A&A The Official John Ostrander Discussion Thread

>> >>You hard-core GJ fans out there are a PHENEMONAL bunch.<<<<


>>Heh...well, we keep at it, don't we?? <<

Yeah but you get a little PSYCHIC too. This is the third or fourth inquiry in the past week, just when I'm doing some serious discussions about the guy. A little scary perhaps?<g>

-- John

 

Let's run a little poll, just for fun. I want to restrict it to the characters that Jan and I have created together -- Quin, Aayla, Villie, Zao, T'ra S'aa, Tholme and so on (include the badguys, if you like). Which ones do you like BEST, which ones do you like LEAST, and why? Just curious.

John

 

The best?

Villie and Quinlan. Villie, we have never seen anything like before, and Quin is pretty original when it comes to being a Jedi.

The worst? (gah, thats hard)

Tholme, dunno, he just seems kind of like your average Jedi.

But thats just because I had to pick someone. All the smaller characters like Zao and T'ra S'aa don't really do anything for me. They were cool while they were there, but I can't really judge their characters just by that small appearance.

All the bad guys have been top notch, I think. Aayla is pretty interesting, but she's getting a bit on my nerves in Rite of Passage. Has to do with her not being a kick-arse bad chick like she was in Darkness (not that I only liked her while she was Dark, she was pretty cool in Stark even with that small role). But Rite of Passage isn't finished yet, or at least I don't know how it ends.

 

Rough order of favourite to least:

Tyvokka: He was awesome. Great to see him in HoloNet News. Hope we'll see stories with him some time. Did you work out any backstory for him?

Tholme: Qui-Gon Jinn was one of those rare things, a wise, mature, adult hero, and Tholme is a decent sustitute. (Though I don't like Sam Neill too much as an actor.)

Villie: A really powerful, distinctive presence, a good way of adding early-Han-Solo cynicism, and I like him best in small doses.

Aayla: Your enthusiasm and Jan's for the character really come across, and I look forward to see what kind of Jedi Knight she becomes.

T'ra Saa: I liked the glimpse of her a lot. Let's see if you can write mature, capable characters like this and keep them interesting without too many unJedilike inner conflicts.

Zao: Like to know more about him too.

Quinlan: Jedi near the dark side is SO overused in the EU, to the detriment of the Anakin Skywalker story. If nearing the dark side was so easy there'd be a lot more than 20 Lost. I think you write Quin well but I'd prefer a less brooding, more Jedilike Jedi as a main character.

(The EU generally overuses familiar characters/species/planets -- for obvious reasons, but it can strain credulity. So generally I like new characters rather than cameos, but it would be nice to see
one or two or Jude Watson's Jedi characters (Bant, Clee Rhara, Garen Muln...)
the Circle of Jedi Healers (mentioned in conjunction with Stass Allie: who are some of the members and what role do they play in the Clone Wars?)
politicians (and what's the thing with Orn Free Taa/Chom Frey Kaa?)
Alta Ranga.)

 

In my humble opinion:

The Best: Villie. He's not necessarily a "good guy" but you can see that he does have a good heart. Or at least a sense of honour. For example, in RoP #2 and #3 he delivered that message for Quinlan and tried to pass it off as "returning the favor". IMO, he didn't have to return the favor, but he did it anyway.

The Worst: Hard to say, but like Wedge I'll say Tholme. He isn't a bad character by any means, but he just isn't as interesting as the other characters, IMO.

 

Quin, Aayla, Villie, Zao, T'ra S'aa, Tholme

Best to worst:

Villie is definitely the best. Fun and funny and a real pain in the ass. I love the guy.

Quin kicks ass too. When he's written well. He has gotten on my nerves from time to time (coughinfinitysendcough), although that wasn't John's fault.

Aayla I really don't care about. I don't really feel that I know her that well, or that she's got a very interesting character.

As to the other's, I'd have to re-read some of my comics and get back to you. If Zao is the little "way of the leaf" guy I'd like to see some more of him.

 

Still thinking about my favorite but for worst its a no-brainer:

Villie

He's useless. Zao knows this!

 

"Let's run a little poll, just for fun. I want to restrict it to the characters that Jan and I have created together -- Quin, Aayla, Villie, Zao, T'ra S'aa, Tholme and so on (include the badguys, if you like). Which ones do you like BEST, which ones do you like LEAST, and why? Just curious.
John"

Hi John, ok I'll take a shot at this if I may.

Character I like BEST: Aayla Secura!

From 'Twilight' on Aayla intrigued me and with each new comic I become more and more of a fan. She's well designed and balanced as a character.
Her actions are always understandable enough without ever being predictable. She remains intriguing and with a mysterious quality to her. Bit by bit we learn more of her past which to a degree explains her actions and state of mind but she remains a complicated, elaborate character that's neither too simple nor too complicated.
Aayla's past has been well established which each new released fact with events that mark her as a person and make us understand why she is who she is and who she is becoming.
Aayla has met with challenges and even tragedy but overcame each in a realistic way and she carries and learns from these experiences. Without going on like some automaton pretending nothing happened or whining about the past, it is well balanced. Aayla to me is a very complete and 'real' character. (As real as anything in Star Wars off course.)

I disagree with any statements that she isn't interesting, she is to me and I hope to see much mor eof her in the future. Also because I believe she's a very original character too. There's no other female alien Jedi in that era that even remotely resembles her.

Character I like LEAST: I don't know they're all so good!

Quinlan Vos at times scares me a bit, still got a bit of a bad streak to him. But that's what makes him a 'flesh and blood' Jedi. Many of the challenges Jedi face is resisting the Dark Side within and without and I don't think this has been overused in the EU at all since it's one of the main challenges EVERY Jedi faces. Finding, knowing and walking the right -Lightside-path.
It just adds depth and realism to the Jedi instead of portraying them as unfaultering or unwaivering beings with no emotion or true 'humanity'. It shows underneath, there are people with emotions and feelings and also doubts.

But to say one character I dislike -one of the bad guys- is Khariss Fenn. (Oh that blasted Twi'lek gets on my nerves ... which I think is the idea. I really want to see him getting beaten by Aayla.)

Well that's my humble opinion anyways. I'm not very knowledgeable about these things I just say what I think and feel.

 

Cool responses thus far, ranging all over the place. Some characters that some of you love others of you don't much care for.

For the record, I'll say that i don't think that Quin is as close to the darkside as he was at one time. For some people, that means they think he has lost an edge. I think he has come to terms with the loss of his memory and accepts who he is. His problem is his areas of speciality; he is a Jedi but he is less likely to be a diplomat and more to be a detective or a spy. This takes him out into the hard places, into the dark places, and -- like many cops -- he deals constantly with the darker aspects of beings. Does this have an effect on you? I think it must BUT, OTOH, he has his Jedi training which is SO ingrained that it re-surfaced even when he didn't KNOW he was a Jedi.

Next issue will complete our current storyline and show a transition, mainly for Aayla, but also in a way for Quin. What will be REALLY interesting is when we get to the Clone Wars in issue 49. Some years will have passed between the end of this story and that one and you'll find the characters changed as well. But we'll get to that when we come to it. Mustn't say too much just yet<g>!

I find some of your reactions to Tholme interesting. Jan and I saw him as sort of a "Sherlock Holmes" sort of character while Quin is a more "Sam Spade" sort of character. Tholme is emotionally cool but NOT without emotions but I can see where he would leave some readers cold. Think of some of his lines with a dry humor and he may "read" better.

To be honest, i LOVE Villie. Problem is -- I have to limit him sometimes because he tends to take over a story when he shows up. Just plain tries to steal it<g>. We DID create him because we wanted a "Han Solo" type of rogue in this era to play with and then decided to have one who DIDN'T have Han's good qualities as well. Villie's a BAD boy and so much fun to write!

Like I said, interesting reactions. Who else wants to play or add more?

-- John

 

Another little note for those who may be interested -- the second part of my APACHE SKIES miniseries from Marvel was supposed to ship this last week. This is a four part western with really gorgeous art.

Also, I believe that this coming week sees the first of a three part arc I've done in LEGENDS OF THE DARK KNIGHT over at Marvel. Issue 159, i think. The arc is called LOYALTIES. The first cover has a guy with a flamethrower trying to set fire to the inside of a church and batman leaping at him.

If you see either and want to comment here, feel free. I'm all ears.

-- John

 

Sorry, but I think Villie is someone I wouldn't miss in the series! He's just another disposable character for all I care! The Grim Reaper/Azrael can claim that dude...

Anyways, picked up Apache Skies#1 and 2 today and I must say that Manco's art is really something! I only skimmed through it and have yet to read them. The only "Bats" I read are Azrael, Batgirl, and sometimes the Animated book. I sure hope that don't kill Azrael/Jean Paul off...

 

By the way, I hope my comments back didn't cut off others adding their voices on the poll. Or do we seem to be done with already?

John

 

Okay, the best and the worst...

BEST:

Quin - I love Quin. I love the guys who's got a little edge, a little depth, the guys that like to flirt with the Dark Side. My alltime favourite SW character is Anakin Skywalker/Darth Vader. Well, you get the picture...

Villie - He's fun, he's cocky, he's a total scoundrel - the perfect counterpart for Quin. I adore the way he refers to Quin as "my Jedi".

Aayla - she's cool. Being a straight female, she doesn't really appeal to me in a sexual way, but yeah, she's cool.

WORST

Tyvooka - I hate this guy. I hate him more than I have ever hated any Star Wars character, including Ki Adi Mundi. Might be because he disses Qui-Gon. Or maybe I just think he's a selfrighteous (sorry, don't knonw how to spell that, I hope you know what I mean anyway) jerk.

Zao - He's a little like Tyvooka I think, always certain he's right...just in a little humbler way.

Tholme is somewhere in between, he's okay, but I don't love him. Don't hate him either...

Btw, as I'm writing, I really wanna congratulate you and Jan on Rite of Passage 2...the dialouge in the cantina was just awesome!

 

Okay from Best to Worst in order:

1- Aayla...is dependable and not unpredictable/reckless

2- Quin...powerful, cunning, Force-Lightning user,

3- Zao... simple Master and I share same views in life myself! I wonder how I would react to his cooking to see my "standing" in the Force!

4- Tholme... not too shabby afterall!

5- Villie... begone with him! I know too many people in real life just like him. His reaction to Zao's cooking was all it took! You do give him some nice moments but they're not too many.

Misc: T'ra S'aa is interesting. Kh'aris Fenn is my kinda scum! Have him beat the crap outta Villie.

 

Best to worst.

1) Quin - Interesting backstory, unique powers, bad attitude = a very special character.

2) Ville - Everything Quin has plus he's funny. Hmmm, maybe Ville's number one.

3) Kh'aris Fenn - Not only is he cool looking, but he's a bad guy that, right or wrong, may even be what is best for Ryloth (Hey it's Count Viper).

4) Aayla - IMHO she is just now starting to get interesting with "Rite of Passage" (comics wise i mean, she stole the movie). Her backstory also seems to be very good, but her initial alliance with Karkko seems a bit too dark. Striking at Quin would be one thing, but willingly flying with vampire creatures to attack people not involved in her vengence quest seemed a bit of a stretch (or signs of a weak moral character).

5) Zao - the blind can fly!

6) Karkko - a good foil for Quin. A Jedi who had to try the Dark and now revels in it vs. a Jedi who was forced into an early experience with the Dark Side and for most of his life has run with it. Too bad he went so quickly.

7) Tholme - Interesting but seems to always get upstaged by the Jedi around him, even with his "cloak" abilities ( or perhaps because of).

8) Ro Fenn - Man I'm starting to get tired of whining fat leaders who make other's serve for crimes they themselves commited. The fact that Kh'aris doesn't kill him shows that he's not all bad.

9) Chom Frey Kaa - Is it just me or are all fat Twi'leks cookie-cutter scum bags. Paint that guy blue and he's Senator Orn Free Taa.


On a different note, just how long do Twi'leks live. I was reading the Tales from Jabba's Palace the other day and, lo and behold, there's ol Nat. Now if Bib Fortuna found him after the Empire had already come into being, hows he still a child laying in his mother's arms (or is he just a momma's boy.) On second thought, maybe that's why Nat thinks his father would have prefered his older brother Van had lived. Just a thought.

 

here is my basic go at it:

quinlan: i like him a lot. he is an interesting character and comes across quite realistically (sp.?),.
i think the increase of darker characters is due to the overall dark side rising in the gffa - and at least quin reacts in situations using the tools at his disposal, but not abusing them.

aayla: she serves as a great balance point for quinlan. she offers another perspective in the situations they encounter together and i think it will more obvious when we scoot into the "republic" series and they are seperated - or at least she is not his padawan anymore.

tholme:
i could take him or leave him. he serves his purpose just fine. he does not overpower the story - but he plays his part.

zao:
i love this character!!!!! all the more since it seems you are not using the main movie characters ie. yoda.
he has a lot of potential for great dialogue - i hope we see him drifting around tossing out philosophy when he is present.

twi'lek subplots: i have had enough of them. i suspect they will have less of a role in the coming storylines.

villie: i generally enjoy him despite his tendency to speak the same language as jar jar. i like him best as a supporting character. my reason:
these books are a chance to see more jedi -- in fact our only chance to see lots and lots more jedi -- so i prefer to read about the jedi, not their alien "sidekicks"!


till stand by my convictions that i hope you squeeze as many referneces and cameos of EU jedi that already existed elsewhere in the gffa's piles of literature/games/etc.
or at least more of the jedi council characters!

 

Very cool responses so far! I actually LIKE the fact that a certain amount of you LOVE Villie while a certain amount of you want him to die horribly. He provokes a reaction, good or bad, which to my mind makes him an EFFECTIVE character,

BTW, just for the record, Villie speaks SPACER which steals bits and pieces from different languages and sometimes repeats a word for emphasis. It really isn't Gungan; in my mind's ear, I hear a sort of Russian accent on Villie maybe with touches of what you would call "Mexican bandito" (I'm particularly thinking of a character in the Paul Newman film HOMBRE), maybe with a little Zorba the Greek tossed in.

Just an additional thought -- if you feel like it, let Dark Horse and LFL know how you feel about the characters as well. I think that's very useful.

I want to hear more of your thoughts on the characters but I also have a different question for you all -- as we move into the CLONE WARS, we may be seeing MORE of Obi-Wan and Anakin and perhaps LESS of characters like Quin, Villie and Aayla (not that they're disappearing entirely). Would this be a good thing or a bad thing so far as you all are concerned?

-- John

 

BTW, just for the record, Villie speaks SPACER which steals bits and pieces from different languages and sometimes repeats a word for emphasis. It really isn't Gungan; in my mind's ear, I hear a sort of Russian accent on Villie maybe with touches of what you would call "Mexican bandito" (I'm particularly thinking of a character in the Paul Newman film HOMBRE), maybe with a little Zorba the Greek tossed in.

Wow, you nailed it with the accent. That's exactly how I hear his voice when reading the dialogue.

As to the Clone Wars stuff -- I don't mind seeing Obi-Wan and Anakin, and they're clearly big players in the whole Clone Wars, but I actually prefer seeing more variety. As is the case with Star Trek and Star Wars, it seems taht the same group of people are always in the middle of every single major thing that's going on. It hurts suspension of disbelief. I'd rather see a situation in which all the characters we know are *not* embroiled. Plus I just don't like Anakin as a character.

 

well - as far as more anakin and obi-wan...

obviously we need to see as much of them as possible because the PT SW universe is truly their story.

however - please (i have ultimate faith in you and jan) do not make the stories as lame as the mini-series that have preceded REPUBLIC.
all of them from obi-qui gon teamups and obi-ani should have never seen print!
quality - not quantity is truly appreciated.
they have generally been horrible.

but if you must revolve the stories around these 2 characters - please include as many cameos and guest-stars as possible to keep us on our toes!

i said it before and we have discussed it in this forum - the PT movies have kinda gypped us out of developing any additional jedi - the novels have been OK, but the comix can really shine in this regard and i hope they do!

there are no other jedi in the OT besides luke and ben - i do not equate the NJO with the discovery of the true jedi order - but the PT is where it's at ---- and that is where you come in!!!!!

MR. OSTRANDER, SIR - you have the most prolific opportunity to develop the jedi of the pre-Empire (this side of george lucas)- if you treat it the way we maniacal fans would - it'll be awesome and a piece of our lives that we'll cherish!

enough pressure for ya'?

 

by the way:
alan moore's TOP TEN was a fantastic example of an ensemble cast.

main characters were everywhere - and they all interplayed in such lifelike fashion.

john:
have you ever read it?

 

>>MR. OSTRANDER, SIR - you have the most prolific opportunity to develop the jedi of the pre-Empire (this side of george lucas)- if you treat it the way we maniacal fans would - it'll be awesome and a piece of our lives that we'll cherish! <<

>>enough pressure for ya'? <<

I ain't worried. Especially when you see what the special project Jan and I are working on is!<g>

-- John

 

>>by the way: alan moore's TOP TEN was a fantastic example of an ensemble cast.

>>main characters were everywhere - and they all interplayed in such lifelike fashion.

>>john: have you ever read it? <<

Yes and enjoyed it a lot but I've done ensemble casts as well -- with SUICIDE SQUAD at DC and HEROES FOR HIRE at Marvel. Had a lot of fun with them, too. This will be a different matter, however, for reasons that I'll be able to discuss later.

John

 

>>As to the Clone Wars stuff -- I don't mind seeing Obi-Wan and Anakin, and they're clearly big players in the whole Clone Wars, but I actually prefer seeing more variety. As is the case with Star Trek and Star Wars, it seems taht the same group of people are always in the middle of every single major thing that's going on. It hurts suspension of disbelief. I'd rather see a situation in which all the characters we know are *not* embroiled. Plus I just don't like Anakin as a character. <<

We'll be playing with LOTS of different Jedi (and other characters as well) as our stories unfold. And we'll be playing with Anakin a bit as well. I made the point with some of the team that we can't play him as the guy who MUST become Darth Vader but as the guy who eventually RENOUNCES the Dark Side and comes back. I see Anakin as a complex character. In the Clone Wars, he has to be a legit hero. Otherwise, the fall means nothing when it comes.. In my opinion. Hopefully, you'll get a taste of that in issue 50.

John

 

Obi-Wan and Anakin would be okay to get new readers in but I don't mind focusing on staying with Quin and Aayla. Events don't neccesarily have to revolve around them that ties in with major OT or PT stuff. It'd be nice to play with other Jedi as well since this is the last time before EPIII comes out and finishes off the fun.
I'll definitley let Dark Horse know I want more Zao, Aayla, and of course, A'Sharad! Tales, mini-series, one-shot GNs... but I agree with no more of them lame stories like Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan and include better artists like Jan, Fabbri, and Marangon!

 

A few Annie/Obi stories wouldn't be bad. Especially since Ongoing has never had an Annie/Obi story.

Just don't let them get all the attention.

Personally,I'm interested to see how Anakin would react to that Tusken Jedi,A'Sharad Hett. Tusken's killed Anakin's mom after all.

Also, one thing...DREADNAUGHTS! They were used by Planetary Security Forces, and the Republic Outland Defense Force before the Clone War!

With the advent of the Clone Wars,those Security Forces were almost certainly nationalized in order to create the Republic Navy and army.

From the REbellion Era sourcebook:

When the Emperor ascended to power and the Empire was born,he turned the remaining Security Forces into the Imperial Navy and placed it in the hands of a council of admirals and generals-the Imperial High Command

Anyway,we know there's a Republic Navy that eventually became the Imperial Navy. The Security Forces must've been nationalized during the war and turned into the REpublic Navy first.

My point is there should be LOTS of Dreadnaughts in any fleet battles. It would be a nice link to older EU which staes that they were the main ship of the line before the Clone Wars. It's hard to believe that the Dreadnaughts were replaced so fast by the Assault Cruiser we see in Attack of the Clones. You'd think you'd see a lot of them early on in the war.

Dreadnaught picture

From the Imperal sourcebook:

Introduced to the galaxy before the Clone Wars,the Dreadnaught-Class heavy cruiser was the largest vessel of its time.

Of course, by the time of the Clone Wars,you have the new REpublic assault cruiser which is 752 meters long. A Dreadnaught-Class cruiser is only 600 meters long.

Now for when you reach the end of the Clone Wars.

Victory Class Star Destroyer picture

From the Imperial sourcebook:

Technological advancement is the byproduct of war. The battle marred era marked by the Clone Wars saw the creation of bigger, faster, more heavily armed and armored combat vessels. The best of this bumper crop was the Victory-Class Star Destroyer. Designed by Republic engineer Walex Blissex,the Victory was commissioned into service as the wars were drawing to a close. Conseqently,though these ships saw little action during the wars,they formed the bulk of the Imperial Navy for years following.

From the Rebellion era sourcebook:

The Imperial-Class Star Destroyer replaced the original Victory-Class Star Destroyers some years before the Battle of Yavin. The smaller Victory-Class ships appeared near the end of the Clone Wars and were designed as top-of-the-line peacekeeping battleships. The Emperor agreed to fund an upgraded design,and the Imperial version superseded the Victory.

Just some wicked looking ships that would be cool to see in some Clone Wars comics.

Question: Who exactly is in charge of deciding what ships go in those fleets like the ones in the Stark Hyperspace War series or Council of War?

Is it left up to the artists' discretion? Is it the editors? Or continuity editors from LFL?