Scene-by-Scene Analysis of The Phantom Menace

It's strange that this scene wasn't included on the dvd, 'cause there was so much talk about it beforehand. To bad, I'd love to see Ewans "Apocalypse Now" ascent from the water.

Does anyone if this shot was filmed in an actual forest? Because I read that they had to do blue screen pick-up shots of some forest scenes, but I dont know which ones and I cant distinguish the location shot scenes from the blue screen scenes (courtesy of ILM). I suspect that the pick-up shots are the ones later in the film where OB1 appologises to Qui-Gon for disagreeing about Ani though, 'cause Ewan looks a little different there.

 

Hey OB1-715,

Good thread. I will be linking to it from one of my threads in the III spoiler forum.

Incidentally, my thread dares to answer one of the questions that has troubled you: why did George cut the scene where Sidious chokes Gunray?

I believe I know the answer; at the risk of potentially being spoiled, you can check out my thread called THE BOYZ IN THE HOOD.

-H3

 

The Living Force-

It's actually fairly easy to distinguish the pick up shots, at least the ones featuring McGregor in TPM and AOTC. Despite the leaps made in CG technology over the years, a good wig or beard can't be seamlessly inserted into the final film.

I would have really liked to see Obi-Wan's "Apocalypse Now" shot too. It was shot on the last day of cinematography actually. "The Beginning" documentary on the TPM DVD shows McGregor actually filming that very shot.

 

I've been busy lately, so it's been awhile since I've post a new chapter, but here's chapters 7 and 8.

Chapter 7: Otah Gunga

In earlier drafts:

Jar Jar describes the Gungans as a peaceful, kind sort, but warns that they aren't friendly to outsiders and will likely throw Obi-Wan into prison.

The droids release remotes to hunt the Jedi down. One enters the lake. (I think just a few simple shots like this would have made the danger and urgency of the Jedi's situation more apparent. In the final film, we know the Jedi are in a hurry to reach the Naboo, but we don't have a real sense that they are being pursued or in any sort of "real" danger.)

Did you notice?

Jar Jar looks back in dispair at Qui-Gon when Captain Tarpals says he's going to the bosses.

Obi-Wan's look of shock when Jar Jar is zapped.

All of the Gungans stare at the new arrivals then quickly scurry away.

In the commentary:

George Lucas states that it's tricky to come up with new, interesting environments that fit the world he's created.

Chapter 8: Boss Noss

In earlier drafts:

Qui-Gon says that he hopes Jar Jar's punishment won't be too severe. Boss Nass replies that Jar Jar will be pounded to death.

Fish would drop through the outer bubble into the meeting room, which a young Gungan would collect and push back out.

Boss Nass attempts to contact the Naboo. The entire bubble fills with static and a technician announces that communications are down.

Did you notice?

Qui-Gon uses the Jedi Mind Trick twice.

Boss Nass' sinister grin after mentioning Jar Jar will be punished.

Jar Jar's look when Qui-Gon first suggests freeing him. Jar Jar can't believe that anyone would care enough to help him out. The script describes Jar Jar's look as "soulful."

In the commentary:

George Lucas states this is another one of his favorite scenes because almost all the characters are digital and it doesn't feel like an animated film.

My thoughts: A lot of people have a problem with this scene because they feel the momentum the film has previously established comes to a halt when the Jedi meet Boss Nass. Maybe this could have been avoided by not actually showing Boss Nass, but keeping him a hidden threat (even more "phantom menaces") and have the Jedi and Jar Jar sneak around and steal a Bongo. Or maybe Jar Jar and the Jedi could have been thrown in prison. The Jedi wouldn't resist arrest or attack the people, (It's not in their character.) but escape their cells and use none lethal means, like the Jedi Mind Trick, to sneak around Otah Gunga, steal a Bongo, and escape. Obi-Wan could mention sarcastically that the force has a strong influence on the weak minded, which would "rhyme" with episode IV. Then in the Bongo, Qui-Gon could explain to Jar Jar that it's not the Jedi way to harm others or steal, but the urgency of their situation presents no other choice. That way, the nature of the Jedi would be explained while the Jedi are on the run. This would be similar to James Cameron having Reese deliver exposition while hiding in the original Terminator film.

By the way, by no means am I trying to say I could have made a better film than Mr. Lucas. There is no way I could have come up with the worlds and situations he has. All I'm doing is looking at something in existance and saying, well people don't like this scene because of this, so maybe George Lucas could have done this or that. I'm a fan of the film as is.

 

"Darth Sidious chokes him, lifts him in the air and says, "You fool, my reach is far greater than the Jedi. Only a Sith Lord can wield the power of the Force over such a great distance.""
I agree mostly with RogueSith, but it'd been even more powerful scene without any explanation from Sidious. Why would he need to explain any of his deeds to Neimoidians?
A simple Force-choke and he could've turned to more pressing business: "Begin landing your troops."
He's the cock of the flock, and he knows it.

And what comes to JJB, I admit that it's a magnificent work of CG, but that doesn't make the character any better. When I'm talking about JJB, I don't talk about the CGI, I hate that creature as much as some real people.
Quite an accomplishment from ILM and GL.

 

Very good thread.

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Obi-WanKenobi715

Darth Sidious using the force to choke and lift Dofine would certainly "echo" Vader from the original trilogy. And we all know how much Lucas likes his films to "echo" and "rhyme."

DarthVegas

Chapters 1-3, brilliant. Shows the Jedi are a force to be reckoned with. I'm very glad Sidious did not Force Choke the Nemuodian. That would take it way from Vader, it's HIS trademark, dig?

The force choke would have been nice and would have established it more as a Sith talent, not just a Vader thing and I also think it could have been a sort of pre-echo.

This is what I got from the commentary last year when you first see Sidious. (word-for-word)

[George Lucas] "Introducing Darth Sidious as a hologram, was a way he was introduced actually in Empire strikes back, which was the first time we actually saw him in the first three films, so I thought it appropriate to keep that thematic device going, only know him as a hologram and not actually deal with him, except in one small scene as a real person because I did want to make sure that you knew that he wasn't just a hologram, make him some sort of flesh and blood." [George Lucas]

Obi-WanKenobi715

It's interesting to note that both Darth Sidious and Senator Palpatine are first introduced via hologram. Intentional? Definitely.

Ooo-yeah!

DarthVegas

I always imagine a scene that showed the Battle Droids as fierce simply because they could NOT be reasoned with, they are machines doing what they are programmed to do... kill, destroy, and report back to HQ. I would've loved to see them rampaging and marching through the city with blasters on high power. We saw none of this. We saw NOTHING. We got no idea that the battle droids were even the slightest threat. All we saw was that they were cannon fodder and that those who had surrendered to them were as weak as children. We have no idea of how harsh they could be.

Absolutly.

Ok the Naboo are pacifists, I belive, but I think it would have been better to show more of the invasion of Theed.

[/blockquote]RogueSith

Chapter 5 - Good visual of the ships landing, but I've never like the design of the battle droids, they just seem so frail.[/blockquote]

Also, the Battle Droids were modelled after dead Nemoidians I belive, because they thought they looked more fierce.

And of course the Droids made were on the cheap, which partly explains what happens at the end.

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EDIT: Pictures

 

Eh! What?

Why is the emoticon that big?

 

Up.

 

Chapter 9: The Planet Core (also includes brief Invasion Schedule scene)

In earlier drafts:

Before entering the Bongo, a search droid catches up with Obi-Wan and Jar Jar, which Obi-Wan quickly slices. (Think Qui-Gon dispatching the probe droid in the deleted scene.) Obi-Wan then realizes the Gungan city is now in danger. (This short bit would have been a welcome addition, creating a palpable sense of urgency and danger.)

Boss Nass describes the planet core in more detail, stating that an incredibly skilled Gungan could successfully navigate the core, but it hadn't been done in his lifetime.

Jar Jar is drug to the Bongo. Obi-Wan uses the Jedi Mind Trick to convince the Gungan their trip will be a safe one.

The Opee Sea Killer shot paralyzing spit balls.

The invasion of Theed was shown in greater detail. Once the army arrives undetected, Nute Gunray orders a full scale assault. (Again, it would have been nice to see the Federation do a little damage to Naboo. It'd make them more threatening and make the audience feel some sympathy for the Naboo's plight. As it stands now, the Federation uses Theed for little more than a parking lot.)

There was no, "There's always a bigger fish," line. When the Bongo escaped the jaws of the Opee Sea Killer, Qui-Gon asks, "How'd you do that?" Obi-Wan replies, "I'm not sure."

Obi-Wan tells Jar Jar he's not very good with mechanical things. (I think George was trying to distinguish Anakin's skills with this small bit of dialogue. He's attempting to show Anakin's mechanical expertise isn't just another Jedi trait, but an individual gift.)

Sidious tells the Viceroy when the invasion is complete, Queen Amidala must meet an unfortunate "accident." The Viceroy is wary of this plan, believing with Amidala dead, the Federation will have trouble controling the masses. Sidious assures the Viceroy their Federation army will be more than enough.

Qui-Gon orders the Bongo, "Full speed ahead," when the Opee Sea Killer begins to give chase. Jar Jar accidently sends the sub into reverse and right into the Sea Killer's mouth. Obi-Wan then seizes the controls from the Gungan.

This bit of dialogue was deleted. (I've included lines that are still in the film as a reference point.)

Jar Jar: Where wesa goen?
Qui-Gon: You're the navigator.
Jar Jar: Yo dreamen mesa hopen . . .
Qui-Gon: Just relax. The force will guide us.

In the commentary:

Lucas states that the movie moves from the planet core, to the Federation starship, and back again to keep the plot moving and remind the audience that the Federation is a threat and they're still looking for the Jedi.

Did you notice?

The chunk of ship the Opee Sea Killer bit off.

The baby Colo Claw Fish crawling up the cave wall. When the power comes back, the Bongo's lights blast into the mothers eyes, who then attempts to protect her young.

My thoughts: As I've stated before I think the first act on Naboo is well paced. It's hard to comment on the individual scenes and their importance to the saga because very little of significance happens. Lucas basically puts the Jedi in cliffhanger after cliffhanger and shows that the Jedi encounter these situations every day. Think about it. In the first 20 minutes the Jedi escape from poison gas, mow through battle droids and stow away aboard ships, reach Naboo and must flee the planet wildlife and Federation army, encounter more droids, swim to an underground city, and encounter 3 dangerous animals as they travel through the planet core.

I think the situation on Naboo was created to allow the movie to stand on its own. Lucas states that this film is like the first act of a play, which usually establishes the key players. That's what this film does. It introduces the characters, shows where they came from, and sets up plot points that will only make more sense once the saga is viewed as a whole. The film also shows how the Senate and Jedi Council go about their business. The film obviously does more than that, but scenes on Naboo usually consist of cl

 

wow great thread!

i have come late so ill do some catching up.
i liked the opening chapters 1-5 were all good in my book but my only gripe was the governor's line: "a communications disruption can mean only one thing...invasion" - it was a calmly spoken statement for a start, and i dont think naboo is that war hardened to know what happens with communication disruptions. i think confusion and concern dialogue amongst the attendees in the theed palace may have been a better alternative in my opinion. the audience sees the invasion anyway and if the governor was so certain then at least resistance could have occured at the city or the queen could have fled earlier.

in regards to sideous' force choke in the storyboards. i dont think the neimodians were aware that they were dealing with a sith at that point. it becomes apparent that the deal gets worse and worse as the movie progresses.

i would also have liked the lightsaber lecture to obi-wan put in the story (chapter 6) as it is a neatly followed theme in AOTC.

the swim to otoh gunga and the scenes thru the planet core did give me the feeling that the movie was slowing up in terms of action. i just had a thought (whilst reading this thread) about some extra action as the jedi landed. i would have really like seeing the jedi spectacularly hijacking two STAPs and speeding towards the theed palace through the forests to mirror the speeder bikes scenes in ROTJ. alas then jar jar would have never had a place in star wars, and it would of been harder to find and convince the gungans to fight at the end.

the underwater scenes as is, though, do a pretty good job despite the somewhat hurried discussion infront of boss nass

 

I think an important element of the first few scences of TPM is the fact that it begins above a Paradise-world of lush natural beauty and then the action quickly moves to that planet. If we look at the beginning of ANH, it begins above a wasteland of a planet and then quickly moves to that planet...thus establishing the theme that all is not right with the universe, under the Empire things have become like a desert. However, the end of ANH ends with the lush jungles of Yavin. Therefore, within ANH, we see the movement from wasteland to revitalized world, symbolizing the hope in the future that Skywalker represents for the galaxy.

Lucas kept this motif with the OT by having RotJ end on Endor, another lush Paradise-world of natural beauty. So, the entire OT moves from wasteland to Paradise.

Now, with the first few scenes of TPM, we see that the world under the Old Republic is first presented to us in another Paradise-type world. This means that the entire six episode saga will record a movement from Paradise to Wasteland and then a restoration to Paradise.

This adds a very consistant feel to this particular dimension of the story. If TPM had started on Tatooine, for example, a mixed message would have been sent as the time of the Old Republic is supposed to be a kind of Avalon/ideal time.

 

Great thread. Nice analysis Hat matter.

I love the underwater scenes on their own, but think they're in the wrong part of the movie.

In the eralier drafts there is an attack on Theed, however brief.

The battle droids launch an attack and the Naboo troops are wiped out.

The actual attack would've placed more emphasis on the Naboo/TF plot. there was even dialogue about "seperatists" being an invasion excuse. That was a brilliant idea Lucas came up with. It parallels Hilter's invasion of Austria excuse.

I love ILM's Otah Gunga shots too.

 

This thread's awesome! I wish I could have been here to comment on some of the earlier things... I'll come in with my comments on the next chapter.

-sj loves kevin spacey

 

Chapter 10: Invasion of Theed

In earlier drafts:

Reaching Theed before the Federation army, Obi-Wan and Jar Jar are met by a curious crowd and eventually Naboo guards who escort the Jedi and his companion to Theed Palace. Obi-Wan then convinces Queen Amidala to flee before the invasion begins.

Reaching Theed palace, a Naboo guard tells Jar Jar to wait outside. (This would have been a nice addition. One of the main themes of this film is acceptance and you have to admit, by the end of this film, when Boss Nass exclaims "Peace!" while holding that orb, it doesn't really have any resonance because I never really got a true sense of hostility between the Naboo and Gungans. Sure, Boss Nass tells the Jedi that the Gungans don't like the Naboo, but that's just dialogue. It's obvious better to show something than tell something and the Naboo Guards telling the Gungan to wait outside would have shown the inferred racial hostility. As it stands now, I get a better sense of hostility among droids and humans in Mos Eisley in Episode IV than the Gungans and Naboo in Episode I.)

Queen Amidala insists that the Naboo rulers must warn the people not to fight the Federation. Amidala is sure her people can resist occupation, but not openly challenge the Federation.

Entering Theed, speakers on the Trade Federation transports issue the following message to the Naboo. "Do not resist. We will not harm you. We bring you peace." When Naboo security moves to intercept the army, they're completely wiped out. (This would have also been a welcome addition. Any scene that would add menace to the Federation and generate sympathy for the Naboo is worthy of inclusion in the final film.)

Nute Gunray and Rune Haako hadn't arrived when discussing the treaty. Nute and Rune communicate their plans to Amidala via holograms. An obviously frustrated Amidala calls Nute "a little coward." (This would've been an interesting inclusion. Qui-Gon said Federation types are cowards. This would've shown that and also shown that Amidala isn't always able to conceal her emotions under that regal facade.)

My thoughts: I find it interesting that the invasion is told solely through visuals and music. Both are impressive. But, as I've stated earlier, anything that would've made the Federation more menacing and therefore create a little more sympathy for the Naboo would be more than a welcome addition.

 

Deleted Scene 3: Waterfall Sequence

In earlier drafts:

After escaping the waterfall, as seen in the deleted scene on the DVD, Obi-Wan remarks, "That was close." A Battle Droid, heard off screen, orders the group to drop their weapons. Qui-Gon swiftly destroys the droid, but a stray bolt from its blaster slices the cord holding the Bongo, sending it over the waterfall.

On the DVD:

George Lucas says the scene is exciting and interesting on its own, but ultimately delays the rescue of the Queen. It's also explained that the invasion of the Naboo is supposed to be tragic and Jar Jar scrambling out of the Bongo in a slapstick matter took away from the danger and importance of the situation. (If that's the case, why weren't his battle field antics at the end of the film also cut?)

My thoughts: I struggle with whether this should've been left in the final film or not. The effects certainly aren't up to par with the final film, but easily could be and the scene would add just one more cliffhanger to the first half hour. It'd be nice to see the Jedi survive and reaching land, suddenly to be met by more battle droids. I realized earlier that we've never actually seen a Jedi throw an ignited lightsaber through a bunch of foes and then use the force to call the weapon back. I always thought it was a cool move in various Lucasarts videogames. It'd been cool if Obi-Wan had done that in this scene. Before Qui-Gon has a chance to react, an ignited lightsaber is whipped through the air and called back to Obi-Wan's hand. Qui-Gon glances toward the direction the order came from, noticing only rubble, then back at Obi-Wan who lets out a self assured smile.)

 

Chapter 11: Surprise Rescue

In earlier drafts:

The Queen's starship was located in a secret landing platform beneath a fountain. The ship, which Captain Panaka claims to contain a cloaking device and a few weapons, would rise from the water when needed. (That would have been a sweet visual.)

Queen Amidala prevents Jar Jar from boarding her ship. Obi-Wan argues with the Queen, who eventually allows the Gungan to stay, although she orders Obi-Wan to keep him in the droid hold. (I've said it before, and I'll say it again, more hostility at the beginning equals more resonance when peace is reached at the end.)

Battle Droids shoot at the Naboo Starship as it blasts out of the hangar. (It would have been cool to see this shot, especially if it was similar to the shot of the Falcon blasting out of Mos Eisley in the Special Edition. It would have also been cool to see some STAPS chase after the Queen's Starship.)

In the commentary:

It's revealed that Ben Burt walks like a duck and did a motion capture for the Battle Droids. Lucas liked the "duck walk" so much that he kept it.

Did you know?

The confusion of the droids (Coruscant, uh, wait, that doesn't compute, um . . .you're under arrest.) and "Roger, Roger" aren't located in the final shooting script.

Did you notice?

The reflection on the Queen's Starship.

My thoughts: I love the Jedi's confidence and precision when confronting battle droids.

Panaka: There's too many of them.
Qui-Gon: Won't be a problem.

Panaka: We'll have to free those pilots.
Obi-Wan: I'll deal with that.

The action is really great, albeit brief and I love how Qui-Gon takes control of the situation.

 

I agree with what you've said about the earlier drafts. They do seem to show more tension between the Gungans and the Naboo that would be useful to the story. Also, it seems like there are more things hinting at Obi-Wan's arrogance, which is not really as apparent in the film as it might have been. Because I think that's an important thing. It's brought up in AOTC briefly, but I think it needs to be very evident as a reason for Anakin's poor training.

I liked the deleted scene well enough, but it wasn't really necessary. As for the invasion scene itself, it's ok, but again, Jar-Jar's slapstick antics... why were they left in here if Lucas wanted this taken more seriously?

-sj loves kevin spacey

 

i also agree that some hostility towards jar jar by the palace guards would have been really good, but not by the queen when they board. remember that the queen is only 14 and would still have an element of child-like innocence and wouldnt understand the racism or hostility or whatever the grudge is between the naboo and the gungans.

i am actually glad that the waterfall scene was not put back in for the jar jar slapstick reason but moreso because of the way it made the jedi look. thus far in the movie they have literally danced through "deadly" battle droids and been relatively calm and unconcerned about the creatures of the deep. now look at the way they struggle across that wire from the bongo - like mere mortals would. i believe that TPM did a good job showing that only a sith can rattle a jedi, not droids, huge sea monsters and not a waterfall.

i enjoyed the rescue scene where the jedi made mincemeat of those droids - QGJ was pure class being in the process of "sheathing" his lightsabre as he deactivated it and force pushing the two droids - one of which said "D'OH"

also the hangar scene was great although that droids dialogue was a bit cheesy.

 

BUMP!!!

 

You've got to love Panaka. "There's too many of them!" "We'll be sitting ducks!" ... thank you, Captain Obvious!

I the rescue scene, but the escaping-the-federation-ships scene is pretty bad, with Ric Olié and Panaka both stating the obvious. Even Qui-Gon joins in! Obi-Wan is smart enough to keep his mouth shut. Maybe that's becase he just fell in love with the Queen

 

Great thread

No time to comment on too much now though.
Although I think one of the reasons Lucas cut out Amidala being especially rude to Jar Jar was the fact that Anakin falls for and eventually marries this person so the audience has to warm up to her somewhat.
That's fairly hard to do if she's being a jerk to an innocent being.
However, having Panaka or Ric not liking Jar Jar ('I don't want that thing on this ship!') would have been alright.
The big problem, I think, Lucas was faced with this time around was he knew two more movies were coming, and that they would be followed by three more movies.
He couldn't floor the audiemce from day run and risk having to continually top himself.
If the Naboo crisis was chalked up too much, then it might have taken away from the Seperatist crisis, or, it might have made the Naboo crisis seem overblown.
Plus, Lucas may very well be saving plot points/sequences for later like the idea of Speratists.
So he has to really balance the flow beforehand. Look at what to keep, what to save, and what to disreguard as each movie comes along.
An interesting task really. But I think that's why you have a lot of 'well this should have been bigger' or 'why didn't he do this instead?' moments.
Like the saber in water thing. He may have gotten rid of it because he might have been toying with the idea of an underwater saber sequence. Kamino maybe? But that was ultimately chlked up to a rain fight.
So, I do think there's a rhym and reason to Lucas' methods.

 

"a Naboo guard tells Jar Jar to wait outside."
Possibly pointing his gun at JJB would've emphasised the distrust.

 

And pulling the trigger, even.

-sj loves kevin spacey

 

I'm no longer going to be able to run this thread. Not that I was that consistant on my posts anyway, but if anyone is willing to continue this thread, PM me. I would prefer if this person would have the insider's guide, so they could give insight into earlier versions of the script.

 

I can't help but feel this is all my fault
Oh curse my metal body! Why did I have to post?