Author Topic: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
Qui-Gon Tim 
Title: CR Emeritus: Memphis, TN
Registered: Apr '00
44112_Cade Skywalker
Date Posted: 8/22 1:11pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
TheDarknessX posted:
Trust me no one has ever accused you of drinking to much water! LOL! chicken

And who you callin' they?!? clown



Who's they? Where are you? What the hell's an "Aluminum Falcon"?



 

-----signature-----
Inked Monkey Productions: http://www.inkedmonkey.com
Official Sergeant-At-Arms and Token Deliah Blue Fanboy of the Cade Brigade
Once you go Blue, you never go back!
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Dork-Vader 
Title: Media Relations/Publicist
Memphis TN FanForce

Registered: May '03
6984_Vader<br>Galactic Heroes
Date Posted: 8/22 8:08pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
JohnJacksonMiller posted:
Well, it was the big bugaboo when the NFL was looking to come to town. They kept hedging over whether there was enough money and fan commitment in the area to make a go of it. And income used to be a problem, but the place is so populous now I don't think that's seen as a roadblock any more.

I hear what you're saying about Phoenix, but I think part of what helps there is that they have Atomic Comics, which as I seem to recall puts a lot of resources into local events. I think they also have a relatively larger pool of local talent to attend. Chaos Comics used to have its HQ out there, I think.


Choas was out that way- a bit more up north near Dave I believe, and I think Brian Pulido still lives out there and is usually at Cactuscon in PHX. Chaos held their Halloween parties up in Jerome, AZ at a haunted hotel back when they were still around.

Todd McFarlane is out in the Phoenix area and has two stores- Mesa and Tempe I believe, and made a Free Comic Book Day appearance at Atomic this year with all of the original Image creators. Steve Rude now lives outside Phoenix, so do Brian and Christy Miller/Hi-Fi Colors, Jay Fotos, Mike Bulloch, and several others I'm forgetting at the moment.

Atomic has about 4 or so locations (and does a ton of promotions), plus Samurai has at least 2 or 3, there's Spazdog, Todd's two stores (which sell more action figures than comics) and several other shops I've visited out there- including an Eisner winning store and one or two I haven't made it to. I've got to wonder- are there so many stores out there because there are so many fans, or are there so many fans because there are so many stores there? Or do they co-exist equally?

You're the numbers guy, John- what do you think- and is there a way to increase awareness in Memphis or are we just spinning the wheels on the Batmobile..?

Lin

 

-----signature-----
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Qui-Gon Tim 
Title: CR Emeritus: Memphis, TN
Registered: Apr '00
44112_Cade Skywalker
Date Posted: 8/22 9:04pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
Lin: As you and I both know, some things are just a matter of advertising and location. Remember that you and I put on the local con with the largest attendance in recent memory with TimmyCon! 2, and we did it with a great location in Bartlett and $22 worth of postcard ads put out at popular stores and hangouts throughout town. Not too shabby for something that was many minutes in the making. But, nonetheless, we did it because we did put the word out, which is more than MSC is doing year after year, and we did our event in a part of town where people actually want to venture on a regular basis.

As for the SMT and the MSCA, we're both one of those entities that when folks find us they say, "Had I known y'all were around, I would've joined years ago!". Both have managed to survive pretty well all this time, and both have managed to maintain a group of diehard members who have stuck around, but we really haven't seen any growth in either. A lot of this has to do with a lack of funds for advertising of our events.

So, I have a solution: We buy advertising space on the back of a local politician. I know we can't afford space on the Mayor's back, but we may be able to afford space on some of the members of the Ford family.

 

-----signature-----
Inked Monkey Productions: http://www.inkedmonkey.com
Official Sergeant-At-Arms and Token Deliah Blue Fanboy of the Cade Brigade
Once you go Blue, you never go back!
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
TNPredsFan 
Title: FF Chapter Rep
Memphis, TN

Registered: Nov '04
43245_Jarael
Date Posted: 8/22 9:24pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
As for SMT, we haven't really advertised ourselves in the past couple of years. The old website died, and we chose not to have a fan table at MSC because of the horrible layout at the old hotel. Heck, we haven't even had t-shirts made since I joined the group.

*looks at Lin for my promised t-shirt design* tongue

Let's face it, it's harder to generate enthusiasm for Star Wars when there are no new movies on the horizon. (No, the animated movie doesn't count.)

I'm hopeful that we can start raising awareness for the group with some of the things we have in the hopper. There are things we can do to promote ourselves without spending alot of money or resorting to renting a Ford family member.


 

-----signature-----
"I hate it when people I hate make sense." - Jarael, KotOR
"In...women courage is often mistaken for insanity. " - Iron Jawed Angels
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Dork-Vader 
Title: Media Relations/Publicist
Memphis TN FanForce

Registered: May '03
6984_Vader<br>Galactic Heroes
Date Posted: 8/22 10:56pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
TNPredsFan posted:
As for SMT, we haven't really advertised ourselves in the past couple of years. The old website died, and we chose not to have a fan table at MSC because of the horrible layout at the old hotel. Heck, we haven't even had t-shirts made since I joined the group.

*looks at Lin for my promised t-shirt design* tongue

Let's face it, it's harder to generate enthusiasm for Star Wars when there are no new movies on the horizon. (No, the animated movie doesn't count.)

I'm hopeful that we can start raising awareness for the group with some of the things we have in the hopper. There are things we can do to promote ourselves without spending a lot of money or resorting to renting a Ford family member.





I hear ya! happy

Next time we hang out let's kick around some ideas for a t-shirt and ads. I know we can get some more postcards done cheap- and the MSCA needs some, too. I'm hoping to get another art show together, just depends on if we can do it at work or at Adams, or some other space. I'll try and keep my eyes open for a TC!3 location, too.

Yeah, club members come and go for both groups. The MSCA has gone between 2-3 members at a dinner meeting to standing room only- especially at some of the meetings in the late 90's.

Lin

 

-----signature-----
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
kellrob 
Registered: Sep '04
24097_Shaak Ti
Date Posted: 8/23 10:57am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
I am all about a tshirt. I wear my Mid South Con shirt every Monday to work. I would love to brainstorm about how generate more interest in our little group.

As far as the advertisment for MSC, your right. I tried last year to put out flyers and no one wanted them. I got the small video game resale shop out here to take some, but they refused to put up a poster in the window. I don't know where to try to put those kind of things out. I hope we will be able to get some good ideas together.

 

-----signature-----
Fear is the path to the dark side. Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate... leads to suffering. I sense much fear in you.
Collecting: For those who understand, no explanation is needed; for those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
JohnJacksonMiller 
Title: Author:
-Empire
-Knights of the Old Republic

Registered: May '05
44263_Carth Onasi
Date Posted: 8/23 4:54pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
Dork-Vader posted:
You're the numbers guy, John- what do you think- and is there a way to increase awareness in Memphis or are we just spinning the wheels on the Batmobile..?


I honestly don't know. Shows are incredibly hard to run, and even harder to run for profit. The ones I enjoyed the most were always the ones that were operating deep in the red (probably trying to please people like me).

I do believe that we've had an artificial check on the size of MSC for many years because of location -- but I don't want to get into all that again. It would be interesting, though, to plug all the attendee Zip codes into a Googlemap and see where the geographical center is.

 

-----signature-----
Best,
John Jackson Miller
Comics, games and fiction: http://www.farawaypress.com
Comics research: http://www.comicschronicles.com
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Dork-Vader 
Title: Media Relations/Publicist
Memphis TN FanForce

Registered: May '03
6984_Vader<br>Galactic Heroes
Date Posted: 8/24 10:50am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
True- I do think the location was a big factor in holding that con back, and yeah- don't want to get into the other factors again. We did that again at Huey's the other night. wink

I hear ya about those "in the red" type of cons, but I've had a blast at some other shows like Cactuscon that just continue to kick butt and make you feel very welcome. I see a lot of that staff and attendees at other shows I attend like SDCC and Emerald City. That's one of those "not too big, not too small" cons that I think MSC could be if it wasn't for all of the in-fighting and lack of direction and opposition to growth and change I've witnessed. They've been running off fans, potential volunteers, and guests. Hopefully new leadership and location will help to change that.

Con-Sequential here ended up being very much in the red, even with us getting some great guests and trying to do a grass roots type of advertising to spread the word. We even tried to get some local folks to come out for free just to check it out and be part of it and they passed.

The two TIMMYCON!s were fun, and way cheap. If I can find a location for another BYOT event we'll do another. All of us local guys have a ton of product, good displays, and promo items that we could do another one and make it look ten times better now. Hopefully some of our media contacts would be able to come through for us, too.

I would be interested in seeing where the attendees for MSC come from, and if advertising outside the Memphis/midsouth area would be better. One thing for sure- you've got to have good looking promos to place around and well written press releases. I'm going to be working up some ideas for new SMT tees and maybe one or more of those ideas would get folks interested in fandom here. I think having promo materials at cons outside of Memphis (like Cape-Con, Metropolis, MTAC, Dragon Con, Nashville Horror, Con-Nooga, etc.) might get folks within driving distance to come to something here.

Any other ideas..?

Lin

 

-----signature-----
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
rhonderoo 
Title:
Former Head Admin

Registered: Aug '02
23966_Natalie Portman
Date Posted: 8/24 11:05am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
Get. A. Good. Venue.


Also, details like how good the food was at a con, or how well the Con Suite is run, even how nice the sleeping rooms are... a huge deal.

I've done sales conventions with booths, as well as training conferences and team building excursions, and it always comes down to how organized you are, how well you treat your guests, what guests you have and how fair the price is.

I'd be willing to help with the organizational details of anything we plan. True we don't have the resources that I have at International Paper when planning a conference, but a lot of things like organization of registering, etc. can still be applied. If we give ourselves time to do it right and use some fundraisers, we could put on a nice little show. Especially with some of your contacts, Lin.

 

-----signature-----
DT421 love
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Dork-Vader 
Title: Media Relations/Publicist
Memphis TN FanForce

Registered: May '03
6984_Vader<br>Galactic Heroes
Date Posted: 8/24 11:13am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force - Date Edited: 8/24 11:32am (1 edits total) Edited By: Dork-Vader
kellrob posted:
I am all about a tshirt. I wear my Mid South Con shirt every Monday to work. I would love to brainstorm about how generate more interest in our little group.

As far as the advertisment for MSC, your right. I tried last year to put out flyers and no one wanted them. I got the small video game resale shop out here to take some, but they refused to put up a poster in the window. I don't know where to try to put those kind of things out. I hope we will be able to get some good ideas together.


Keep an eye out for any locations that have freebie/promo stuff out or posters up (like Cats, Spin Street, Comic Cellar, Comics and Collectibles, etc.) that might be friendly. Keep a list of them and once we get some promo stuffs together we can start hitting those. And don't let a few places saying "no" get you down, and depending on the poster/promo/event maybe try asking someplace out of the ordinary- especially if they have a bulletin board. Ask to put a postcard(s) up on it and check the next time you're there to see if anyone bit.

Maybe when we go toy shopping take some postcard sized promos with us. Tim did that with the pens. Same thing for other events like Cooper/Young or the Clone Wars movie. If we see someone with a SW tee on say hi, tell them about the club, an give them a postcard if they seem interested. I know we're not all the most social of butterflies when it comes to talking to strangers, but maybe that SW tee could help break the ice. I've had more people stop and check out my table at cons when I've commented on the shirt or costume they're wearing.

Also, every con I've been to has a freebie table(s). Once we have materials together when any of us are hitting a show we can take a stack with us and put them out or give them to folks we talk to/meet. Even if they don't live in Memphis they may not have a fan force near them, have family here or are from here (like JJM), are Elvis fans, are within driving distance, and/or looking for fellow SW fans to chat with or events to go to.

Don't know if MSC has approached local bookstores or not about putting up posters/flyers, or seeing about working out a signing appearance for any authors or artists they have coming. It would be a chance for them to let folks know that writer/artist would be at the con all weekend (doing more signings, panels, breakfast/coffee get togethers, etc.), and let people know that there is a con in town. Comics and Collectibles has done it before and I heard several people at Mark Waid's signing say they had no idea there was a convention going on that weekend, they just saw a blurb about the signing in the paper or in-store flyer. Since MSC is a sci-fi lit con, doing some cross promotion with local book stores could help sales at the store, raise awareness of the con, and maybe increase sales and awareness for the creators- wouldn't that be nice! The stores could do an in-store display with the books they've written/drawn with some info about the signings and con.

Feel free to mention any of this stuff to the powers that be at the next MSC meeting. I don't hate the con or want to see it fail. Quite the opposite in fact- I'd love to have a kick-butt con in our backyard. I just haven't been happy with what I've seen and been apart of the past couple years- especially this last one. Hoping they can turn it around this year. I'd go back if they can.

Lin

 

-----signature-----
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Dork-Vader 
Title: Media Relations/Publicist
Memphis TN FanForce

Registered: May '03
6984_Vader<br>Galactic Heroes
Date Posted: 8/24 11:27am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
rhonderoo posted:
Get. A. Good. Venue.


Also, details like how good the food was at a con, or how well the Con Suite is run, even how nice the sleeping rooms are... a huge deal.

I've done sales conventions with booths, as well as training conferences and team building excursions, and it always comes down to how organized you are, how well you treat your guests, what guests you have and how fair the price is.

I'd be willing to help with the organizational details of anything we plan. True we don't have the resources that I have at International Paper when planning a conference, but a lot of things like organization of registering, etc. can still be applied. If we give ourselves time to do it right and use some fundraisers, we could put on a nice little show. Especially with some of your contacts, Lin.


I do get around... wink

See, here's another point- Tim, Rhonda, and I have all been to con-committee meetings and wanted to pull our hair out by the time it was all over. Chaos does not dose not even begin to describe what I witnessed, and it made three potential volunteers run away screaming.

I was really disappointed in the way they treated and promoted Len Wein this year- that's no secret, as is what I thought about the way they treated JJM, local creators like the MSCA, or fans who attended. They really need to step up their game if they want to keep it going. They also need to look at their pricing and spending. I think it's been seriously overpriced for years- especially with some of the cons I've seen around the country, and they've been spending $ on things I think they could have gotten donated or done without. Speaking of which- if they are so proud of the con-suite, why does it smell like a trash heap and why do they not promote a more sanitary experience? I'd love a cool place to go sit, have a drink, and talk geeky stuff at the con. It's gotten to where the smell alone would keep you from that end of the hall.

Ok, enough bitchin' from me about that.

I agree with Rhonda- I think we could pool our resources and put together a fun show in the future. One not to compete with MSC, but maybe give us some of what we feel is missing from cons here.

Lin


 

-----signature-----
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
TNPredsFan 
Title: FF Chapter Rep
Memphis, TN

Registered: Nov '04
43245_Jarael
Date Posted: 8/25 7:11am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force - Date Edited: 8/25 7:12am (1 edits total) Edited By: TNPredsFan
I agree with everything Rhonda said. It all comes down to good location, good organization and good value for the money.

I don't know how many bookstores MSC approached, but I saw a MSC poster in Davis-Kidd last year. One poster next to the Sci-Fi books in a store the size of Davis-Kidd? raised_brow

I have yet to see advertisements of any type in the Southaven/Olive Branch area. That is a huge missed opportunity. If it doesn't change with the con moving to Olive Branch...well, to be blunt, they deserve to fail for being so stupid.

If you are running any type of con in this area, you must advertise in the following areas IMO because this is where the people and the money are:

- Germantown/Cordova/Bartlett
- Southaven/Olive Branch
- Midtown
- Downtown
- The universities -- U of M, CBU, Rhodes, Northwest, etc. (Someone should be plastering every student building at the U of M with flyers.)


 

-----signature-----
"I hate it when people I hate make sense." - Jarael, KotOR
"In...women courage is often mistaken for insanity. " - Iron Jawed Angels
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Qui-Gon Tim 
Title: CR Emeritus: Memphis, TN
Registered: Apr '00
44112_Cade Skywalker
Date Posted: 8/25 8:11am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
And you need to advertise several months before, not a week before or the week of. I've lived in the Memphis area all my life, and I had never even heard of MSC until 2003 when they approached me about the SMT. So, for 20+ years there was a hometown Con that I, a certified Sci-Fi geek, had no idea existed. What does that tell you about their advertising? I'm not saying they need expensive, flashy TV commercials, but they do need to consider other methods.

As far as the value-per-ticket, the $45 admission is just too damned high. For a Con where the only names I recognize are my friends in the Comics industry and my own, $45 is just ludicrously expensive, especially considering that I paid $95 for a ticket to Celebration III that was packed with names I did know from all genres: Comics, Literature, Movies, etc. (But, MSC will always remind you that they are not a media con. That's they usual excuse for not having any big-name guests.)

Back to advertising: You know, you can have guests that aren't big names, but advertise what they did instead of just listing their name. Someone might actually recognize what they're involved in, even though they don't know their name, and may decide to come to the Con because of that little bit of extra knowledge that they gained from the ad.

 

-----signature-----
Inked Monkey Productions: http://www.inkedmonkey.com
Official Sergeant-At-Arms and Token Deliah Blue Fanboy of the Cade Brigade
Once you go Blue, you never go back!
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
JohnJacksonMiller 
Title: Author:
-Empire
-Knights of the Old Republic

Registered: May '05
44263_Carth Onasi
Date Posted: 8/25 9:03am Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force
I very much do not want to get into a debate on MSC specifically -- again, they've treated me very well and I am happy to attend.

But I would hasten to add that a major difference between the kinds of cons you're talking about is between volunteer/non-profit efforts and for-profit convention organizers with full-time staff year-round. That's why you hear from the cons you do hear from six and nine months before the event; there's someone sitting in an office with a budget whose job when they go in on Monday is to get the fliers produced and the e-mail newsletters sent and the ads placed and what have you. Maybe they're an employee of the con; maybe they're an employee of a sister firm that runs the show (like a retail store). By contrast, when these things get done at the volunteer shows, it comes from the free time of everyone involved -- which is why you see so much variance from convention to convention, and even from year to year within the same conventions. (San Diego is a rarity, a non-profit with a full-time year-round staff; but it's in a whole different class, as several people trying to match it have found.)

When it comes to attending con board meetings, I think the most instructional one might be the one afterward, when they look at the after-action budget and set the new one for the following year. In the case of the con we've been talking about, my guess is that if every single attendee came in with a three-day pass for $45, the total gate would have been less than $60k -- and I can't but imagine the exhibition space would have cost the lion's share of that. And that's another thing to look at with volunteer shows: cash flow, or what months in the year they have the money and what months they don't. My assumption is that most cons don't get many preregistrations at all in the nine months after the previous show -- and so presuming a con breaks even, any of the advertising or things we're talking about has to go on some volunteer's credit card.

That's why my props go to show promoters in general. Some do it better than others -- and I guess that's always an area for discussion. But I don't envy the job. (Literally -- at various times, my old company was in talks to buy several well-known shows in fandom fields; I think my advice was always that it was too darn hard, and we'd rather let someone else run the shows and enjoy going to them!)

 

-----signature-----
Best,
John Jackson Miller
Comics, games and fiction: http://www.farawaypress.com
Comics research: http://www.comicschronicles.com
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History
Qui-Gon Tim 
Title: CR Emeritus: Memphis, TN
Registered: Apr '00
44112_Cade Skywalker
Date Posted: 8/25 12:27pm Subject: RE: The Rendezvous- The Official Social Thread of the Memphis Fan Force - Date Edited: 8/25 12:48pm (2 edits total) Edited By: Qui-Gon Tim
John: I'm hopeful that MSC will grow with its new location, but knowing their resistance to both suggestion and change makes me doubtful. I realize fully that they are a volunteer organization. However, if they want new volunteers, they're going to have to get over this idea of doing things "because that's the way it's always been done". It's this perception they're exuding that is robbing them of fresh blood, and of some very well-connected and experienced people, such as Lin and Rhonda, respectively.

And as for being a volunteer organization, that's become their excuse for anything that goes wrong, and their defense when you make any suggestion on changing things. I am hopeful that a the recent change in leadership with bring about a new era for the Con, and they'll grow with it, but, volunteer organization or not, you have to look at some things from a business standpoint: If they don't advertise, how can anyone know they even exist? If they charge too much for admission, why would a casual fan want to bother shelling out $45 on guests they don't give a darn about, much less even ever heard of? Do they renegotiate a venue deal with added ballrooms per the number of rooms filled by Con attendees? If they can't meet expenses, what do they cut from the budget?

I'm well aware that the cons I'm mentioning are run by for-profit companies. (Although you see how much good that did GenCon!) But, MSC can still hold back funds from the previous year to cover startup costs for the following year. If they're not doing that, then they're doing something wrong. Even non-profits have operating costs they have to cover. If they're not budgeting for these known, future expenses, then they're doing something incredibly wrong. After nearly 30 years, you'd think they'd know how to do this with some efficiency.

Frankly, y'all, if I won the lottery tomorrow, we'd have a new Con in this town by the end of the year. And I don't want to steal any of MSC's thunder- They are what they are, like it or not, and that's what I guess they'll always be.

And, honestly, I wouldn't mind being a guest again if the past three years hadn't been such a complete stressful headache in terms of setting up and dealing with people who seem repeatedly clueless, or who seem apathetic because you aren't a filker or a furry or something they're interested in. I'm glad you've had a positive experience with them, John, I just wish I could say the same. Part of me really wants to say, "yeah, I'll give them another chance with this new venue", but I know it's not going to make that much of a difference, and my two partners in crime (and TFP) are already fed up with them (and have been so longer than I have) and aren't going back. (Can't do a three-character puppet show with only one guy. Well, you can, but it takes a lot of determination and Meth.)

 

-----signature-----
Inked Monkey Productions: http://www.inkedmonkey.com
Official Sergeant-At-Arms and Token Deliah Blue Fanboy of the Cade Brigade
Once you go Blue, you never go back!
Post Reply | Quote Reply | Active Topic Notification | Private Message | Post History