Author Topic: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Kidan  5509 posts
Title: TFN EU Staff
Registered: Jul '03
13746_Galactic Senate
Date Posted: 7/1 2:57pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
but note that he just walked out of the shadows and the dialog could just as easily be construed as Lumiya assuming that he's one of her projections

 

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Darth-Ghost  5758 posts
Registered: Oct '03
48129_Anakin Skywalker (42109)
Date Posted: 7/1 3:15pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed) - Date Edited: 7/1 3:18pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Darth-Ghost
Kidan posted:
but note that he just walked out of the shadows and the dialog could just as easily be construed as Lumiya assuming that he's one of her projections


I think you're reaching there. It's quite clear that Lumiya created him.

Besides, Aaron Allston said it was just another phantom in his interview on the OS.


I remember reading the spoilers for BETRAYAL, somebody said that Jacen was flow-walking at the end. Then everyone got the books and realized he wasn't, but it was already stuck in everyone's mind by then. Whenever this comes up, I take the time to requote that passage, he clearly wasn't flow-walking.

 

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Darth_Monopoly  169 posts
Registered: Jun '06
42251_Zayne Carrick
Date Posted: 7/1 3:42pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
And now for my new Mass Effect inspired theory:

Not exactly a new idea, but playing through Mass Effect it makes more sense then it did before.

Jacen = Saren

Obviously in actions, and not in the fact that Saren is an alien.

For those who do not know, Saren is the villain in Mass Effect. Although he was not always a bad guy (debatable, he hated humans), at the end of Mass Effect: Revelations he discovered an alien artifact. This artifact turned out to be a Reaper, one of the massive machine-like things that come to exterminate the galaxy. The thing pretty much affects Saren's thinking and causes him to become irrational and try to take over the galaxy to prepare for the return of the Reapers.

So maybe that's where they are going with Jacen. He discovers something in the Maw, something big and terrible, and then it corrupts him and he tries to go and "fix" the galaxy to prepare the coming of the big villains.
Yeah, I know, a big bit of a stretch, but hey, I like my crazy theory.

 

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Darth-Stoic 
Registered: Aug '08
24207_Anakin
Date Posted: 7/1 3:46pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed) - Date Edited: 7/1 3:52pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Darth-Stoic
a little off topic here but i want to see Ben really mature through out this series and became very powerful... It's an obvious that theres going to be one if not a few lightsaber duels in Abyss... Maybe Luke will under some circumstance not perform to his full potential against Rhae or w.e her name is and Ben will take her on and take her to town... Im just throwing this out there because i have high hopes for Ben but then again we had high hopes for the Solo boys too tongue

 

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Kidan  5509 posts
Title: TFN EU Staff
Registered: Jul '03
13746_Galactic Senate
Date Posted: 7/1 7:04pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Darth-Ghost posted:

I think you're reaching there. It's quite clear that Lumiya created him.

Besides, Aaron Allston said it was just another phantom in his interview on the OS.


I remember reading the spoilers for BETRAYAL, somebody said that Jacen was flow-walking at the end. Then everyone got the books and realized he wasn't, but it was already stuck in everyone's mind by then. Whenever this comes up, I take the time to requote that passage, he clearly wasn't flow-walking.


that's possible I'm reaching for the Jacen angle, but there's nothing stopping the fundamental aspects of what I'm saying. The mental breakdown could be the Force trying to reassert itself against the Flow due to someone flow-walking...

 

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YodaKenobi  11645 posts
Title: TFN EU Staff
Registered: May '03
49382_Anakin Solo (1005091)
Date Posted: 7/1 7:14pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Great theory, Kidan. I'm going to have to mull that one over for awhile thinking Seems to work really well on the face of things to explain the "impostors."

 

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JediMatteus  720 posts
Registered: Sep '08
19076_Luke Skywalker
Date Posted: 7/1 7:29pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
yes and finally we see the consequences of the actions of Jacen's flow walking

we knew thee had to be some, besides be obsessed like tahiri.

 

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Kidan  5509 posts
Title: TFN EU Staff
Registered: Jul '03
13746_Galactic Senate
Date Posted: 7/1 7:29pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
YodaKenobi posted:
Great theory, Kidan. I'm going to have to mull that one over for awhile thinking Seems to work really well on the face of things to explain the "impostors."


I try grin



Though I do have a few questions that needs pondering....

1) why exactly are Luke & Ben continuing their little journey of "follow-Jacen" since Ben knows that the Jacen who visited the Aing-Tii was already on the path to the dark side, though he was not dark yet thinking

2) Since when have lightsabers been able to pin things to walls? Page 173, she pins the nexu to the wall, and it hangs there on her lightsaber blade that cuts through basically anything, until she turns off her blade

3) I'm still wondering why no one seems to remember the Daala that tried her best to kill thousands of people... the Daala that did kill all of the squabbling warlords in order to take command of the remnant...

 

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Darth-Ghost  5758 posts
Registered: Oct '03
48129_Anakin Skywalker (42109)
Date Posted: 7/1 7:44pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Kidan posted:
Darth-Ghost posted:

I think you're reaching there. It's quite clear that Lumiya created him.

Besides, Aaron Allston said it was just another phantom in his interview on the OS.


I remember reading the spoilers for BETRAYAL, somebody said that Jacen was flow-walking at the end. Then everyone got the books and realized he wasn't, but it was already stuck in everyone's mind by then. Whenever this comes up, I take the time to requote that passage, he clearly wasn't flow-walking.


that's possible I'm reaching for the Jacen angle, but there's nothing stopping the fundamental aspects of what I'm saying. The mental breakdown could be the Force trying to reassert itself against the Flow due to someone flow-walking...


I said it was a cool theory! grin Just needed to revise that Jacen was flow-walking at the end of BETRAYAL.

Kidan posted:
YodaKenobi posted:
Great theory, Kidan. I'm going to have to mull that one over for awhile thinking Seems to work really well on the face of things to explain the "impostors."


I try grin



Though I do have a few questions that needs pondering....

1) why exactly are Luke & Ben continuing their little journey of "follow-Jacen" since Ben knows that the Jacen who visited the Aing-Tii was already on the path to the dark side, though he was not dark yet thinking

2) Since when have lightsabers been able to pin things to walls? Page 173, she pins the nexu to the wall, and it hangs there on her lightsaber blade that cuts through basically anything, until she turns off her blade

3) I'm still wondering why no one seems to remember the Daala that tried her best to kill thousands of people... the Daala that did kill all of the squabbling warlords in order to take command of the remnant...



To answer the first question:

Ben said he was on the path to becoming dark. Not on the dark side. Although Ben then thinks it's inevitable, which really doesn't make sense either.

But that was never the point to the journey anyways, it was to see why Jacen "broke," not when he went to the dark side.

Plus Luke sensed something amiss in the abyss of the Maw.

And Luke and Ben's journey is said to end in ABYSS anyways.

 

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Hendo255  288 posts
Registered: Feb '09
49059_Ganner Rhysode (811092)
Date Posted: 7/1 8:25pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed) - Date Edited: 7/1 8:32pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Hendo255
Kidan posted:


2) Since when have lightsabers been able to pin things to walls? Page 173, she pins the nexu to the wall, and it hangs there on her lightsaber blade that cuts through basically anything, until she turns off her blade



should be able to happen as long as the nexu wasn't trying to move(a given since it was dead lol) it's the whole you need to apply appropriate force(pressure) into the blow to cut things. Like how Dooku just "bounced" his blade off of Obi-Wan's arm. Had he pressed it would have cut clear through his arm but he didn't apply the necessary pressure. Also the nexu was still clamped onto the Ithorian's leg which would have helped support it as well. Had Leia raised her blade I'm sure she would have cut through it.

-------

This begins with the canonization of the following statement from the Aing-Tii, in which they admit that the past CAN be changed. The exact words of the text are (page 225):


One who traveled into the past could be seen and heard--even change things. But according to the Aing-Tii, the Force would resume its natural flow. One couldn't change things in any significant way; the Force would bring things back to the way they should be.


Now, the thing is the "significant" phrase there, and the fact that the Force always brings things back to the way they "should" be.

First, the Significant thing touches against Chaos Theory, things like where someone would go back in time and kill an insignificant bug a million years ago, and that keeps you from being born.


I treated this in my mind like in The Time Machine You can change the past but it balances out regardless. ie: Jacen could go back and save Anakin from dying at that particular moment but then he would have just died moments later in a different way.
Like in The Time Machine, he goes back in time and stops his fiance from being killed by the robber but then the second he turns his back she gets crushed by the horse drawn carriage on the street instead.

 

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Dawud786  2660 posts
Registered: Dec '06
42320_Luke Skywalker
Date Posted: 7/1 9:56pm Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Darth_Monopoly posted:
And now for my new Mass Effect inspired theory:

Not exactly a new idea, but playing through Mass Effect it makes more sense then it did before.

Jacen = Saren

Obviously in actions, and not in the fact that Saren is an alien.

For those who do not know, Saren is the villain in Mass Effect. Although he was not always a bad guy (debatable, he hated humans), at the end of Mass Effect: Revelations he discovered an alien artifact. This artifact turned out to be a Reaper, one of the massive machine-like things that come to exterminate the galaxy. The thing pretty much affects Saren's thinking and causes him to become irrational and try to take over the galaxy to prepare for the return of the Reapers.

So maybe that's where they are going with Jacen. He discovers something in the Maw, something big and terrible, and then it corrupts him and he tries to go and "fix" the galaxy to prepare the coming of the big villains.
Yeah, I know, a big bit of a stretch, but hey, I like my crazy theory.


Stang, you don't even have to look to Mass Effect for that one. You can just look to KOTOR I & II. If this is the way they are going with Jacen, then Jacen just pulled a Revan. "I became Sith to prepare you for the real bad guys!" "I became Sith to prepare you for the TRUE SITH SCAAAAARY!"

 

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DarthDragon164  731 posts
Registered: Jun '08
48424_Ulic Qel-Droma (512093)
Date Posted: 7/2 5:50am Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
I finished last night.

I liked the story, but I didn't like how Christie Golden told it. There was so much that she said happen, but didn't actually show. Tadar'Ro teaching Ben flow-walking comes to mind. So does Jaina, Cilgal, and Tekli's interview with Javis Tyrr. She probably could have made it fifty pages longer by just expanded her ideas more.

I also disliked where she got the title from. I know most of the titles in LotF were blatantly obvious (*cough cough* Inferno), but none were based off an object, such as this.

 

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Darth_Torres 
Registered: Feb '09
6904_TIE Fighter<br>Vader's
Date Posted: 7/2 7:45am Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
[quote=DarthDragon164]
I liked the story, but I didn't like how Christie Golden told it. There was so much that she said happen, but didn't actually show. Tadar'Ro teaching Ben flow-walking comes to mind. So does Jaina, Cilgal, and Tekli's interview with Javis Tyrr. She probably could have made it fifty pages longer by just expanded her ideas more.
[quote]

Couldn't agree more. Two of the major plot focuses (flow-walking and media coverage of the Jedi) were completely cold short.

All we got ref the teaching of flow-walking was that you needed soft eyes!!

And how come not one Jedi even questioned how Tyrr managed to get footage of Seff's cell??

I felt that the novel was rushed, hence the low page count and lack of real detail. But again I agree, I enjoyed the story itself, actually more than I did Outcast.

 

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Hendo255  288 posts
Registered: Feb '09
49059_Ganner Rhysode (811092)
Date Posted: 7/2 7:55am Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Dawud786 posted:
Stang, you don't even have to look to Mass Effect for that one. You can just look to KOTOR I & II. If this is the way they are going with Jacen, then Jacen just pulled a Revan. "I became Sith to prepare you for the real bad guys!" "I became Sith to prepare you for the TRUE SITH SCAAAAARY!"


lol yea, that's like one of my theories
and finally... Damn… just when I thought I was done with my theories for the day this popped into my mind… while I still believe that he was merely a slave to his powers and that caused his fall (ie: seeing the future so easily) I wouldn’t be TOTALLY shocked if when Jacen went to the Maw, he found the Celestial’s enemies, thus discovering a new hidden threat that he felt he would have to protect the Galaxy from in the eventuality of their escape(which he also saw happening in the future)... and much like with Anakin Skywalker, he didn’t realize that it was his actions that were going to cause what he wanted to stop from happening. ie: if he never became a Sith, Centerpoint would still be there and the jail break wouldn’t be possible… bam… yet another simple way to link LotF to FotJ
The writers know that we all love Revan so it wouldn’t surprise me if they stole his mojo in an attempt to make a more complex explanation for Jacen becoming a Sith and try redeeming his fall in our eyes a bit



and I just remembered something that nobody has mentioned. (that I've noticed since I finished the book at least)

Who do you guys think it was that Ship sensed that was strong enough in the dark side for him to actually abandon the Tribe and go searchign for him after being with them for 2 years? (go go Jacen is still alive theories!) thinking

 

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Master_Jedi_LS  169 posts
Registered: Jan '09
42008_Luke Skywalker
Date Posted: 7/2 8:50am Subject: The Official Fate of the Jedi: Omen Discussion Thread (Spoilers Allowed)
Hendo255 posted:
Dawud786 posted:
Stang, you don't even have to look to Mass Effect for that one. You can just look to KOTOR I & II. If this is the way they are going with Jacen, then Jacen just pulled a Revan. "I became Sith to prepare you for the real bad guys!" "I became Sith to prepare you for the TRUE SITH SCAAAAARY!"


lol yea, that's like one of my theories
and finally... Damn… just when I thought I was done with my theories for the day this popped into my mind… while I still believe that he was merely a slave to his powers and that caused his fall (ie: seeing the future so easily) I wouldn’t be TOTALLY shocked if when Jacen went to the Maw, he found the Celestial’s enemies, thus discovering a new hidden threat that he felt he would have to protect the Galaxy from in the eventuality of their escape(which he also saw happening in the future)... and much like with Anakin Skywalker, he didn’t realize that it was his actions that were going to cause what he wanted to stop from happening. ie: if he never became a Sith, Centerpoint would still be there and the jail break wouldn’t be possible… bam… yet another simple way to link LotF to FotJ
The writers know that we all love Revan so it wouldn’t surprise me if they stole his mojo in an attempt to make a more complex explanation for Jacen becoming a Sith and try redeeming his fall in our eyes a bit



and I just remembered something that nobody has mentioned. (that I've noticed since I finished the book at least)

Who do you guys think it was that Ship sensed that was strong enough in the dark side for him to actually abandon the Tribe and go searchign for him after being with them for 2 years? (go go Jacen is still alive theories!) thinking



I don't think it will be Jacen at least I hope not... I think it will be a Sith everyone is familiar with but has been thought dead for a long long time. I don't think it will be someone we are not familiar with. Be cool it was Darth Plaguis (Not sure if thats spelt right..) Like Palps thought he had killed him but his master used his vast amount of power to save his own life and disappear for a little while.

 

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