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Topic:
*NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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Cid
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
4/20 8:01pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS) (Updated 29/10/07)
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zombie posted:
Cid posted:
Um, and all three sucked rocks through a straw. It's not a very fair comparison though (LAS to the Ewok movies, that is) and that's why i haven't brought it up.
Just because you don't like them doesn't make it an unfair comparison.
What i mean was that it would be unfair to use them in the context of "See, the Ewoks movies didn't have Jedi and look what happened to them!" It would be a stupid argument to use against, say, Pizza the hutt who would (quight rightly) eat it alive. Just a clarification.
zombie posted:
I agree, and I think the comments made so far by LFL staffers are more to emphasize that the show will not prominently feature or revolve around Jedi and the Force, because the other series do and if they didn't make this clear from the beginning then everyone would assume we'd have a series about rogue Jedi and the early Rebels.
And if this is really the case, forget it. I'm fine with it not revolving around Jedi, but no Jedi cast members leaves me unimpressed. In that case i'll watch BSG while i can (After all, i've missed nearly the whole series so far so i can catch up on it via DVD). Clone wars looks ok but it's Jedi overload. Doesn't hurt anyone else unless a whole lot more decide my way.
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somethingfamiliar
Registered:
Aug '03
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Date Posted:
4/21 7:06am
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS) (Updated 29/10/07)
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zombie posted:
Though Droids did have one of the characters have a lightsaber.
I thought that was really cool when I saw that as a kid. He found it in the back of a speeder or something like that. Instantly you've got this wider background to things. It might be interesting to have a "felt, not seen" thing like that in the LA show, more interesting I think than having them involved outright in the action. I could see something like a smuggler's passenger being ambiguously Jedi, a one-time character pulling a low-key Jedi-like trick or having some kind of Jedi knowledge or artifact to make you wonder. Just something small. It would be great to bring SW back to a more ANH universe, including Jedi being obscure, mysterious, dangerous parts of a mythic past.
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Earthknight
Registered:
Oct '02
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Date Posted:
4/21 12:32pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS) (Updated 29/10/07)
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Crime Wars could've worked in any timeline since Sith and Jedi aren't in the show. It's just a bunch of smugglers and crime lords giving each other the slip. I hate to say it, but the Stargate creators have more brains and creativity than the SW creator. Lucas is suffering the same syndrome that the Superman movie creators are suffering from. And like Superman, this SW series is going to get trounced by better Sci Fi shows.
I'm now more excited for Stargate Universe than Crime Wars.
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Darth_Crow_T_Robot
Registered:
Dec '00
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Date Posted:
4/27 2:48pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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I've seen this argument before. Same exact positions on both sides. Where was it...?
Oh yeah, I remember:
http://starwarsgalaxies.station.sony.com/
For years the debate went on: Jedi must be rare VS Everyone only wants Jedi.
The "Jedi must be rare" camp won...and the game was released to a massive "yawn". What should have been an epic game turned into a mediocre game with numbers that while they seemed high, were abyssmal for the money invested and expectations.
Eventually the game was tanking so bad without Jedi that they redid the whole thing to include Jedi.
No matter what any fan of the other parts of the SW Universe believe, Jedi are and always will be the center of the SW galaxy. It's the ONE thing they have that sets them apart from the crowd. If they don't play to their strengths and make the show with Jedi at the center, it will tank, guaranteed.
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zombie
Registered:
Aug '99
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Date Posted:
4/27 2:56pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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I don't think you can compare the gaming crowd to the context of a dramatic television show. Since the Jedi's distinctiveness revolves around their super-powers it follows that this would be highly desirable for a video game. Dramatic requirements of story and character in a live-action television show do not follow analagously.
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WookieeWarrior9
Registered:
Jun '07
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Date Posted:
4/28 10:38am
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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If the Jedi are what separate Star Wars and not having them will make it tank, then why do other sci-fi shows do fine? If the show is well written and acted, then it will do well. One of the biggest complaints of the PT is that it had too many Jedi and no smugglers/bounty hunters, so this should satisfy a lot of those people.
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"He (Francis Ford Coppolla) took me from not being able to write a word, to being the king of wooden dialogue."
- George Lucas
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Cid
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
4/28 2:34pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
- Date Edited:
4/28 2:40pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Cid
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WookieeWarrior9 posted:
If the Jedi are what separate Star Wars and not having them will make it tank, then why do other sci-fi shows do fine?
Those shows never had it in their canon to begin with. Jedi is a crucial part of SW canon and to call something SW without any will leave normal people (as in people who don't nitpick over 2 second sequences, pick apart meanings of a single line of dialogue or obsess over characters who's entire participation in the saga involves looking over a wall at some racing pods going by) wondering where the heck they are. You do realize that there are fans of Sci-fi that aren't so rabid their googling anything related to their pet franchises, don't you? Like it or not Jedi are what makes SW distinct from Firefly, Star Trek, Farscape, BSG, Babylon 5, and a host of other sci fi shows. The Fantasy element they bring to the table put a unique fingerprint on SW and to remove that makes it the same old same old. At least Firefly didn't have wooden dialogue, whatever else you may say about it or it's fanatical fans.
Sci-fi doesn't tank without Jedi, but Star Wars without them isn't Star Wars.
WookieeWarrior9 posted:
One of the biggest complaints of the PT is that it had too many Jedi and no smugglers/bounty hunters, so this should satisfy a lot of those people.
So basically it's feast or famine. Great plan, there. How about a happy medium? You know, like the OT this series is supposed to be emulating?
The PT should have found a balance, but GL apparently decided that all people wanted to see was Jedi which was a stupid choice. Obi-Wan and Anakin were the only Jedi fans wanted to get to know (No one in 2 decades ever mentioned wanting to see Yoda jumping around like a muppet on crack), and the lack of non force using characters of any worth other than Natalie Portman and her wooden indian impersonation was a detriment to the movies. If you think, however, that 'those people' didn't want any Jedi or won't want them in the show I have faith you'll see just how wrong you are. It's a bummer, really, because if this one fails it's probably the last nail for Live action SW. I doubt Lucas would chance another one.
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Cid
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
4/28 3:19pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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A couple posts up someone brought up SWG and it's a GREAT analogy to illustrate my feast or famine point. No Jedi at all, while canonically correct, wouldn't have been SW so they gave people the option of becoming one. Certain players with no lives sat there for months grinding out their force sensitive character slot until there were a few Jedi running around. This increased a little until people who actually leave the house once in a while started seeing Jedi running around coronet fighting off entire groups of Bounty Hunters at once (This was awesome) and wondering why the mind numbing crazy hologrind was there effectively preventing them from having a Jedi character unless they gave their entire lives up and rooted themselves to their computers (In those days there was permadeath for Jedi, too, but that didn't last once people who'd worked like crazy started losing their characters to it and quitting the game) so SOE relented and they started with the Village, a series of quests that effectively regulated the number of Jedi. Took months to finish the village because you would finish a few missions then have to wait weeks for it to reset.
At this point the game was probably at it's best, the Village era was when i got my Jedi (so i'm biased). There were Jedi, a lot of people were more into the guns and stuff which most mmo's didn't have and thus weren't really interested in a melee/mage type charater that was running all over games like UO and EQ, and still others that took one look at how long it took and were like NO WAY (not to mention people who were halfheartedly doing the village that were destined never to complete it). It wasn't canonically correct, but who cared?
It was all about to come down on our ears...
I won't get into the CU, i hated it at first but came to accept it and by the end thought the game was a little more balanced even if i still had some issues with the changes, i REALLY wont get into the zombie apocalypse that was the NGE. Some idiot decided to make Jedi a starting character profession (professions were dumb anyway), so then what did you see? 9 million Jedi running around! It seemed like EVERY newbie character starting out on that retarded station they added was a Jedi, Obi-Wan's house was overrun! When they added the (also stupid) cloaks that dropped in Deathwatch Bunker (in those days) you couldn't go near the place without your character locking up there were so many people running around inside looking for Jedi Knight Cloaks. Mention the Jedi Master Cloak and the salivation was palpable. Us Elder Jedi were just DYING by this point. Wasn't long after this you started seeing the pages of ebay filled to the brim with elder jedi (I didn't sell mine, not that anyone was buying, i deleted it on principal). Now SWG has like 2 players, both Jedi, and SOE has it's head in the sand.
The moral of the story? People wouldn't accept famine (to the point of investing months at a time to get what they wanted), feast struck the deathblow (Legions of Jedi running around like the clones were attacking), and even players who were RABID againt Jedi all over the place on the SWG forums switched their characters over to be able to light up the glowstick (No way were all those respec jedi new since they were all level 80, and it was all you saw).
Pretty well illustrates what people like about star wars considering they jumped at it all at once with both feet the first easy chance they got.
(God, someone finish one of those old style SWG emulators PLEASE!)
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Darth-Wyrm
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
4/28 3:32pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
- Date Edited:
4/28 3:33pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Darth-Wyrm
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I honestly think in the end that this debate is all pointless. First of all, I don't even think the two camps are all that far apart. The "No Mass Jedi" camp just can't seem to understand that the "Yes Jedi" camp isn't demanding hordes of Jedi running around.
GL isn't stupid. The Jedi are his pet creation. More distinctly Lucas than anything else in Star Wars. SW took bits and pieces from all sorts of pop culture and mythology, but in the Jedi, he found the perfect (and unexplored) combination of an old-world knight in a hi-tech world. He's not letting that go.
The others can complain all they want, but I'd bet the moisture farm that the Force will be in the LAS.
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Humble_Jedi
Registered:
Oct '04
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Date Posted:
4/28 4:30pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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Of course. But it will be subtle. If we will see a Jedi, he or she will be in disguise. Perhaps working as a Bounty Hunter. Another might carry a lightsaber, claiming he killed a Jedi and took it. And he could even be speaking the truth. It will make us wonder all the time. I'm sure we'll see some kind of fugitive Jedi at some point. But it might take a while to figure out who it is.
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Darth-Wyrm
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
4/28 4:51pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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Humble_Jedi posted:
Of course. But it will be subtle. If we will see a Jedi, he or she will be in disguise. Perhaps working as a Bounty Hunter. Another might carry a lightsaber, claiming he killed a Jedi and took it. And he could even be speaking the truth. It will make us wonder all the time. I'm sure we'll see some kind of fugitive Jedi at some point. But it might take a while to figure out who it is.
See that I can live with. I'm perfectly fine with it being subtle and somewhat hidden. I've said numerous times that I fully expect us to see a group of protagonists with one of them being a Jedi in hiding. I don't expect him/her to use their Force abilities openly or often. That wouldn't make sense. But every once in a while, when times are particularly desperate, we're going to see flashes of it.
Personally, I also think that at some point we're going to see a villain with Force abilities. Either directly related to the Empire (like an Emperor's Hand/Vader's Secret Apprentice type thing), or maybe a Dark Jedi running some crime organization (which I guess would fit with all the crime org. rumors we've heard so far).
Either way, I don't see any reason to be negative. I think this show is going to be great.
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Earthknight
Registered:
Oct '02
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Date Posted:
4/28 7:58pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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My concern for this series is that it's going to take place in one location only. That won't be fun.
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Master to jacensolofangirl2007 Our philosophy: We strive for a 100 in awesomeness. And if we get a 90, it's still cool. ~My Fanfiction Stories~ The Guardians of Light- http://boards.theforce.net/Message.aspx?topic=259245
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Cid
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
4/28 8:40pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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Earthknight posted:
My concern for this series is that it's going to take place in one location only. That won't be fun.
There's no indication of that. If it was the case, i agree, it would be terrible.
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WookieeWarrior9
Registered:
Jun '07
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Date Posted:
4/28 9:49pm
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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Cid posted:
WookieeWarrior9 posted:
If the Jedi are what separate Star Wars and not having them will make it tank, then why do other sci-fi shows do fine?
Those shows never had it in their canon to begin with. Jedi is a crucial part of SW canon and to call something SW without any will leave normal people (as in people who don't nitpick over 2 second sequences, pick apart meanings of a single line of dialogue or obsess over characters who's entire participation in the saga involves looking over a wall at some racing pods going by) wondering where the heck they are. You do realize that there are fans of Sci-fi that aren't so rabid their googling anything related to their pet franchises, don't you? Like it or not Jedi are what makes SW distinct from Firefly, Star Trek, Farscape, BSG, Babylon 5, and a host of other sci fi shows. The Fantasy element they bring to the table put a unique fingerprint on SW and to remove that makes it the same old same old. At least Firefly didn't have wooden dialogue, whatever else you may say about it or it's fanatical fans.
Sci-fi doesn't tank without Jedi, but Star Wars without them isn't Star Wars.
WookieeWarrior9 posted:
One of the biggest complaints of the PT is that it had too many Jedi and no smugglers/bounty hunters, so this should satisfy a lot of those people.
So basically it's feast or famine. Great plan, there. How about a happy medium? You know, like the OT this series is supposed to be emulating?
The PT should have found a balance, but GL apparently decided that all people wanted to see was Jedi which was a stupid choice. Obi-Wan and Anakin were the only Jedi fans wanted to get to know (No one in 2 decades ever mentioned wanting to see Yoda jumping around like a muppet on crack), and the lack of non force using characters of any worth other than Natalie Portman and her wooden indian impersonation was a detriment to the movies. If you think, however, that 'those people' didn't want any Jedi or won't want them in the show I have faith you'll see just how wrong you are. It's a bummer, really, because if this one fails it's probably the last nail for Live action SW. I doubt Lucas would chance another one.
Wow, you sure seem to know a ton about a series which hasn't filmed a single shot yet. You apparently have insight the rest of us aren't privy to and already know the dialogue will be bad. To quote Padme, "You assume too much". And sure, I know that all viewers aren't fanboys, but like George expected people to have seen the previous films, I expect them to know that the vast majority of Jedi have been killed.
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- George Lucas
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Cid
Registered:
Aug '07
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Date Posted:
4/29 9:26am
Subject:
RE: *NEW LIVE ACTION SW DETAILS!!!* (MINOR SPOILERS)
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WookieeWarrior9 posted:
Wow, you sure seem to know a ton about a series which hasn't filmed a single shot yet. You apparently have insight the rest of us aren't privy to and already know the dialogue will be bad. To quote Padme, "You assume too much". And sure, I know that all viewers aren't fanboys, but like George expected people to have seen the previous films, I expect them to know that the vast majority of Jedi have been killed.
Um, SW always has wooden dialogue what movies were you watching?
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