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Topic:
Why do the Sith follow the rule of two?
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DarthDuckie
Registered:
Jan '04
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Date Posted:
5/7 8:27pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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It does seem like a contradiction of sorts doesn't it? I guess the alternative is extinction.
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Sidious69
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
5/9 5:38pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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To me Sidious was not a sith lord, he did not follow the sith code either. Most sith would attack their master and engage them in a duel. Sidious like the weakling he is killed his master in his sleep. The sith believe victory is only possible by showing superiority over your enemy. Sidious destroyed the jedi order, through a well-constructed plan, likely his master's, however it was not in the tradition of the sith.
Weakling???
From killing 3 Jedi Masters ON THE COUNCIL in seconds to obliterating Mace after using him to finally turn Anakin and frame the Jedi Order, Sidious is one of the most powerful Sith Lords ever.
Even the most powerful Jedi, Yoda, was not powerful enough to defeat him.
Stop confusing him with his weakling disguise called Palpatine. Which is all an act to control the populace.
His lightsaber skills is on the highest level with Yoda, Vader (Pre-suit), and Mace confirmed by Nick Gillard.
If that's weak, then we obviously have wrong definitions of that word.
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rumsmuggler
Registered:
Aug '00
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Date Posted:
5/9 6:26pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
- Date Edited:
5/9 6:33pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
rumsmuggler
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Treachery is the way of the Sith.
Anyways, Palps was known to be the most powerful Sith Lord ever. Killing his master while he slept is smart. If Darth Plagueis was foolish enough to fall asleep and not to sense anything out of the ordinary, then he deserved to die.
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" Conan, what's best in life?" " Crush your enemies, see them driven before you and hear the lamentations of the women."
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"Why is the rum always gone?"
Retcons = making the dumb stuff look even dumber.
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EmeraldBlade
Registered:
Apr '08
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Date Posted:
5/9 8:55pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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Nichtganz posted:
To me Sidious was not a sith lord, he did not follow the sith code either. Most sith would attack their master and engage them in a duel. Sidious like the weakling he is killed his master in his sleep. The sith believe victory is only possible by showing superiority over your enemy. Sidious destroyed the jedi order, through a well-constructed plan, likely his master's, however it was not in the tradition of the sith.
1) You are getting that from a lame Sith Academy teacher, are you not?
OK.
2) Treachery is the way of the Sith. Therefore, he did show complete superiority over his Master.
As for the "tradition of the Sith"... please.
Did you expect him to walk into the Jedi temple and kill everyone?
If he tried that, he would be dead - just like any other Sith.
3) If he is not a Sith and you are correct (which I do not believe for one minute), he is better than a Sith.
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EmeraldBlade
Registered:
Apr '08
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Date Posted:
5/9 8:58pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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Sidious69 posted:
Weakling???
From killing 3 Jedi Masters ON THE COUNCIL in seconds to obliterating Mace after using him to finally turn Anakin and frame the Jedi Order, Sidious is one of the most powerful Sith Lords ever.
Even the most powerful Jedi, Yoda, was not powerful enough to defeat him.
Stop confusing him with his weakling disguise called Palpatine. Which is all an act to control the populace.
Well said.
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Formerly the poster known as AnakinSucks
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Nichtganz
Registered:
Jul '07
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Date Posted:
5/9 9:16pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
- Date Edited:
5/9 9:20pm (3 edits total)
Edited By:
Nichtganz
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EmeraldBlade posted:
Nichtganz posted:
To me Sidious was not a sith lord, he did not follow the sith code either. Most sith would attack their master and engage them in a duel. Sidious like the weakling he is killed his master in his sleep. The sith believe victory is only possible by showing superiority over your enemy. Sidious destroyed the jedi order, through a well-constructed plan, likely his master's, however it was not in the tradition of the sith.
1) You are getting that from a lame Sith Academy teacher, are you not?
Tales of the Jedi, perhaps you should read it.
Did you expect him to walk into the Jedi temple and kill everyone?
If he tried that, he would be dead - just like any other Sith.
If he's the greatest sith lord, then yes i do expect him to since the Ancient sith could wipe out the jedi like somone who was born with gonads. Here's a short list of assholes that coulve strolled up in the Jedi temple with any chance of winning.
Ludo Kressh
Naga Sadow
Darth Nihilus
Darth Sion
Darth Traya
Tulak Hord
possibly Darth Revan
more could do in much the same fashion.
3) If he is not a Sith and you are correct (which I do not believe for one minute), he is better than a Sith.
a Sith Acolyte perhaps.
Weakling???
Indeed.
From killing 3 Jedi Masters ON THE COUNCIL in seconds to obliterating Mace after using him to finally turn Anakin and frame the Jedi Order.
three jedi, blimey thats alot, and
mace tap danced on palpys face...
Stop confusing him with his weakling disguise called Palpatine. Which is all an act to control the populace.
Crappy politician, even worse sith lord.
His lightsaber skills is on the highest level with Yoda, Vader (Pre-suit), and Mace confirmed by Nick Gillard.
If that's weak, then we obviously have wrong definitions of that word.
His skills were still far behind that of the sith and jedi of the Hyperspace wars.
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Ib'tuur jatne tuur ash'ad kyr'amur.
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LemmingLord
Title: PT Manager & CLUE Host
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
5/9 10:04pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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In my happy lemminglord edition of events transpiring in ROTS, Sideous kills the jedi with his lightning and when Mace comes for him, Anakin is right there to block the light saber blade just as he does later to stop Luke's blade.
But back on topic - the PT says that there are always two, it doesn't say WHY it is the case. I prefer to think of the Yoda dialog on the matter as a jedi prophecy and not some kind of rule that the Sith follow.
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LemmingLord
Take a Leap of Faith and Follow Me
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EmeraldBlade
Registered:
Apr '08
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Date Posted:
5/9 10:24pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
- Date Edited:
5/9 10:25pm (1 edits total)
Edited By:
EmeraldBlade
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"If he's the greatest sith lord, then yes i do expect him to since the Ancient sith could wipe out the jedi like somone who was born with gonads. Here's a short list of assholes that coulve strolled up in the Jedi temple with any chance of winning"
Nichtganz.
This is ridiculous in my opinion, but regardless it is purely EU material.
I have seen plenty of EU "versus" debates in my time, and anyone that does not think that Sidious is the greatest and most powerful Sith of all time is laughed off the forum, if not banned for misrepresenting facts.
At any rate, this is not the place to discuss it.
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Nichtganz
Registered:
Jul '07
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Date Posted:
5/10 5:46am
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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Thats because people here have the same Patriotic boner effect that people on IMDB get when Saving Private Ryan is broughten up.
There is a diffrence between fact and faction, i suggest you learn it.
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Sidious69
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
5/10 5:55am
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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Ok Nichtganz,
I'm not talking about the EU Sith lords. Because I haven't read anyone of them. So i'll take your word for it.
But in the movies however, It's been stated that Darth Sidious is in fact the MOST POWERFUL MASTER OF THE DARK SIDE.
ANd as for Mace dancing on his face, I don't think so.
That whole DUEL was a SET-UP to finally turn Anakin and to have a valid reason for Order 66.
Peole tend to forget that Anakin has TURNDED DOWN PALPY'S OFFER.
IT WAS ANAKIN who reported him to the Jedi.
Just like his own KIDNAPPING is a SET-UP. YOu really don't think General Greivous is powerful enough to manhandle and kidnap Palpatine do you??
He's been telling Anakin that the Jedi were planning to betray Palpatine and take over. His last words to Anakin before Ani entered was "You do know don't you? If the Jedi DESTROY me any chance of saving her will be lost."
And BEHOLD, Palpatine was about to be destroyed by a Jedi who was not following the Jedi way.
And when he finally got Anakin, then BOOM!! POWER!!! UNLIMITED POWER!!!!
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skyysoblue
Registered:
Jul '05
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Date Posted:
5/10 7:34am
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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The power which the master has over the apprentice feeds into the ego of the Sith. Getting Anakin to betray everyone, kill the Jedi, etc etc was a powerful rush for Palpatine.
As far as the threat of the apprentice turning on the master, do not forget the rule "keep your friends close and your enemies closer"
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
5/10 11:50am
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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Sidious69 posted:
ANd as for Mace dancing on his face, I don't think so.
That whole DUEL was a SET-UP to finally turn Anakin
George Lucas has said that Mace overpowered Palpatine in the lightsaber battle.
That's all, folks.
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"You either die a hero or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain." - Harvey Dent
There simply is no good reason to smack down the ambiguity.
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Sidious69
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
5/10 12:52pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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Yes GL did say that on the commentary.
But he could just be stating what's going on at that scene or GL has contradicted his own script.
Even Wookieepedia is going either way with it.
BUT You still can't deny that this whole duel was a set-up.
On the novel it even states that Palpatine has sensed Anakin before entering and he was even taping the whole confrontation for the senate.
He knows he has to look like he was the one getting attacked to finally turn Anakin and to have a valid reason to the senate for the Jedi purge and an Empire.
Everything he was saying to Anakin before that duel has happened.
COINCIDENCE????
Here's the script:
Enter Anakin.
PALPATINE: Anakin! I told you it would come to this. I was right. The Jedi are taking over.
PALPATINE: Anakin, you know I'm not able to rely on the Jedi Council. If they haven't included you in their plot, they soon will.
ANAKIN: I'm not sure I understand.
PALPATINE: You must sense what I have come to suspect . . . the Jedi Council want control of the Republic . . . they're planning to betray me.
ANAKIN: I am going to turn you over to the Jedi Council.
PALPATINE: Of course you should. But you're not sure of their intentions, are you?
ANAKIN: I will quickly discover the truth of all this.
MACE WlNDU: The oppression of the Sith will never return. You have lost.
PALPATINE: No! No! You will die!
PALPATINE raises his hands, and lightning bolts shoot out. They are blocked by MACE's lightsaber. PALPATINE is pushed back against the window sill.
PALPATINE: He is a traitor!
MACE WlNDU: He's the traitor. Aarrrrggghhhhh!
PALPATINE: I have the power to save the one you love, you must choose.
MACE WlNDU: Don't listen to him, Anakin.
PALPATINE: Don't let him kill me.
PALPATINE: (V.O.) You do know, don't you, if the Jedi destroy me, any chance of saving her will be lost.
PALPATINE: I can't hold on any longer. I am weak ... I am too weak. Anakin Help me, help me! I can't hold on any longer.
MACE WlNDU: I am going to end this once and for all.
ANAKIN: You can't. He must stand trial.
PALPATINE: The Sith and the Jedi are similar in almost every way.
MACE WlNDU: He has control over the Senate and the Courts. He is too dangerous to be kept alive.
PALPATINE: You did well, Anakin. He was too dangerous to be kept alive.
PALPATINE: I'm too weak. Don't kill me. Please.
ANAKIN: It is not the Jedi way.
ANAKIN: Yes, but he was an unarmed prisoner. I shouldn't have done that. It's not the Jedi way.
MACE raises his sword to kill the CHANCELLOR.
ANAKIN: (continuing) He must live . . .
PALPATINE: Please don't, please don't . . .
ANAKIN: I need him . . .
PALPATINE: Please don't . . .
ANAKIN: NO!!!
Just as MACE is about to slash PALPATINE, ANAKIN steps in and cuts off the Jedi's hand holding the lightsaber.
As MACE stares at ANAKIN in shock, PALPATINE springs to life.
The full force of Palpatine's powerful Bolts blasts MACE. He attempts to deflect them with his one good hand, but the force is too great. As blue rays engulf his body, he is flung out the window and falls twenty stories to his death.
PALPATINE: Power! Unlimited power!
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
5/10 1:39pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
- Date Edited:
5/10 1:41pm (2 edits total)
Edited By:
Arawn_Fenn
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Why are you cutting-and-pasting and rearranging the script? And you LEFT OUT a big chunk of it... probably because it contradicts your position!
1. You don't fake a boot to the grill like that.
2. Lucas said that Mace overpowered Palpatine.
[Cliegg]Your argument's dead, son.[/Cliegg]
Sidious69 posted:
But he could just be stating what's going on at that scene
Uh, yeah. That's the idea. 
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"You either die a hero or you live long enough to see yourself become the villain." - Harvey Dent
There simply is no good reason to smack down the ambiguity.
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Sidious69
Registered:
May '04
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Date Posted:
5/10 2:00pm
Subject:
RE: Question about the Sith
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I cut and paste to show what is actually said BEFORE this staged duel and how it all fits together during the duel.
WHat did I leave out???
Every line was there when Anakin walked in. So what did I leave out??
It's all about ANakin's P.O.V.
And what he sees when he walked in was Mace with a lightsaber on top of a lightsaber less Chancellor. That's what Palpy has been saying all along.
Anakin never saw Palpatine do a spinning trick that killed his Jedi Masters in seconds.
It's all about the Jedi trying to take over and betraying the Chancellor.
Yeah, the super boot that made the Dark Lord of the Sith to SUDDENLY lose his agility and lightsaber coincidentaly ONLY to cower on the corner and guess what?? Here's ANI!!!
Of all the lightsaber duels, everybody has kicked everybody much harder than Mace's "Super KICK" and yet no one has lost their sabers But NOOOO The most powerful master of the Dark Side was done just like that.
And GL has said, well in this scene Palpatine was kidnapped by Grievous.
Yes he is stating that scene.
WAS PALPATINE REALLY KIDNAPPED????
HELL'S NO!!
It's as staged as his Mace duel.
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