Jedi Council Forums - The Emperor's Pawns article (was: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!)

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Author	Topic: The Emperor's Pawns article (was: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!)
Valiento Registered: Mar '00	Date Posted: 7/13/01 11:06am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!! - Date Edited: 7/13/01 11:20am (4 edits total) Edited By: Valiento
	I'm sorry I got a bit out of hand, I apoligise for calling you a bigot. One question, if marvel isn't incorporated into the official timeline, then what in the world was the Essential chronology doing? Here's pablo's message from Gamer #4 stuff @ tos!!!, it was in refrence to many people worring that the Aduma article would be non-continuity. Pablo_Hidalgo Registered: Apr 01 Date Posted: 5/3 1:51pm Subject: RE: Gamer #4 Stuff at TOS Calm down, folks. As far as I know only one story in Issue #4 is marked with the Infinities logo (can you guess which one?). It's on the cover to introduce the concept to those otherwise not familiar with it, and referenced in the editor's foreward. Since Gamer is a multi-era magazine, it's unlikely that one era symbol would be indicative of its entire content. The marked story aside, the rest of the mag works in continuity.
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Moridin Title: RPG Author Registered: Apr '99	Date Posted: 7/13/01 11:26am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	What was it doing in the Chronology? Integrating. Those parts don't mean that ALL of Marvel was integrated, but those parts they could. It's a slow process, but it will be done eventually. As for the Pablo Hidalgo quote (thanks by the way), all I have to go on is what one of the guys at WotC said. But we'll see. -----signature----- Rodney "Moridin" Thompson RPG Designer Wizards of the Coast SWRPGNetwork - http://www.swrpgnetwork.com
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Valiento Registered: Mar '00	Date Posted: 7/13/01 11:31am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	Moriden the EC basically integrated every issue. Oviosly hoth stuff, and issue 81, really can't fit. But aduba doesn't really conflict with anything, and did alot of snazzy continuity links, between other stories.
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Matthew Trias Registered: Sep '99	Date Posted: 7/13/01 12:24pm Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	"However, as it stands now the article itself is Infinities, as is the Lurdo comic strip", Why is the article considered infinities anyways? ?:\| It makes no sense to me.It doesn't contradict anything,that I can see. Let the Sprites be considered in continuity.They're cool.Did you guys chicken out?Where you afraid fans would complain about a 6 foot tall rabbit?It's no more absurd then a 10 foot tall slug crime lord,or a man appearing as a ghost,or sound in space,or lightsabre ot....get the point? I certainly hope they become continuity one of these days. (Lurdo?Who the hell cares about Lurdo?I'm glad he's infinities ) -----signature----- Bushator vs Kerryien Whoever wins, we lose. Buy Exo Squad on DVD! You Won't Be Disappointed
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pat-fett Registered: Mar '01	Date Posted: 7/13/01 1:31pm Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	I hope issue 6 is about Tales of the Jedi. It could also be an article that makes characters from the more serious stories in Tales fit into continuty,which is just as good. -----signature----- ***SFLDM*** WOOHOO Alpha 2 DrunkOnColt45 FORCEBOAT ect. BSGPilots http://www.majesticsites.net/bsgpilots/index.php Look for TighFighter "I will have no fear. Fear is the mind killer" Dune
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Wedge 88 Registered: Jul '99	Date Posted: 7/13/01 2:29pm Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	"It's no more absurd then a 10 foot tall slug crime lord" Who's that? "Why is the Skyhopper article Infinities?" Good question... "Why is Tales Infinities?" Hmm... -----signature----- The world looks marvelous from up here, so peaceful, so wonderful, and so fragile. ---Ilan Ramon, Israeli Air Force Colonel, Payload Specialist on the last mission of the Space Shuttle Columbia For looking you're droids the aren't these.
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Halagad_Ventor Title: - Star Wars Author - SWRPG Designer Registered: Jul '01	Date Posted: 7/15/01 5:39pm Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	Hey there folks. Just thought I'd stop by and respond to some of the reactions that the Emperor's Pawns article has been getting (I'm Abel, BTW). I guess I should start out by saying that when I read and write SW, I go for a real feeling that everything fits together, and I mean everything, save the recent Infinities comic story arc. That's just the approach I take. Anyway, that said, I'll go ahead and talk about the article a little. For those of you who've enjoyed it, I'm glad. I put a lot of love into the article, and decades of accumluated SW lore. I figured it was about time to use some of it. Thanks especially to Ana's vocal support; for an author to get appreciate like that is priceless. (BTW Ana, email me and let me know what's been going on). One of the interesting reactions I read was a critique about Lumiya's further "Vaderization." The claim if I'm not mistaken is that Shira was raised on Palpatine's estate/palace, hence she must have been raised/trained by Palpatine. While I imagine that that would have been a possibility, I do not think the derived conclusion of being trained by Palpatine is a necessary one. According to Marvel ish #63, Shira was part of an experiment in adolescent indoctrination. Nowhere is it literarily or artistically hinted that Palpatine had a personal hand in her training -- she is merely shown sparring with some persons. However, her association with Vader is made very clear. "Personally selected by Lord Vader for infiltration into banned organization known as 'Rebel Alliance.' Vader project required total razing of city of Chinshassa ... Project's purpose: the elimination -- either actual or effectual of Rebel Commander Luke Skywalker." What's more, at the end of the issue, Vader is the one that saves Shira from death, declaring, "Now, more than ever, I have need of Shira Brie!" After this, we see Shira transformed into the mechanized Lumiya in issue 88 -- clearly paralleling Vader. Thus while I admit it might have been cool if Shira had been raised and trained by Palpatine, the hints I felt of her kinship with Vader were simply overwhelming. Thus I saw no objection in continuing to vaderize Lumiya. Why was Tremayne left out? Well, a couple reasons. For one, Tremayne might be covered in the Dark Side Sourcebook, so don't count him out yet. Also, Tremayne is better known as an inquisitor, so I thought it more appropriate if Tremayne is covered in in an article dedicated to the Inquisitorius. Lastly, I had made a reference to him, as well as Sedriss and other known Hands in the intro, but alas, it was one of the many things that were cut from the article. What's the deal with the Followers of Palawa, Teras Kasi and the Force? Well, my view is that the Palawa way is how these guys touch the Force; teras kasi martial arts just sort of fine tuned their connection. Teras Kasi can be learned by any one, but it doesn't make you Force-sensitive. Of course, that's just my view. Ultimately, what counts is what's appoved, and if someone decided to write a story that a non-Force sensitive who learns teras kasi suddenly became Force sensitive and (this is very important) it got approved by LFL, well then, that would be the case after all -- until it gets contradicted. :-P Anyway, if anyone has any questions or comments, I'll be hanging around for a while. Thanks for your comments thus far. Best, Abel -----signature----- Abel G. Peña: http://www.abelgpena.com Star Wars Blog: http://blogs.starwars.com/abelgpena Facebook Profile: http://www.facebook.com/abelgpena Second Prophet of the Church of Waru Recipient of a monstrosity known as a Mandalorian Ewok™
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Matthew Trias Registered: Sep '99	Date Posted: 7/15/01 7:06pm Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!! - Date Edited: 7/15/01 7:08pm (1 edits total) Edited By: Matthew Trias
	ohhhhh....yeah....I want that article on the Inquisitorious Go write it! Ohhh yeah great job in Gamer 5 BTW. I'm a very happy person. -----signature----- Bushator vs Kerryien Whoever wins, we lose. Buy Exo Squad on DVD! You Won't Be Disappointed
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Ana Vitorrian Registered: Mar '99	Date Posted: 7/16/01 12:53am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	You're right, Halagad! We're way over due for another roundtable discussion! I like the way you nipped a SW detail from the back end of Mike Stackpole's scripting in the X-wing books with SW details from the Dark Empire Sourcebook, (i.e., from the "Sarcev Quest" info). However, there's all kinds of stuff "nipped" in there that was cool! This is an all around solid article! I really enjoyed it - so we've got lots to talk about! Take care and congrats on your work! Ana V
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Matthew Trias Registered: Sep '99	Date Posted: 7/16/01 1:00am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	Yeah I loved that too. Bout time we got an official continuity fix. -----signature----- Bushator vs Kerryien Whoever wins, we lose. Buy Exo Squad on DVD! You Won't Be Disappointed
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Valiento Registered: Mar '00	Date Posted: 7/16/01 1:04am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	Excellent article. Keep up the good work.
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Wedge 88 Registered: Jul '99	Date Posted: 7/16/01 2:42am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	God, I want this issue! -----signature----- The world looks marvelous from up here, so peaceful, so wonderful, and so fragile. ---Ilan Ramon, Israeli Air Force Colonel, Payload Specialist on the last mission of the Space Shuttle Columbia For looking you're droids the aren't these.
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Genghis12 Title: Manager Emeritus Registered: Nov '99	Date Posted: 7/16/01 8:05am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	Abel, Thanks for responding. Most of your comments stemmed from my comments regarding the article (which was excellent, btw). "I guess I should start out by saying that when I read and write SW, I go for a real feeling that everything fits together, and I mean everything, save the recent Infinities comic story arc. That's just the approach I take." Excellent! I think that's indeed one of the things which sets Star Wars apart from anything else - the tight continuity of a grand saga. That "tight" continuity can only happen if people do pay close attention. Even though LFL does indeed have continuity editors and what-not, the first line of defense must be with each individual writer to make sure the material fits with what we already know. A daunting task and possibly high expectations, I know. But, also that's why Star Wars is so good. "One of the interesting reactions I read was a critique about Lumiya's further "Vaderization." The claim if I'm not mistaken is that Shira was raised on Palpatine's estate/palace, hence she must have been raised/trained by Palpatine. While I imagine that that would have been a possibility, I do not think the derived conclusion of being trained by Palpatine is a necessary one.[i]" True. It however was mentioned in the original source as well as the later Star Wars Galaxy #3 article. Shira Brie was raised on Palpatine's estate. I find it strange that it would then be Vader and not Palpatine who would discover her Force-sensitivity, especially since Palpatine was rumored to have raised another red-headed, Force-sensitive girl on his estate - Mara Jade. "However, her association with Vader is made very clear. 'Personally selected by Lord Vader for infiltration into banned organization known as 'Rebel Alliance.' Vader project required total razing of city of Chinshassa ... Project's purpose: the elimination -- either actual or effectual of Rebel Commander Luke Skywalker." What's more, at the end of the issue, Vader is the one that saves Shira from death, declaring, 'Now, more than ever, I have need of Shira Brie!" I agree that Shira was probably always meant to be a sort of kindred spirit to Vader. I looked at her character quite differently, though. Instead of being a daughter figure to Anakin Skywalker, I saw her paralleling Anakin and being a daughter figure to the Emperor, the man who owned the estate she grew up on. That is, everything about her character points to a "new" Vader character, I agree. When I said "Vaderization" what I meant was that the focus was being taken away from Palpatine and given to Vader, not that she wasn't made more like Vader. I would agree Lumiya was always meant to take Vader's place after ROTJ. But, that would also mean she should've been Palpatine's "apprentice" not Vaders. "Why was Tremayne left out?" Again, my comment. The question of his Hand-status was made ambiguous in GG:9 where it stated that he was rumored to be be a Hand. "Well, a couple reasons. For one, Tremayne might be covered in the Dark Side Sourcebook, so don't count him out yet." I definitely hope so! "Also, Tremayne is better known as an inquisitor, so I thought it more appropriate if Tremayne is covered in in an article dedicated to the Inquisitorius." Yes, I would agree that an article dedicated to the Inquisitorius would also be a great article. However, my whole point was that a fairly complete article about the Emperor's Hands should've helped define his Hand-status. "Lastly, I had made a reference to him, as well as Sedriss and other known Hands in the intro, but alas, it was one of the many things that were cut from the article." Aaaaah. Well, then I can't really fault you at all. Your research has been of the highest quality and it did show in the article. It's a shame that "important" (well, for us insane die-hards details got cut from the article. "What's the deal with the Followers of Palawa, Teras Kasi and the Force? Well, my view is that the Palawa way is how these guys touch the Force; teras kasi martial arts just sort of fine tuned their connection. Teras Kasi can be learned by any one, but it doesn't make you Force-sensitive. Of course, that's just my view." It's also one supported by precedent. The Shadows of the Empire Sourcebook indeed has game rules about Teras Kasi martial arts (a minor blurb with fairly small amount of stats) and no real mention is made of being Force-sensitive. It would seem to agree with that assessment. "[i]Anyway, if anyone has any questions or comments, I'll be hanging around for a while. Thanks for your comments thus far." Thanks for taking the time to clarify the whole creative process behind the article, and here's to hoping you do more of them. Like the SWAJ before it, SWG magazine is turning out to be one of the more enjoyable corners of the Star Wars universe mostly in part to people like yourself doing work for it. -----signature----- ========== Intelligently Fitting The newer EU into Established Star Wars Continuity (Or How About a No-Prize) http://boards.theforce.net/message.asp?topic=1111146 "Envy the nations that have heroes. Pity the ones that need them." -- Van Zan
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Wedge 88 Registered: Jul '99	Date Posted: 7/16/01 8:15am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	Fix those markup codes, boy! -----signature----- The world looks marvelous from up here, so peaceful, so wonderful, and so fragile. ---Ilan Ramon, Israeli Air Force Colonel, Payload Specialist on the last mission of the Space Shuttle Columbia For looking you're droids the aren't these.
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Ana Vitorrian Registered: Mar '99	Date Posted: 7/16/01 8:21am Subject: RE: Gamer #5 stuff @ TOS!!!
	In my previous post, I meant to say "X-wing comic books" (NOT "books"). Sorry for the confusion, if any.
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