Around the Arena (Qualifying Game 1 Started, Topic 1 Posted)

Let's see:

R...J: Very good points, loved the chair humor so +3
horsey: good stuff, so a plus 2, but he might be 19, he could be 23.
whitey: you're trusting the NBA execs? okay, I guess. +2

And, of course, R...J ... you snubbed LeBron so -1, though I did like your Michelle Wie point. But not enough for a point.

Scoreboard:

This round:

Rouge...Jedi: 2
s65horsey: 2
whiteeagle: 2
ApolloSmileGirl: -1

Overall:

whiteeagle: 21
Rogue...Jedi: 19
s65horsey: 17
ApolloSmileGirl: 8

 

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The Yankees completed a sweep of the Red Sox today. The sweep puts them only five games back in the East, with three more head-to-head games remaining. Meanwhile, the Mariners were swept by the Angels yesterday, putting them also at five games back in the West, with four head-to-head games remaining. Who are you buying as having the better chance to win their division crown this year?

Let's go Around the Arenaand find out ...

 

As much as I would like to say the Mariners, I have to go with the Yankees, and not just because of history. The Mariners have lost 6 straight now, and have to right their ship first. Even though the Yankees have a tougher team in front of them in the Red Sox, they still have a better chance at catching them. That said, neither will end up winning the division, because the Red Sox and Angels will both hang on to their leads, and the Yankees will have to settle for the Wild Card, which they will win.

 

I'm going with the Yankees. Their pitching was excellent in this last series. With Pettittle. Clemons, and Wang controlling the game, they're sure to pick up more wins, giving them a better chance at winning the division. Wang allowed 1 hit in 7 innings for the last game. Clemons has 2 hits and 1 run during his game.

The Red Socks could come off of this game with fire, but they need their players heathy first. Ramirez and his replacement, Kielty, were pulled from the first game. Ramirez is a good hitter for the Red Socks and he wasn't there for the other two games. Though the Yankees pitching was excellent, sometimes it only takes one thing to turn the momentum around.

 

I won't comment on the players' names' spelling, but Red Socks? I think the entire city of Boston just winced.

That said, I agree with most of your points, and what is most notable is how the Yankees have turned the season around, salvaging a decent season after that pitifully bad start.

 

I really hate baseball. Its just not the same as it used to be. Sorry to the city of Boston.

 

The Yankees. Just for the simple fact they've been the best team in baseball since the All-star break. The only pitcher thats hasnt really pitched well is Moose. But I like how they are relying on these young guys in the stretch run. Cause if they make the playoffs, they make the playoffs if they dont well these future guys get a taste of whats its all about.

I just dont think the Mariners can sustain keeping up w/ the Angels and the Yankees at the same time. Their bullpen is great, the starting pitching eh, not so much. And thats really whats its all about pitching.

 

I'll get an update up soon guys. I'm exhausted. Got ~3 hours of sleep last night, and did ~8 hours of driving today, to and from a family reunion, and now I need to prep for a week of work, and adjust for a short week at that. Might be able to get it up tonight, but we'll see.

 

I certainly understand, I've had one 7.5 hour drive already this weekend with another tomorrow and not a lot of time free. Whenever you get it up is fine.

 

Ok, let's get through this:

R...J: +2 (good point on momentum)
horsey: +2 (good point on Yankee pitching) -1 (Red Socks?)
whitey: +2 (good info on pitching)
ASG: -1

Scoreboard:

This Round:

Rogue...Jedi: 2
whiteeagle: 2
s65horsey: 1
ApolloSmileGirl: -1

Overall:

whiteeagle: 23
Rogue...Jedi: 21
s65horsey: 18
ApolloSmileGirl: 7

And so we say goodbye to ASG, and ready ourselves to go into Out of Bounds

 

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Rodney Harrison has been suspended for four games for violating the league's substance abuse policy, including use of HGH. Wade Wilson got five games, also for HGH problems. This comes on the heels of a bust involving a former Steelers employee being connected with steroid distribution.

So tell me, oh great panel of experts, are we going to end up with asterisks in football? How widespread is the steroid problem? What's the general state of the NFL and drug use?

Let's go Around the Arena and find out from our panel of experts ...

 

I actually think this stems from the WWE thing that happened a few months ago with Chris Benoit. People were blaming steroid use on what happened, the WWE has come under scrutiny for it, and the NFL decided they'd better crack down a bit to prove that they care about the players.

Harrison admits to using HGH, which aren't the same thing as steroids, but HGH was also found at the scene of the Benoit murders. I also think the NFL has been embarassed by players recently. With Packman Jones, the whole TO thing, and most recently Michael Vick and they're trying to come off as an organization that is going to do something to get rid of its problems. Cracking down on players for drug use is one way to accomplish this. These guys are suspended w/o pay, and we all know that if you're not on the field some other guy gets a chance to shine and possibly take your spot.

They're trying to get these guys to see that its not worth the risk involved with taking such drugs. With another reference to wrestling (and I think they're appropriate because both want bigger guys), people were astounded to find that many die before the age of 40, and they're attributing it to the use of these types of drugs. Football guys take hard hits and put their bodies on the line a lot as well, so they're prone to the same pressures that the Wrestlers are. They need their bodies to be able to take those hits. Getting bigger is one way to help that issue.

I think the NFL has been a bit more lax in recent years, but the problems the WWE is having have opened their eyes and they'd like to stop a problem before it occurs.

Also, speaking of hits and football, I gotta give a shout out to my hero, Stephen McGee. QB of the Aggies. WHOOP! This was from his first college career game in Nov of '05.

 

Does anyone want to go to Showdown?

 

TO may be a jerk, but he's never broken any NFL rules, or been caught taking any illegal substances. I'm not quite sure why you thru him in on this particular issue.

 

To put it simply, drug use is certainly a problem in football, and it has been overlooked for a while now. That said, football will not end up with asterisks like baseball, for one simple reason - stats aren't as important in football as they are in baseball. There are a few stats that people like, but all are at least somewhat dependent on others, usually heavily dependent. By comparison, baseball stats are produced solely by the player in question and thus are more susceptible to influence from drug use. Thats why there has been so much talk about asterisks in baseball.

Hopefully now that the NFL is beginning to show that it is serious about cracking down on steroids and HGH, players will get the message and quit taking them. But I think at least several more players will be caught before we get to that point.

 

Many of his actions with his previous team weren't role modelish material. The fact that it got a lot of news coverage and he still gets a lot of news coverage because they're waiting for him to do something again, is an embarassment to the NFL. He's been better since he moved to Dallas, but he's not that explosive of a player anymore to get the coverage that he tends to get.

 

I personally believe that steroid use is going in every sport. Whose to say that some of these athletes that take performance enhancing drugs dont have an inside guy thats knows when they will test. I dont believe asterisks will ever happen in football, for the simple fact that everyone knows the NFL has the best testing policy for drugs. As for the general state of the NFL and drug use i think Goddell has done a stand up as commish. He's not backed down if one of the bigger name players gets into trouble.

As for drug use in the NFL. i dont know if its as big as the MLB but I'm quite certain there's a good number of people doing it. I think more often than not though they use the drugs to help speed up the healing process.

 

Let's see how we did ...

horsey: good try, I appreciate you trying to connect to things you're most comfortable with. +2 for facts, +2 for effort, +1 for a good connection. However, a -1 for the pathetic shout out.
R...J: I would disagree with you that stats aren't important, and we can asterisk one very important stat: number of rings. But, beyond that, good information. +2
whitey: Good info, and I completely agree that most players that take it do so for healing their bodies ... but with the punishment they take every week, that is often. +3

Scoreboard:

This Round:

s65horsey: 4
whiteeagle: 3
Rogue...Jedi: 2

Overall:

whiteeagle: 26
Rogue...Jedi: 23
s65horsey: 22


And so horsey makes it close, but not quite. Thanks for playing though. Enjoy 24 hours of sock usage.

And now we move on to the showdown. Two men enter, one man leaves with colors, and the other leaves with a bruised ego.

 

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As last reported here on Around the Arena, Appalachian State of the division I still refer to as I-AA shocked the world by upsetting the Michigan Wolverines in the Big House. They join the likes of George Mason (incredible Final Four run), Boise State (Fiesta Bowl win), and Buster Douglas (KO of Mike Tyson) in the records of greatest upsets in sports history. So, what's your pleasure? What's the greatest upset in sports of all time?

Let's start with whiteeagle, and find out ...

 

Touch call but I'm going with Buster Douglas here. Sure everyone including myself loved Appalachian State beating Michigan and the Boise State win last year in the Fiesta Bowl George Mason's run to the final was a tournament to remember also.

Everyone forgets that Boise State was actually really good last year before the Fiesta Bowl so for them to say oh greatest upset of all time. Well not so much, sure a big time upset but there were rarely anybody that picked OU by more than 2 tds. App State was more a greatest upset than anything. George Mason, in basketball it all depends on what falls. You can be shooting lights out one night and cant hit crap the next. Now onto Buster.

I'm taking Buster for one simple thing The Mirage Casino in Las Vegas had Tyson as a 42 to 1 favorite. A 42 to 1 favorite!!!! They were saying all Tyson had to do was show up and Douglas was done. Well somebody forget to show up and that was Tyson. Douglas came out firing and didnt stop and knocked out the seemingly invincible Tyson. Plus who doesnt love the whole David taking down Goliath thing in sports. Greatest upset because you cant blame your coach, the line for not blocking, receivers for not catching, the ball not going in the hoop, its just you and the other guy. And if you get beat the only person you can blame is yourself. Greatest upset of all time in my book.

 

I may not be a hockey fan, but no discussion on the greatest upsets in sports history is complete without talking about the Miracle on Ice in 1980. But first:

As great as the Boise State Fiesta Bowl win was, those who really watched football knew just how good of a team Boise State was, and thus were not surprised that it was a close game. Most expected Oklahoma to win, true... but not to blow them out, so it doesn't rank so highly on the list of upsets. George Mason had a great run, with some notable individual upsets (such as beating UConn in the regional final), but it too falls just short, partly because of how volatile of a sport basketball is and how truly anything can happen, more so than most sports (though admittedly less than baseball). And yes, Buster Douglas was a huge upset as well, and it does and will always rank near the top of this list. But Appalachian State beating Michigan was just as completely out of the blue - nobody was picking App State to win that game. It was supposed to be such a blowout that a number of betting offices refused to even offer a line on the game. That's gotta beat having 42-1 odds. At least 42-1 odds shows a small chance, but for this game they were saying no chance at all! Thats only part of why Appalachian State-Michigan will go down as the greatest college football upset of all time, and one of the very top upsets of all time in any sport.

But then as I said to begin this, there is the Miracle on Ice. Take the game completely out of context and it is still comparable to the other games we've been talking about. Put it in context, though, and it blows the rest away. Sure, Boise State was in the Fiesta Bowl - but it wasn't even playing for the national championship. George Mason eventually fell before making it to the championship game. Appalachian State was in the first game of the season. The Miracle on Ice was in the Olympics, the epitome of sports competition for the last 111 years running, and dating back to over 2700 years ago. There is no greater level of sports competition, plain and simple. There are other great levels - the Super Bowl, the World Series, the NBA Finals, etc., some of which are the highest level for that particular sport (such as the Super Bowl, for example) - but the Olympics tops all. Thats not the entire context, though. It involved the United States of America and the Soviet Union, during the Cold War. None of the other examples are even between rivals, and this went way beyond mere rivals. Imagine your favorite team playing their most bitter rival, with nobody, including most of the fans who support your team, even giving your team a chance. Then imagine them actually winning, and proceed to multiply that by around a hundred. That was the Miracle on Ice. A Juggernaut Soviet team, a big-time underdog US team, during the Cold War and on the highest stage sports has to offer... and the US pulls off the upset. It was and still is and will remain the greatest upset in sports history. It may - not likely, but possible, and since we're talking about upsets, admit the possible - be matched one day, but it will never be topped. Simple as that.

 

Geez, Rogue...Jedi that gave me chills reading your post.

 

Good arguments on both sides, better one by Rouge. He gets the point.

So, Rogue's got a chance to win colors, while whitey has a chance to stay alive as we talk about ..

The Padres pitched Jake Peavy on three days rest for a regular season game against the D-Backs last night, despite their being three weeks left in the season. Was this a panic move that backfired, or a case of a team making a good decision to try to do whatever it takes to win their way into the playoffs?

Let's start this time, with Rogue...Jedi ...

 

Gaffney over Brynes in High School Football was big

 

Two weeks from now in late September, maybe even a week from now in mid-September, it would be considered a good decision. But its still early September, with most of a month still left of the regular season. To look at it from the perspective of before the game, ignoring the results for the moment: if you start Peavy on three days rest now, are you going to keep running him out there on 3 days rest for the rest of the season? If so, you're really running the chance of hurting his arm going into the postseason - and keep in mind that if the playoffs started today, the Padres would be in, not out. Its not so much that they're trying to get into the postseason as they are trying not to slip out of it. Sure, they now trail the Diamondbacks by a game in the West (tied prior to this start), but even now after that they still have a 2.5 game lead in the WC. Not huge, no, but a lead nonetheless. If, on the other hand, the plan was to start Peavy on 3 days rest now then return to regular rest, then why now? Ok, so it was the last game of the season against Arizona, the team that was tied with them and now leads the West. Even so, thats not a good enough reason to push a young pitcher's arm onto early rest. If down the road it became apparent they needed him to go a day early to keep them in the race as we get nearer the end, thats one thing. Right now, its still too early to start having pitchers heading out there on short rest. Particularly right now, when rosters are expanded AND theres still a fair bit of time left in the season. Thats why it was clearly a panic move. And as we can see now in hindsight, it clearly backfired.

EDIT: just a note to rech: That was a nice upset, true, but lets be real, it doesnt even come close to comparing to the others in question.