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Topic:
*OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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xx_Anakin_xx
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
4/7 6:03pm
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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I just realized something watching ROTS again. I know where the scene failed now. When Anakin shouted to Mace: "Don't kill him! I need him," Right there. Mace totally ignored the statement and thinking on it, I don't see how he could. That has to be the most ridiculous thing for a Jedi to say - why would he NEED a Dark Lord of the Sith? I'm thinking Lucas should have had Mace ask as much - or have left that line out. 
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"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I'll do what I must"
"You will try"
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LemmingLord
Title: PT Manager & CLUE Host
Registered:
Apr '05
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Date Posted:
4/7 6:13pm
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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Or perhaps have Anakin knock Mace unconscious.... and THEN say "no, I need him..."
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LemmingLord
Take a Leap of Faith and Follow Me
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AnakinBrego
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
4/22 5:14am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
- Date Edited:
4/22 5:23am (3 edits total)
Edited By:
AnakinBrego
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What doesn't sit well with me is Anakin's justifaction that all the Jedi deserved to die! Why? Because they didn't recognize his talents and they didn't trust him? I think that if Anakin was to turn on the Jedi there should have been something more convincing, maybe a setup for only his eyes only by Palpatine they are evil. Not just Mace attampting to execute Palpatine, Mace explained gave Anakin a reasonable explanation to Anakin he was able to understand, yes the Sith are evil! From my understanding Anakin never really saw or was given a realistic justifaction that all the Jedi deserved to die. Anakin knew they weren't evil (he knew the Sith were evil), so when he betrays them it's a bit hard to believe it when he says they are. In my opinion it would of been better for the movie had Palpatine set up Anakin to witness a Jedi betrayal that anakin could believe that the Jedi are the evil ones, we'd have a more convincing turn.
I remember reading that Palpatine was fighting with Anakin's lightsaber against Mace because before reshoots Anakin was there when Mace arrived. Maybe there was a scene where Anakin turned on his fellow Jedi's, but it's just me wishing it's there on the cutting room floor.
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xx_Anakin_xx
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
4/22 5:22am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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That wasn't the reason (Mace)...the reason was that the Jedi had turned on the Republic and were plotting to take over. That is what Palpy told Anakin. He didn't believe it at first, but then Mace was there breaking the Jedi Code and trying to kill Palpatine instead of arrest him. The thing is, Anakin might have subconsciously realized that the Jedi would never do that, but he convinced himself it was true because he had his other motive in keeping Padme alive and the only person who had offered him a way to do that was Palpatine. Anakin went to Yoda first remember, and Yoda just told him to basically "get over it dude" - and Anakin didn't hang with that. So Anakin adopted the belief that the Jedi were trying to take over and rule the galaxy. In the end, he didn't trust either the Jedi OR Palpatine - his plan on Mustafar (as told to Padme) was to kill Palpatine and rule with her (as he had already killed the Jedi). But he needed Palpatine alive until he learned the power to keep people from dying. That was the greed Lucas referred to: Anakin wanted power above all to keep those alive he loved and make things go as he wanted them to. It was greed driven by love and compassion, but greed nonetheless and he obsessed over it to the point where it ended up destroying everything he was trying to save.
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"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I'll do what I must"
"You will try"
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AnakinBrego
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
4/22 5:32am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
- Date Edited:
4/22 5:54am (9 edits total)
Edited By:
AnakinBrego
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To tell you the truth I never got the message in the film that the Jedi went bad, in plotting to take over. What I understood in the movie was that the Jedi were removing a corrupt politician. I never got that Anakin was convinced of the jedi were plotting to take over. More like a justifaction later on to convince himself, deluding himself that the Jedi were bad and the Sith were good, but he really knew otherwise. Anakin's just pathetic!
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PMT99
Registered:
Nov '00
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Date Posted:
4/22 8:53am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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AnakinBrego posted:
What doesn't sit well with me is Anakin's justifaction that all the Jedi deserved to die! Why? Because they didn't recognize his talents and they didn't trust him? I think that if Anakin was to turn on the Jedi there should have been something more convincing, maybe a setup for only his eyes only by Palpatine they are evil. Not just Mace attampting to execute Palpatine, Mace explained gave Anakin a reasonable explanation to Anakin he was able to understand, yes the Sith are evil! From my understanding Anakin never really saw or was given a realistic justifaction that all the Jedi deserved to die. Anakin knew they weren't evil (he knew the Sith were evil), so when he betrays them it's a bit hard to believe it when he says they are. In my opinion it would of been better for the movie had Palpatine set up Anakin to witness a Jedi betrayal that anakin could believe that the Jedi are the evil ones, we'd have a more convincing turn.
Anakin's justification for wanting the Jedi dead has more to do with their lack of compassion towards him. The Jedi have doubted Anakin too much since he first came into their temple and he can sense it. When it came to the "Anakin's mom is still a slave" situation, the Jedi haven't done anything to help her. Plus, The Jedi have ignored Anakin's mental problems (even when Yoda sensed his pain over his mother's death) and they wouldn't give Anakin the support system that he needed, hence why he goes to Palpatine for that. Anyone who feels ignored or left out will tend to lash their anger out upon the whole world and in Anakin's case, his anger got the entire Jedi Order killed.
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Eternity85
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
4/28 6:48am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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The Jedi Order needed to change, and i dont think they would have been able to do that if they had not been destroyed. Its a tough lesson, and tragic, but it was probably the only way.
After the rain comes the sun...
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Live life as if your were to die tomorrow. Learn as if you were to live forever.
- Gandhi
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xx_Anakin_xx
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
4/29 12:57pm
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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The Jedi Council wasn't bad, they were just archaic, stuck in their old ways, clouded in their vision by the dark side, careless with their "chosen one" and showed too much distrust, disatisfaction and lack of understanding toward Anakin. He merited special attention because they broke their own rules in allowing him to come in too late, saddled with attachments, prone to anger, fear and ready hatred of things he didn't like. So they pretty much blew it. Anakin was very vulnerable to the lure of the dark side from the beginning and they either failed to see it or saw it and made horrific decisions on what to do about it.
Then they made their hugest error; after all of the improper raising of Jedi Anakin, they treated him as if he were just like any other Jedi and expected things to just "work out". 
So yeah, the Jedi spawned their own doom by their mistakes. Anakin made the choice of the dark side over the side they were trying to get him to follow - that was his own doing, but based on his background, the circumstances and his character - much of which was heavily influenced by the council's lack of due care.
-----signature-----
"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I'll do what I must"
"You will try"
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AnakinBrego
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
5/28 2:52am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
- Date Edited:
5/28 2:55am (2 edits total)
Edited By:
AnakinBrego
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Anakin: "What have I done?”
Palpatine: “You’re fulfilling your destiny, Anakin. Become my new apprentice. Learn to use the dark side of the Force. It is the only way to save Padme."
Anakin: “I pledge myself to your teachings.”
Palpatine: “Good, good. The Force is strong with you. A powerful Sith you will become. Henceforth you shall be known as Darth…Vader.”
Anakin: “Thank you, my Master.”
Palpatine: “Rise.”
I think the scene flows better this way.
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xx_Anakin_xx
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
6/7 12:13am
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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well I just re-watched AOTC and man I love that movie - but I was watching this time to really try to gauge Anakin headed for the dark side and you know, for all of the clues; his anger, the tuskins, his marriage, etc., GL actually did also show a heck of a lot of Anakin the classic Jedi. I was pretty surprised because for some reason my memory of it in between watching seems to render it darker than it really was. I've seen it zillons of times, but this time I actually came away liking Padme a lot more, dunno why - but I'd forgotten how much she drove their romance and I guess I saw her strength more for some reason. Anyway, now it is for some reason sitting better with me that Anakin would go to the dark side to save her. Certain lines popped out at me - when they were at the diner and he told her that his Jedi oath kept him from those he loved (meaning her), it was also evident that it was not just Padme, but his mum and also Obi-Wan because he could love him all he wanted, but showing attachment and affection is out of the question, so he may as well have not had Obi-Wan close either. Anyway, AOTC is actually a perfect lead in into ROTS and the fall if you look for the darkness, because it is not that evident and it does show that Anakin is growing into a state of greediness when it comes to those he loves. As an aside, it was kick to watch R2 and CP30 meet up for the first time, when you think of it in terms of the whole saga, and even the EU, while watching that scene, it is actually way wicked. Anyway, everytime I watch I come away feeling a little different, and this time it is with a new sense of Anakin's turn being a little more realistic than before.
-----signature-----
"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I'll do what I must"
"You will try"
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Arawn_Fenn
Registered:
Jul '04
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Date Posted:
6/7 3:55pm
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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R2 and 3PO met in TPM.
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The world will look up and shout, "Save us." And I'll whisper: "No". - Rorschach
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xx_Anakin_xx
Registered:
Jan '08
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Date Posted:
6/7 6:39pm
Subject:
RE: *OFFICIAL THREAD* Anakin's Turn to the Darkside.
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Oh yeah! LoL...have to watch that again too, it was also pretty kick. But I guess because it was their first mission, the other just flew from my mind... tx for the reminder (that I'm getting old
-----signature-----
"Only a Sith deals in absolutes. I'll do what I must"
"You will try"
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