PT Force Scream: How Palpatine tooled the posse

Palpatine's slaughter of the majority of the Jedi Masters sent to arrest him has been a point of contention for years.

I was just watching it recently, and had a sudden notion. The easy kill isn't Palpatine being super fast, it's the Jedi being shell-shocked by his Force Scream.

Think about it.

Palpatine does that animal-like roar and leaps over his desk, lightsaber ignited. The Jedi Masters stand there like trees because they're terrified by him.

I propose that Palpatine used the Dark side to install fear in the posse. The weaker Masters, Tiin and Kolar are petrified, and Palpatine kills them both with ease. This gives Windu and Fisto time to recover, but Fisto is still scared, evidenced by his panicky parries, and he falls swiftly.

Mace is able to shake off the fear and fight, but even he's scared of Palpatine for a bit, as he beats a hasty retreat from the office. Once he's outside, Mace manages to conquer his fear and fights Palpatine with the composure of a Jedi Master.

Fear is the ally of the Sith and its how Palpatine managed to kill three Jedi Masters in a matter of moments.

Thoughts?

 

Sure, why not. If that's the way you see it, I don't see anything in the movie that proves it false.

It's a bit video gamey, but I like videos games, so....

 

I'm not sure that it makes the Jedi look better to say that four Jedi Masters lost because they got scared when an old man yelled at them...

 

Why not? Even if it is a little video game nerdy and disgustingly retconnish, it at least excuses the silliness of the ease with which he slaughtered them. It would be interesting to see if there is an actual LFL ruling on this concept somewhere. (Wookieepedia?)

 

It was very poorly done. The novelization states Sidious moved very fast, that's it. Unfortunately, in the movie he moves at normal speed while the Jedi are frozen...hmm, maybe he was moving in bullet time?

 

I've always seen it as comparable to the way Luke overpowers Vader in ROTJ - There's got to be some sort of dark side rage pushing thing going on, otherwise there's no way he would beat him with that poor excuse for a saber attack. Of course, Anakin is conflicted, but still...
The scream could definitely be part of Palpatine's attack. Good thinking!





"How is that possible?"
/LM

 

I don't think the Jedi were "scared" of it, but I think it certainly did distract them and wasn't something they were expecting, which gave Sidious time to take out Tiin and Kolar, then Fisto and Mace were able to to start focusing again, but weren't fully focused, and Sidious had to use his strength for the rest of the fight. This makes me wonder what the outcome would have been if Sidious was already standing there with his lightsabers out and the Jedi straight away went into a full on face-to-face fight with him.

 

I never really needed any explanation other than: Even though everybody thought he was just a kindly old man, it turns out he was a really badass Sith Lord.

 

well if that was the case 2 things would have happened:

1) they'd have used their already activated weapon to use (defense or attack)

2) ran from the room in sheer terror

neither of these things happened


simple truth of the matter: they didn't have much time from when the scene was completely changed from Hayden being there.




Best not to think about it too much and just accept it for what it is,

 

Yeah, it's not like the majority of the duels show anybody being particularly faster than the other guy. More skillful-seeming, sure, but faster? Not especially.

 

Grievous is- at least in the RoTS novel. But then, Grievous lost.

 

He just seems more colorful to me in the film He's dazzling, sure, but Obi-Wan definitely isn't slower.

 

They didn't look all scared to me, meh.

 

I didn't know an old man can scare someone by going AHHHHHH

 

It's not the first time it's happened in the movies. I've always felt Vader lets Luke beat him up. And Maul just stands there waiting for Kenobi to cut him in half. They lose because they need to lose

 

Listen, it wasn't just an old man screaming, that whole move was Linda Blair with a lightsaber. I'd have gone through 3 boxers if that kind of attack came at me, Jedi or not.

 

Um, you can't really use "it's just and old man yelling" as an excuse or counter point since if he did not use Force Scream then it's "just some old man yelling" who then proceeded to own all of them including duping Windu into thinking he'd won then tossing him out a window.

 

The ROTS novel was chilling in the way it portrayed this scene. I really wish the movie would have shown this to much better show just how Palps pinned the Jedi as public enemies with a hidden recording device and his kills are like a "now you see me , now you don't, now you're beheaded" act of horror.

But as for the post , I have never thought of it like this but I totally see your idea. Lightsaber duels are totally mental and force related. I like your thinking.

And Palpatine/Sidious might be an old man, but not like any old man in our world

 

"force scream" LOLOL

we need that thread bumped, where there was a user that was convinced that Palpatine used a force move to levitate Obi-Wan before Dooku kicks Anakin in ROTS,

he was convinced he said "heh keh keh" which was a sith chant,

wish that guy was around now, he'd be with the people saying this force scream had something to do with why the Jedi lost so easily,

especially since Mace wasn't fazed at this at all..

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It's not the first time it's happened in the movies. I've always felt Vader lets Luke beat him up. And Maul just stands there waiting for Kenobi to cut him in half. They lose because they need to lose

--

true that

 

I think Palpatine used the dreaded Sith technique known as "Force Get-off-my-lawn!!!"

 

or

"i'll open that bottle for ya

*force cork screw*

 

I was a bit disappointed in seeing three Jedi Masters cut down the way they were. Sure enough it was to show how Palpatine was but Kit Fisto who was one of the best swordsman of his generation cut down in seconds? This does not really make any sense to me. A Jedi Master who is going to arrest a possible Sith Lord should be ready for anything. They seemed overwhelmed because he screamed or leaped at them. During the Clone Wars they should have faced a lot of dangerous situations and to either be overwhelmed or unprepared for that type of situation just makes no sense. Palpatines biggest weapon was his ability to confuse the Jedi and not his Force abilities. At least that is my take on the matter.

 

I just re-watched that part in ROTS, and I think that you are into something. After Sidious screams all 4 Jedi are petrified and there is definitely fear into them. That moment could have been essential for Sidious to fuel the dark side and to immediately kill the first 3 Masters. Only after Master Windu goes into the another room he starts fighting as good as he can and ultimately defeating Sidious.

And from Kotor games, the force scream was a powerful dark side power which can lost the will of opponents and make them fear. Knowing that all Masters were Guardians it is impossible that this has caused it. Though I don't think that this could have been possible for a Master who has a deeper knowledge of the Force, like Master Yoda or Revan after his revelation.

 

I believe that Kit Fisto may have been a Consular however I still do not quite understand why Jedi Masters who have been taught that they must destroy the Sith would go to arrest a Sith Lord and not be prepared for what might lay ahead. Kit Fisto did try to put up a fight at least. I feel that all Jedi should at least understand some facets of the darkside if they are to truly be able to defend the light. There was a lot of misunderstanding on the parts of the Jedi in the prequel trilogy.

 

Attacking Palpatine without Yoda and Obi Wan in team was really not smart from Windu. Also sensing Anakin's confusion he should have guarded Anakin with some Jedi Masters. He trying to do things fast lost the Jedi everything. With Yoda and Kenobi in team, together with Windu, Palpatine would have easily been defeated.

You're right about Fisto, he was a Jedi Consular. Could that have made him to not be defeated as easy as two other Jedi Masters (Colar I think was a better swordsman than him)?

About your last part, I think that you're right. But Jedi Council discourages and disallows to learn about the dark side. There were only a few Jedi whom with success learnt about the dark side who later became Jedi heroes (Ulic and Revan, no coincidence why them especially the second one were some of the most powerful Jedi of all time), and in fact I don't know any single Jedi who had teach the dark side without turning to light side of the Force.