Full Series Order 66 series

So Season 6 starts with the series on how order 66 was activated accidentally in a trooper named Tup due to a malfunctioned chip or something( Episode name: "Sabotage"). Then there were details but that's not the point here.

the point is that this series totally derailed my understanding of order 66. the order is presented as something like built into clones with a chip. What? First of all, order 66 is not a chip. Its a contingency issued by Palpatine in case the Jedi attack the republic. We even see in the Episode iii film that he contacts all clone commanders and he's like "execute order 66". THERE IS NO CHIP.

Secondly, if it was a chip, how is it activated? Does Palpatine have like a red button in his office labeled "order 66"? It makes no sense. And the clone in the show had his chip go off somehow, and he killed his jedi general. Would the Kaminoans seriously overlook the fact that this might happen? Even if it is a chip and my whole argument bites it, i can never believe the most important plot in galactic history didn't start with the perfection of this chip.

Thirdly, this contradicts in every way the previous canon on order 66. So the order is the sixty sixth in a book called like "contingency orders of the GAR" (something like that). Why do they need to put it in a book if its already inside every clone. Also, putting the order in a chip increases its likelihood of being found like x9000. What if a jedi scans a clone one day and he's like " woah, a chip. wonder what it does." BOOM Palpatine fails.

In conclusion, the idea of order 66 being an implant instead of ya know, an actual order, not only sucks but goes against previous canon.

 

Nothing that said that there was a contingency order is canon any longer. What you saw in TCW is currently the canon take on the issue.

As far as the Jedi discovering the chips, it's been a long time since I've seen those episodes, but I thought the Kaminoans addressed it as the chips suppressing the Jango-like independence of the clones. I.E. the Jedi are aware that there are chips, but have been misled as to what their function does.

 

They do not explain why or how it malfunctioned or how it was supposed to be activated during Order 66 in current canon. Tup just sees the Jedi and goes into Order 66 mode as if he was obeying programming via hypnosis or as a robot would a command, same effect. Seems that arc was more Manchurian Candidate than anything else. I think Palpatine just contacted specific commanders personally to take out specific Jedi and that was done for effect for the audience - presumably the rest had to have been activated by a remote of some kind its not like he's gonna contact every individual Clone Commander . Its basically soon as Order 66 command was heard or some kinda signal activated the chip, or both , they'd snap into action.

The Jedi could've found out but Master Ti and the Council went through the Chancellor first, which was why they did not. The Kaminoans were in some nefarious league with Palpatine directly we're shown, and they were still under contract of Tyranus who this army according to the Kaminoans belonged to WAY back in AOTC but the Jedi the entire time never took any precautions we're lead to believe nor made sure Tyranus's influence on Kamino was eradicated(the Jedi only found out very late Dooku was Tyranus). How Palpatine factored in to all of that is unknown as the toon was short on answers. Palpatine's Shock Troopers were apparently always activated but had different orders until ordered to kill Jedi, but they seemed in on Palpatine's plot to some degree from what was seen in that arc and possible the Tano arc as well.

 

Sorry guys but no matter how much we hate the idea of biochips, there' s nothing we can do but complain. That is, unless...we can get someone to override it.

 

I too was disappointed with this idea of chips. I think it removes the very thing that makes the clones interesting and useful to Palpatine's plot, and it rather bizarrely changes late in the game (too late) what the clones are. The clones are genetically engineered, they're not baseline humans, they were altered to be more obedient. They're given an order by the designated authority, they follow it. I can buy that a very few exceptional clones become individualistic enough to challenge that programming, but even then it should be a very gradual and difficult thing. I personally agree that it likely stems from having the clones become the "relatable heroes" they did in TCW. Suddenly they had to be acting under the evil influence of mind control to slaughter their Jedi friends. When someone like Captain Rex received the order, in my mind he should have shown a moment of genuine regret - just a moment - and then turned and calmly emptied his blaster into the nearest Jedi youngling's head. Okay, Rex might count as one of the rare exceptions given his character development, but there's a difference between character development and a fundamental change in the nature of characters. It doesn't mean the clone-Jedi friendship wasn't real. It was. The clones liked and followed the Jedi. But intrinsic to their nature as engineered clones is - or should be - that orders trump all other concerns. The whole reason Order 66 works as a trap for the Jedi is that the clones are in no way hostile. Jedi, of course, can sense hostility. But their clones are not hostile, they have no issue with the Jedi at all, they're loyal and friendly... until they get the order, and in that instance they cut the Jedi down. It works, and it's horrifying, precisely because the clones were genuine friends to the Jedi, and maybe the clones might feel "well, wasn't that a right shame?" in the aftermath, but orders are everything. Its who and what they are, and very few should be able to break that hardwiring (the Kaminoans are good at their job). I think it's disappointing that the clones were turned into, essentially, just normal human soldiers and we lost the potential in this twisted and likely tragically creepy morality they might have been given.

 

My two cents:

The Jedi and clones never needed to be friends. I felt like if you watched just the movies, the answer was there. The clones killed the Jedi because they were told to in ROTS, and in AOTC it is said they will obey any order without question.

IMO, the tragedy worked just fine as is, that the Jedi saw these clones as individuals and treated them as such, even though they weren't normal humans but an amoral, bioengineered army, altered to be completely subservient.

Things like the Krell arc, and TCW's other efforts to portray the clones as free thinking individuals I think was unnecessary. But once they went down that path, I do think that the Manchurian Candidate route became necessary. Because if the clones can disobey a commanding officer and kill him, then they should by all means have the will to resist Palpatine. As popular as the Krell arc was, I think that was kind of the beginning of a path whose natural progression resulted in the "biochip" explanation.

But I think things should have just been left as they were. I can appreciate well thought out plots and nuanced characters. But what happened with the clones/stormtroopers ultimately proved convoluted IMO.

Republic gets clone army --> clone army shows remarkable degree of independence --> clones fight during TCW, common people detest war --> patriots enlisting post war --> cessation of cloning because patriots are less individualistic?

IMO the simpler explanation was the better explanation

Republic gets clone army that will obey any order without question --> clone army is phenomenally expensive --> clones kill Jedi as they are told --> recruits are drafted post-war to replace expensive clones and because the Senate can no longer curtail Palpatine's demands for ever increasing manpower.

 

I also see at as a fundamental lack of imagination, and the sad idea that an audience can't relate to actual aliens. Let's face it, the clones are aliens - they're explicitly not normal humans, the Kaminoans rewired them into something less individualistic, much more obedient and structured. But now the clones are simply human soldiers like any other. It would be great to see the clones presented as they were in early TCW - with those familiar and likeable traits - and *also* be entirely comfortable with casually gunning down friends and colleagues when ordered to by the correct authority. That would have made them interesting, provocative, problematic. They're an exploited race, they were designed to be exploited, and they're tragic, and they're both entirely familiar/relatable and bizarrely different. Their morality is skewed from the familiar by their hardwiring and their design. They're a tragic, dangerous, relatable and also alarming people. Now they're just human soldiers who were mind-controlled by the bad guy.

 

I have no strong feelings either way but I guess I'm in the minority here when I say that I actually liked how the clones were given personality. If more is added and nothing is took away, I really don't care.

 

The chip was probably simply a plot device to inform the audience(probably mainly targeting of a non-movie or movie time comic audience and young kids) why the heroic Clones were gonna do bad things and turn treacherous and murderous and also make them sympathetic and victims.

 

What ever happened to commander cody? Why was he dropped from the series?

 

Yeah the chip always bugged me, just doesn't make too much sense.

Always enjoyed this quote from a retired clone trooper from the Star Wars Battlefront 2 game:
"What I remember about the rise of the Empire is... is how quiet it was. During the waning hours of the Clone Wars, the 501st Legion was discreetly transferred back to Coruscant. It was a silent trip. We all knew what was about to happen, what we were about to do. Did we have any doubts? Any private traitorous thoughts? Perhaps, but no one said a word. Not on the flight back to Coruscant, not when Order 66 came down, and not when we marched into the Jedi Temple. Not a word."

 

He was still in it, just in a reduced role. He was in the Season 5 youngling arc with Obi-Wan, and appeared in Son of Dathomir.

I'll admit, his role really decreased from season 1 onwards.

 

Cody popped up in the Bad Batch arc.

 

I could see a spinoff film with Ashoka returning to her home planet. She hears the news of Order 66 over the HoloNet and that the Jedi have betrayed the Republic. Avoiding detection, she sneaks away from her home world, and tries to find out the fate of Anakin and Obi-Wan by flying to where their fleet is stationed and eventually flies over the Jedi Temple enough to sense the amount of death. She determines that they both must have been killed and goes into hiding. While listening to the clone chatter she hears of several clones which defected and were supposedly killed on a planet the 501st was operating on. Commander Rex and the other clones go into hiding there. Ashoka finds them and all escape to a planet where they can go into hiding together that we see in Rebels.

Knowing Anakin was married, Ashoka asks survivors she can trust of the fate of Padme. She uses the Force to find her grave and coincidentally meets Bail Organa there who is visiting Naboo. This is how her involvement in the Rebellion begins.

 

Order 66 arc was very, very damaging to the PT and the Jedi Order - it made the Jedi come across as incredibly weak and arrogant to ignore the blatant facts in front of them. The Grand Plan of the Sith was right there - right friggin' there! IT WAS SO OBVIOUS! Yet, Yoda's "for now, we'll continue to play the game" line is utterly hilarious. In the final two seasons, Yoda just seems to accept their fate. The Order was going to fall and there was nothing they can do.

Oh well, been a few crazy 1,000 years; party can't last forever...

Plus, season 6 suggests this is the first time the Order understands Darth Tyranus and Count Dooku are the same person. Are you honestly telling me, after the events of AoTC, they didn't know? I refuse to believe that.The Council knew the Sith had returned after TPM, but are oblivious to the possibility of Dooku being a Sith Lord; nobody questioned his assassin, Ventress, being evidence of him embracing the Sith teachings...anyone? no?

Again, after AoTC, the Council is aware of the name of the Sith Lords - Darth Sidious and Tyranus. The Master and his Apprentice, but nobody considers Dooku is the possible student?

And don't get me started on how I'm supposed to believe the remaining Clones managed to survive up till Rebels, without the Empire even knowing. I understand how Ahsoka could've survived, but a few Clones? It's worse type of fan boyism.

DanielUK explodes into a fit rage

 

Jango tells Obi-Wan that he was hired by a guy named Tyranus. He doesn't say Darth Tyrannus. So there was nothing there to indicate that Tyranus was a Sith.

 

I think that's the point. The Jedi had gotten so caught up in themselves and serving the Republic that the stopped severing the will of the force. "Only Sith deal in absolutes." is a contradiction to the teachings of the jedi order considering all of the dogma they had. The Jedi order was weak and was able to fall into Plalps trap that way.

 

Would it have been better if the clones had, lets say, a dirtier sense of humor? Instead of santa Rex.

p.s. Rex would only be like, 50 years old at this point. Why does he already have a grey beard?

edit: Or put it this way, grittier.

 

Completely agree. The chip nonsense is very cheap and ruins the entire concept of Order 66. I think this whole thing happened owing to the cancellation of the series and rushing in stories for the sake of it.

Order 66 is a contigency order that has to be issued by the commander in chief. It is not automated and will not happen unless the specific order is given. Had Windu succeeded in killing Palpatine or Palpatine removed from office, then the clones would not start to kill Jedi as the order had not been given.

I think the chip story ruined the intense feeling and sadness of that moment in ROTS when the tide turns to the Sith and indeed cheapens the sheer brilliance of Palpatine's plan of how he has done everything legally. It also makes all parties look completely stupid - the Jedi for not being highly suspicious of the clones and what looks like a coverup, the Kaminoans look evil and working against the Jedi Order, and Palpatine looks like he is covering something up. The clones are meant to be genetically designed creatures bred for war. In AOTC - they will obey any order without question, with the advantage that they can think creatively how to do so. They are not droids with chips and parts though. They are trained to obey orders unswervingly and unquestionly.

They are loyal to their Jedi generals, but ultimate loyalty is to the Republic and its commander in chief. Order 66 did not require anything more than authentication that it was from the Supreme Commander (in this case the Chancellor). To remove the Chancellor with the clones, the Jedi would need Senate approval. I guess they chose simply to act fast and on their own. Had they removed him, the clones would not have reacted against them - they simply follow orders and do not dabble in politics. They would likely have still followed their Jedi generals who were placed strategically across the GAR.

To paraphrase "There is no bathroom"... for true fans... THERE IS NO CHIP!!

Thoughts?

 

Yes I tend to ignore the chip nonsense as that completely ruins the PT and the immense feeling of sadness associated with Order 66 in ROTS. Order 66 is a contigency order and the clones unswervingly obey orders. That is it. THERE IS NO CHIP.

The chip makes the whole thing so cheap and makes the Jedi look stupid, the Kaminoans look evil, Palpatine look exposed and clearly initiating a cover up. It also makes the clones look like droids with chip parts, etc. They are meant to be genetically created soldiers who are totally loyal to the Republic and obey orders from their commanders - the Jedi. But ultmate authority is with the Commander in Chief - the Chancellor. That is why they carry it out - not some chip. They cannot willfully disobey an order. But... THERE IS NO CHIP!

 

I don't think the Arc was rushed due to the cancellation. This arc was one of the furthest along when the cancellation happened, so the scripts could have been at least two years old at the time.