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Topic:
A few questions regarding Palpatine
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Darthbane2007
Registered:
Oct '07
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 12:09pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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I have 2 possibilities:
1. Plageius could possibly have found him before the jedi ever had a chance to identify him in the force.
2. Plageius could have found Palpatine as a young child, whose force powers were off the scales, but not to the point of Anakin's. He then kidnaps palpatine, and begins to train him.
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 1:08pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
- Date Edited:
12/18/07 1:27pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Arawn_Fenn
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Aren't those the same possibility? 
I think it's pretty clear the Jedi didn't know about him.
(Of course there is another possibility: Plagueis created him.)
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The world will look up and shout, "Save us." And I'll whisper: "No". - Rorschach
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SithStarSlayer
Registered:
Oct '03
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 1:30pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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Methinks that is the case, Fenn.
Also, it is implied through Maul's story that Palpatine WAS NOT a youngling when he became Plagueis' student. Palpatine decided to pervert the Jedi's Master-Padawan relationship by taking an apprentice who was very young. The end result was that Maul was 'fanatically devoted' to the ways of the Sith, and Bane's cause.
I have the book in my back-pack, if I get the time I'll post the passage on Plagueis and Sidious.
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Foolish men mistake transitory semblance for eternal fact
Practice makes perfect, so be careful what you practice
Tolerance is for people who lack moral conviction
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Jedi_Apprentice
Registered:
May '01
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 6:28pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
- Date Edited:
12/18/07 6:29pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Jedi_Apprentice
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The explanation to Palpatine's not being identified by the Jedi is that there is no explanation. It's a blank space we probably aren't really supposed to think about, but the good thing about it is that we do. My thoughts are that perhaps Plagueis sensed him somehow... realizing his potential and then seeking him out. Maybe it was somewhat prophetical. The Darth Bane book refers to the Sith version of the Chosen One... the Sithari. Basically the Sith believed someone would come and achieve total domination and surpass all Sith in the ways of the dark side of the Force. Maybe Plagueis thought him to be the Sithari. And well, maybe he was right since Palpatine accomplished all that he did.
As to the second question about whether or not Mace beat Windu, we really don't know. Personally I think that Mace did beat Palpatine. But it's amazing how much better Palpatine seems to fight with Yoda, but perhaps that's due in part to how much more attuned he might be to the dark side.
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http://www.fx-sabers.com/ ~|Secretary of the Official R2-D2 Fan Club|~
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SoonerSean
Registered:
Jul '07
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 7:44pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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I've always thought in the battle between Mace and Sidious that Mace has it won... he's got Sidious down for the count and has proven that the force lightening isn't going to hurt him (blocking it with is blade).
It's only when Anakin comes in that Sidious realizes that he can "give up" and force Anakin to choose. Prior to Anakin entering the room Mace had knocked Sidious' lightsaber away.
He's lying about being "too weak", but at that point he was beaten or at least had reached a point where he was in a stalemate with Mace. So gives the "too weak" line t force Anakin into action.
Later... as Yoda notes... he's so powerful but yet he tries to flee vs. fight Yoda. So while I realize that Yoda probably could have kicked Mace's @$$ around the galaxy... I think Mace and Sidious were about equals in their battle vs. Sidious pretending to lose.
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 9:43pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
- Date Edited:
12/18/07 9:43pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Arawn_Fenn
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Jedi_Apprentice posted:
The explanation to Palpatine's not being identified by the Jedi is that there is no explanation. It's a blank space we probably aren't really supposed to think about
I don't know if it's really all that strange. Do the Jedi have the capacity to test all children in the galaxy for potential Force-sensitivity? Do they even have the means to screen all children in the Republic? And what if Palpatine was born outside the Republic?
Of course, if Plagueis actually created Palpatine, the question is moot.
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The world will look up and shout, "Save us." And I'll whisper: "No". - Rorschach
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SithStarSlayer
Registered:
Oct '03
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Date Posted:
12/18/07 10:09pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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The simple fact that there are sentient races that inherently touch the Force (Felucian's, Kiffar, Korunai, Dathomir Witches etc.,) allows for Palpatine to have gone unnoticed. Luke, Bane and Leia also set the precedence that the Force can be manifested latently. Its not only possible, it is highly probable that Palpatine went under the radar of the Jedi and still became adept at whatever he applied himself to. I'm sure he was twisted and corrupt before Plagueis found him. All the Muun had to promise was "Unlimited Power..."
-----signature-----
Lucas didn't ruin my childhood, but he sure wrecked Vader's
Foolish men mistake transitory semblance for eternal fact
Practice makes perfect, so be careful what you practice
Tolerance is for people who lack moral conviction
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JediAl
Registered:
Aug '02
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Date Posted:
12/19/07 1:48pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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I tend to disagree. I think Windu bested Palpatine. Palpatine's intention was to run out time until Anakin arrived but I think even he was surprised by Mace Windu's fighting style and had probably not banked on coming up against a Jedi Master whose saber manipulation was as close as any Jedi wanted to get to the Sith.... He was handed his proverbial derriere and in the end was lucky to survive...
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Darth Vader:"I've been waiting for you Obi-Wan..we meet again at last.The circle is now complete. When I left you I was but the learner,now I am the Master."
Obi-Wan:"Only a Master of evil Darth.........."
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abc21
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
2/19 1:08am
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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PerfectCell posted:
There are a few options for why Palps was not identified,
1) He was not strong in the Force at birth, his powers and Force potential did not come until farther along in life.
2) He was born outside of the Republic and then settled on Naboo.
3) The Sith discovered him before the Jedi ever had a chance to.
4) He simply wasn't found, he was on Naboo, he was strong in the Force, but the Jedi didn't test him and didn't know about how strong he was, there are Force sensitives that are missed all the time, Palps wouldn't be the first and he wasn't the last.
As for the fight with Mace I interpreted that scene as Mace straight up besting Palps, and Palps fans have never been able to come to grips with that.
if yoda couldnt beat palps how coul mace who wasnt as strong as yoda
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LemmingLord
Title: PT Manager & CLUE Host
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
2/19 6:45pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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Another option is that Qui Gon's comment about "we would have discovered him earlier" was another example of Jedi's being a little too comfortable and pompous - overconfident...
Maybe the dark shroud has been around longer than we thought!!
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LemmingLord
Take a Leap of Faith and Follow Me
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xx_Anakin_xx
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
2/19 9:01pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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Maybe it was Yoda who found him..."cloudy this boy's future is" he would declare and leave him sitting for the Sith to find and make his prediction true.
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"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I'll do what I must"
"You will try"
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Darthbane2007
Registered:
Oct '07
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Date Posted:
4/13 3:34pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
- Date Edited:
4/13 3:41pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
Darthbane2007
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Darth Dane posted:
Qui-Gon Jinn, says to Anakin's mother that if he had been born in the republic he would have been identified early.
Why wasn't Palpatine identified as a child, didn't he come from Naboo?
When Palpatine is fighting Mace, is he actually losing the fight, or is the fight according to his design, in order for Anakin to come and rescue him?
My guess is that he waited for Anakin, because he says "I'm weak, I'm so weak". And then right
after Anakin blocks Mace, he says "Power. Unlimited power".
1st Question: There is some speculation on this. Some say that Palpatine wasn't born on naboo but some outer rim planet or something. My opinion is that maybe his parents were going to give him to the Jedi Order at an early age, but Plageius came first and possibly killed them, and took Palpatine for himself.
2nd Question: I am not authorized to answer that question..
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SaberSlash
Registered:
Apr '08
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Date Posted:
4/14 9:18pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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1. I assume that Plageus identified Palpatine before the Jedi did. One of those unanswered questions.
2. I think Palpatine was overconfident and underestimated the fight Mace presented and was caught off-guard when the window was shattered (The book talks about the Shatterpoint angle quite well). While Palpatine is very powerful, I think his physical power is given too much credit by everyone. He greatest strength is his stealth and ability to manipulate those around him to do his bidding. That is what truly makes him more dangerous as compared to the previous Sithlords. Mace disarmed him unexpectantly, but Palpatine immediately used his position of weakness to his advantage once he knew Anakin was in the room.
Plus, Lucas said in the Sith commentary that everyone loses a saber fight. I think Mace is sometimes not given the proper credit that he deserves. Lucas chose to make him a powerful character because he symbolizes the top jedi standard. Beides, Yoda, Mace is the leader of the Order and considered the best of the best in the era. Plain and simple, his death represented the end of the jedi era. IMO, if Palps threw the fight to Mace, that undermines the theory that the Sith needed to stay in hiding for all those years if top Jedi could be so easily toyed with.
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DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR
Registered:
Jun '02
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Date Posted:
4/15 4:17pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
- Date Edited:
4/15 4:19pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
DARTHVENGERDARTHSEAR
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Master_Starwalker posted:
Darth Dane posted:
Palp_Faction posted:
The answer to the first question is cloaked in mystery. Perhaps he was raised a Sith from an early age, perhaps he was born outside the Republic. Who knows.
Well accordig to http://www.starwars.com/databank/character/palpatine/index.html he can be traced back to Naboo.
That doesn't mean he was born on Naboo though, merely that it was his homeworld. The databank says Anakin wasn't born on Tatooine and yet it lists it as his homeworld.
That's true. I wasn't born in America, but I lived here all my life which is long enough to feel American.
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Sidious69
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
4/16 3:08pm
Subject:
RE: A few questions regarding Palpatine
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Mace vs. Palpatine:
C'mon! all the dialogue suggests that Palpatine has set all this up. He was faking!!
This whole duel is set-up to finally turn Anakin and to have a legitimate reason to the Senate for the Jedi purge and for becoming an Empire.
People tend to forget that Anakin has turned down Palpatine's offer and reported him to the Jedi.
And before this duel, Palpatine never had a valid reason to execute Order 66 even though the clones would have done it anytime he wanted.
This whole duel is as staged as his own kidnapping. The whole Palpatine persona is a fake.
He's been telling Anakin that the Jedi were plotting to take over and betray the Chancellor and if the Jedi destroy him any chance of saving Padme would be lost.
And guess what happened in this duel?? Everything that Palpatine said to Anakin has came true in front of Anakin and he has to choose.
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