can't say I feel the average Star Wars book is really that award winning; even from a more contemporary, less literary point of view. Most of the books are churned out so fast they're rife with errors and the odd slip ups. They're good light relief, but there are really only a few that I think stand above and beyond any other franchise novel. I think to get somewhere on the literature league tables they'd really need to try something fresh, as when you boil things down the stories we usually get are just one of the films with the character names/places switched around a bit. The stories are rarely all that original, which is really the problem of all franchise stuff: they stick to the franchise all the time. That happens with most things though. How often do people say that the sequel is never as good as the original? It's a massively sweeping generalisation and not always true, but it tends to be how people look at things by default. And a lot of the time it is true. I'm going to seriously lower the tone of this whole post next, but does anybody remember Final Fantasy X-2? Or Final Fantasy 7: Dirge of Cerberus? Sometimes it's just better off trying something completely new than making a sequel to a story that already exists. If the NJO had been shorter or there'd been a particular novel that stood out I think it may have been worthy of some recognition, but the way it was written despite being original there isn't really a single novel that you can pull out and say "This is the story". Other stories that I think could have been award worthy? KOTOR1 or KOTOR2. They totally broke the Star Wars mould and tried something more or less completely new. KOTOR2 in particular. Alas, they were games, but done by a good author I think they'd have made very memorable novels. All the current stuff though is far more generic. Much as I like a lot of it, even things like KOTOR and Legacy are little more than a Star Wars fan's orgy of excess. LOTF didn't really bring anything new to the table that the films hadn't already covered. That's the main reason I'd say none of the current range of stuff is really going to stand out in the literary world, as -- ignoring the actual quality altogether -- it's nothing new.
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The_Loyal_Imperial Title: C&G Game Host Registered: Nov '07	Date Posted: 5/4 6:36am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	ATimson posted: That said... awards are generally given to books with some amount of literary depth, something missing from most Star Wars books. They're fun reads, but if you're looking for something intellectually engaging you're probably better off looking elsewhere. Going to have to second this. Even the best-rated of Star Wars novels don't really hold up well when compared to a lot of other novels, even from the same genre.
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Carlis Registered: Jun '08	Date Posted: 5/4 7:42am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Zorrixor posted: And a lot of the time it is true. I'm going to seriously lower the tone of this whole post next, but does anybody remember Final Fantasy X-2? Or Final Fantasy 7: Dirge of Cerberus? Sometimes it's just better off trying something completely new than making a sequel to a story that already exists. Hey now, X-2 was awesome. Dirge of Cerberus, not so much.
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Manisphere Registered: Aug '07	Date Posted: 5/4 8:33am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Zorrixor posted: ATimson posted: Excellence posted: Or is it franchise-type books that don't win awards? This. That said... awards are generally given to books with some amount of literary depth, something missing from most Star Wars books. They're fun reads, but if you're looking for something intellectually engaging you're probably better off looking elsewhere. I'll echo that comment. You don't really see mainstream stuff winning awards much, usually unless it's got some real "literary" value. But this is true of most things in life. Look at the Oscars and other film awards. Mass market filler doesn't really win many awards as it's not really seen as creative, but just filling a niche that happens to sell. Unless you're one of the few one-off things that somehow break the trend like LOTR, please stand outside and wait in line. Alas, that's the way the art world is. Admittedly these days things are becoming more controversial, with some academics starting to say creativity isn't just about being poncy but that the sheer fact something sells means it must be ticking the right boxes. For the moment though, the old fashioned and/or snobby qualities prevail as more important. There is something to be said for old fashioned snobby qualities. Most of the tie-in authors write their own fiction and though it of course never sells as well as SW or some other tie-in stuff I would think said authors would rather receive the award for their original fiction than the tie-in that pays the bills for a while. Giving tie-ins awards over original fiction, to me, is like saying, "Don't bother making up your own worlds. They aren't as appreciated, relevant or as important as the books you write for Star Wars, or World of Warcraft. That said, there should be SOME kind of recognition for a good book no matter what it's about. There are some really great story tellers in the tie-in universe. It is a shame the the Aluminum Falcon can be their only trophy. -----signature----- "Head of State, a Sith is just a Jedi who's gone off his meds."-Natasi Daala
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ATimson Registered: Nov '03	Date Posted: 5/4 9:15am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Manisphere posted: Giving tie-ins awards over original fiction, to me, is like saying, "Don't bother making up your own worlds. They aren't as appreciated, relevant or as important as the books you write for Star Wars, or World of Warcraft. Depending on how you're defining "as appreciated, relevent, or as important", original works often aren't. A book in a popular tie-in line like Star Wars can often sell better than an author's original work. Unfortunately (?) awards tend to ignore popularity. Sometimes this serves as an easy way to get rid of the chaff, but the occasional wheat is removed too. -----signature----- "Actually, VIPs are more important [than other users]." --The2ndQuest It's nice to know that those who make the board possible matter. If someone other than me edited this, please don't attribute anything in it to me in quotes. It's not mine anymore.
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Jedi Ben Registered: Jul '99	Date Posted: 5/4 9:50am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Another reason, beyond the qualitative, is the limits of tie-in fiction. It's quite hard to really change anything in a major way without it looking like a crry for attention. In contrast when working with their own stories, authors are free to do whatever they like - this invariably makes for a more engaging, intriguing and hard-hitting story, but by its very nature, that story ends - franchise fiction is diameterically opposed to such. (As I'm sure you're aware Ex, Malazan is hitting book 9 this year, book 10 finishes it! We'll have to suffer then, won't then? Actually no, because there'll be 2 new trilogies from Erikson dealing with other aspects of the world but, make no mistake, the story we're hooked on, will end.) The final reason I'd throw in is that, relative to hard SF and space operas, SW will always be playing catch-up to the ideas being deployed and - can not really use these ideas as they're ill-suited to SW. For example, all-knowing, supremely sarcastic smart-arse AIs feature in the works of both Banks and Asher but could not really be transferred to SW. It could be argued all that DR has been doing over the last decade has been to overcome the limits that are built into SW - which DR cannot remove - as those limits eventually loses the interest of readers who become all too aware of the limits and seek out stories elsewhere that are not so. -----signature----- Excellence: "You are the forum's Quick Ben." SW EU fans: John Ostrander needs your help! http://www.comix4sight.com
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vong333 Registered: Oct '03	Date Posted: 5/4 10:50am Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	When it comes to Star Wars books, I can care less if they win. Dark Horse comics has been publishing comic books for many years, and the only time that Star Wars won an award was those special old trilogy manga editions (they were awesome). The only nomination that I can remember as of late was Barlow's Clone War Advenutre (1-10) digests (also awesome). Other than that, the awards have gone mostly to the old trilogy movie to include both Ewok movies, and the Genndry Cartoons. The video games for star wars have done pretty good with KOTOR 1 and 2, and the recent TFU. I think even the Wizard RPG got a nomination and it just happens to be John Jackson Miller's book. The man behind KOTOR comic book series.
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Jeff_Ferguson Registered: May '06	Date Posted: 5/4 1:48pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	I'd really like the chance to be able to read The Apprentice, which was shortlisted for the Prix de la Plume Noire by the French Committee for Experimental Literature. KOTOR won Game of the Year for like... every video game magazine, didn't it? -----signature----- "We are Imperial Knights. We do our duty by the Emperor and by the Force—no matter the cost." --- Sigel Dare "In the name of the true Emperor, Roan Fel, we come bearing greetings to our Jedi cousins." --- Marasiah Fel
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Xicer Registered: Aug '08	Date Posted: 5/4 1:57pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Yeah KOTOR won a ton of awards and its still considered one of the best RPG games ever made, but that was more because of gameplay (obviously). It had a great, well though out story, but the game itself is what really won the awards. And "The Apprentice" was really shortlisted for an award? I didn't think it was that good of a story. -----signature----- "Just before your arrival, Moneo and I were discussing Infinity." "Poor Moneo." --Leto II and Malky, "God Emperor of Dune"
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Manisphere Registered: Aug '07	Date Posted: 5/4 1:58pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Jeff_Ferguson posted: I'd really like the chance to be able to read The Apprentice, which was shortlisted for the Prix de la Plume Noire by the French Committee for Experimental Literature. Ooh. So would I. I've never even heard of the story. -----signature----- "Head of State, a Sith is just a Jedi who's gone off his meds."-Natasi Daala
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Zorrixor Registered: Sep '04	Date Posted: 5/4 1:59pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Speaking of video game awards... are there actually any like... "proper" ones? I hate that word as I'm basically being snobby and going "none of the other ones count" but... afraid I can't think of a better way of asking the question. My general perception has always been that there are lots of independent awards by various websites or magazines etc, but that there isn't really a proper video game awarding body the way there is, say, the Nebula Award for SF literature. Am I just forgetting something or has the video game industry just never bothered with their "Oscars" style thing (or never felt the need -- which I can't say I'd actually object about)?
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CurlyWookie Registered: Feb '09	Date Posted: 5/4 2:16pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	SW is basicly brain candy.
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ATimson Registered: Nov '03	Date Posted: 5/4 3:50pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Zorrixor posted: My general perception has always been that there are lots of independent awards by various websites or magazines etc, but that there isn't really a proper video game awarding body the way there is, say, the Nebula Award for SF literature. Am I just forgetting something or has the video game industry just never bothered with their "Oscars" style thing (or never felt the need -- which I can't say I'd actually object about)? I'm not aware of any such body myself. -----signature----- "Actually, VIPs are more important [than other users]." --The2ndQuest It's nice to know that those who make the board possible matter. If someone other than me edited this, please don't attribute anything in it to me in quotes. It's not mine anymore.
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Katana_Geldar Title: Former CR Tasmania, AU' Registered: Mar '03	Date Posted: 5/4 3:54pm Subject: Why hasn't the supposedly famous star wars books won any awards?
	Zorrixor posted: Speaking of video game awards... are there actually any like... "proper" ones? I hate that word as I'm basically being snobby and going "none of the other ones count" but... afraid I can't think of a better way of asking the question. KOTOR (Xbox) and Lego Star Wars OT have both won BAFTAs. But franchise books are frequently missed out by awards. It's just the way it is. Video games I think are the exception. -----signature----- Jacen and the two Vergeres http://gmgeldar.wordpress.com/vergere-essay/ Now, if you don't mind, I am somewhat preoccoupied telling the laws of physics to shut up and sit down.
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